[00:00.000 --> 00:13.000]  You're listening to the Liberty Beat. Your daily source for Liberty news and activist updates, online at TheLibertyBeat.com.
[00:13.000 --> 00:29.000]  John Bush here with your Liberty Beat for Thursday, August 15th, 2013. Gold opened today at $1,326, silver at $21.82, and Bitcoin is trading at $97.39.
[00:29.000 --> 00:35.000]  Support for the Liberty Beat comes from Brave New Books, Austin's only brick-and-mortar store, carrying Teeny Tangerine 2.0.
[00:35.000 --> 00:40.000]  In Austin, at 1904 Guadalupe Street, or online at BraveNewBooks.com.
[00:40.000 --> 00:50.000]  And from Combo Bobs, the first high-fructose corn syrup-free quick-serve restaurant in the country, serving Baja California-style burritos and non-GMO corn tortillas and chips.
[00:50.000 --> 00:57.000]  In Austin, at 500 East Ben White Boulevard, or by phone at 512-432-1111.
[00:57.000 --> 01:06.000]  And now the news. On Wednesday afternoon, Bradley Manning's defense rested after calling a number of witnesses, including Manning's aunt Deborah and sister Casey.
[01:06.000 --> 01:13.000]  Manning himself gave a statement apologizing for hurting the United States and for unintended consequences of his actions.
[01:13.000 --> 01:20.000]  He also told Colonel Lind that he realized after having much self-reflection, he should have worked within the system to achieve change.
[01:20.000 --> 01:28.000]  For most of the afternoon, the defense attempted to portray Manning as idealistic and naive, at one point stating that he was stuck in post-adolescent idealism.
[01:28.000 --> 01:33.000]  The defense also detailed Manning's experience growing up with abusive alcoholic parents.
[01:33.000 --> 01:39.000]  The prosecution spent their time questioning Manning's empathy and painting him as unsympathetic to his fellow soldiers.
[01:39.000 --> 01:50.000]  Manning is currently facing life in military prison. Colonel Lind is expected to rule on final sentencing early next week.
[01:50.000 --> 02:03.000]  Police accountability activists from all around the country are descending on Austin, Texas this week for the upcoming Peaceful Streets Project Police Accountability Summit this Saturday from 10 a.m. to 4 p.m. at the AT&T Executive Conference Center on UT campus.
[02:03.000 --> 02:15.000]  Among those scheduled to speak are Pete Ayer of CopBlock.org and Jacob Crawford of WeCopWatch.org who are currently embarking on a police accountability tour that will take them all throughout the U.S. and even to South Africa.
[02:15.000 --> 02:21.000]  Their first stop, Austin, Texas. We caught up with Pete who filled us in on the goal of the police accountability tour.
[02:21.000 --> 02:30.000]  Right now there's existing CopWatch groups in a lot of towns that aren't as much online and there's a lot of CopBlock and Peaceful Streets groups bringing up all over the place.
[02:30.000 --> 02:36.000]  I think when people connect, when we can focus on our comparative advantages and, you know, we'll look out for each other, we can accomplish a lot.
[02:36.000 --> 02:39.000]  So I think it's very timely.
[02:39.000 --> 02:45.000]  To learn more about their efforts or to support their journey, visit CopBlock.org slash tour.
[02:45.000 --> 02:52.000]  Support for the Liberty Beat comes from Carmacazi Productions, specializing in high quality audio recording and video production for the Liberty Movement,
[02:52.000 --> 03:00.000]  online at Carmacazi.tv and from Central Texas Gunworks, CHL courses, self-defense training and firearm sales.
[03:22.000 --> 03:46.000]  OK, this is Randy Kelton, Debra Stevens, Rule of Law Radio.
[03:46.000 --> 03:54.000]  This is our Friday night four hour info marathon and we're starting something new tonight.
[03:54.000 --> 04:02.000]  We have a special guest and co-host Joe Esquivel is going to be with us tonight.
[04:02.000 --> 04:12.000]  We're going to spend the first two hours talking about Joe's specialty, which is loan securitization.
[04:12.000 --> 04:26.000]  Anybody out there who has a mortgage that they have secured since the repeal of the Glass-Steagall Act 1999 forward,
[04:26.000 --> 04:29.000]  you will find this most interesting.
[04:29.000 --> 04:42.000]  And actually even loans that were written before the repeal of the Glass-Steagall Act and the lifting of the restrictions against derivatives,
[04:42.000 --> 04:50.000]  those loans, even though they weren't initially intended to be securitized once the door opened, they flooded those in there too.
[04:50.000 --> 05:01.000]  So if you have a mortgage in the last 20 years or so, you might want to pay real close attention to this.
[05:01.000 --> 05:10.000]  Hello, Joe. Hi, Randy. How are you doing today? I am doing well and I don't care what everybody says.
[05:10.000 --> 05:20.000]  Okay. And about the callers, we are going to do about an hour just as an introduction.
[05:20.000 --> 05:31.000]  Joe will do an introduction of what he does and then we will take calls in the first, in the second hour on securitization specifically.
[05:31.000 --> 05:41.000]  But as we have people who have interests other than securitization, in the third hour we will take calls on anything.
[05:41.000 --> 05:54.000]  So with that said, Joe, will you kind of give us an overview of why someone with a consumer residential mortgage
[05:54.000 --> 06:05.000]  should even care about whether or not their note was securitized and why they care about chain of title?
[06:05.000 --> 06:19.000]  Well, we're going to have to start with the basics. Everything that is associated with your property all reverts to title.
[06:19.000 --> 06:28.000]  Randy, there was a point in time where myself included, I thought it was about ownership.
[06:28.000 --> 06:39.000]  I own this. And the banks would say, no, I own this. And it really has nothing to do with ownership at all.
[06:39.000 --> 06:52.000]  Because the documents that we've signed since the conception of the loan all had to do about rights.
[06:52.000 --> 07:00.000]  When we start this process that we talk about securitization, it's nothing new.
[07:00.000 --> 07:10.000]  Securitization has been around for decades. As a matter of fact, we've got everything from auto leases.
[07:10.000 --> 07:18.000]  We've got credit cards. We have leasing of fleet vehicles.
[07:18.000 --> 07:33.000]  I think I came up with, I sat down one time and I found about 70 to 85 different forms of financial items that were being securitized.
[07:33.000 --> 07:40.000]  So securitization itself is not a bad thing when done correctly.
[07:40.000 --> 07:53.000]  So the question becomes, was it done correctly? Hell no. It was not done correctly.
[07:53.000 --> 08:03.000]  Yes, from what I've seen and I will admit very quickly that securitization is not my area of research.
[08:03.000 --> 08:13.000]  I know a little bit about it, but just enough to be dangerous. But from my looking at the mortgage issue,
[08:13.000 --> 08:32.000]  securitization itself seemed to be okay, but residential mortgages just did not seem to lend themselves to the way that the securities were normally bought and sold and transferred.
[08:32.000 --> 08:48.000]  And the money changers tried to stuff the residential mortgages into this securitization process and it seems like it was not a good fit.
[08:48.000 --> 09:03.000]  And you're so right. Now, one of the interesting things when it comes to residential mortgages is that prior to the repeal of the Glass-Steagall Act,
[09:03.000 --> 09:21.000]  a lot of the mortgages that were done were done in a timely fashion. It was done correct. Prior to the creation of MERS, which is Mortgage Electronic Registration Systems,
[09:21.000 --> 09:35.000]  which is a national electronic registry, which have private membership of which you and I are not members of, things did run different.
[09:35.000 --> 09:48.000]  And the reason was because the proper parties were getting their due. And when I say the proper parties, I'm referring to the counties.
[09:48.000 --> 09:55.000]  And then when we refer to the counties, we refer to the people that the counties employed.
[09:55.000 --> 10:09.000]  And yes, it did not happen overnight. It took an average of from 90 to 120 days for a loan to be correctly securitized.
[10:09.000 --> 10:23.000]  So that would be going from at closing, they would be taking the docs, and the minute they were signed, the next business day they would be sent to the county recorder's office.
[10:23.000 --> 10:33.000]  These documents would be either a deed of trust or a mortgage, or if you're in the state of Georgia, it'd be a security deed.
[10:33.000 --> 10:45.000]  And when it went into the county recorder's office, it was recorded, indexed, and filed, and then sent back to the lender.
[10:45.000 --> 10:56.000]  And at this time, should have the lender decided that he wished to sell it, he would sell the tangible promissory note,
[10:56.000 --> 11:08.000]  the promise to pay, which was the intangible obligation, and assign its interest in the security interest of the security instrument.
[11:08.000 --> 11:17.000]  I'm sorry. Again, this was done time after time between party A to party B, party B to party C.
[11:17.000 --> 11:30.000]  So at all times given, the chain of endorsements matched the chain of title that was shown into public record.
[11:30.000 --> 11:44.000]  Now, I know it was not perfect, but I can tell you this, Randy. I looked at a set of documents a couple of weeks ago, and the documents were done in 1998.
[11:44.000 --> 11:51.000]  And there were multiple endorsements on the note. There were multiple assignments.
[11:51.000 --> 12:08.000]  And from the time of conception of the loan, to the sponsor, to the trustee, now, yes, they did miss a depositor, but there was about 123 days.
[12:08.000 --> 12:19.000]  There were three assignments. There were three endorsements. So no, did it hit the correct number of days that were required? No.
[12:19.000 --> 12:31.000]  Was it within a 90-day window? It was 123 days. So they were making more of an effort to do it.
[12:31.000 --> 12:43.000]  Let me, why is that important? Why do we care where the note went from one person to another, to another, to another?
[12:43.000 --> 12:50.000]  Why do we care about that when we look in the court record of the county registrar's office?
[12:50.000 --> 13:08.000]  Well, because going back decades, going back even centuries, the county or the register was where title was kept.
[13:08.000 --> 13:21.000]  That was where it was noticed because going back to King Arthur, right, when you had to pay taxes, they had to go to the owner of the lands.
[13:21.000 --> 13:32.000]  So the county recorder's office was where the owner of title to that property was kept.
[13:32.000 --> 13:45.000]  Okay. So if I wanted to purchase a piece of property or if I wanted to give a guy a loan and take a claim against his property as collateral,
[13:45.000 --> 13:59.000]  then I could go to look in that record and I could tell who for sure was the proper holder of the rights to the property.
[13:59.000 --> 14:06.000]  And I could tell if there were any claims against that property that would supersede mine. Is that, am I understanding that correct?
[14:06.000 --> 14:21.000]  Pretty much. Let's take it a step further. If you were a contractor and you came and worked at my house and I didn't pay you,
[14:21.000 --> 14:34.000]  you would go file a mechanics lien against me saying, Randy Kelton is owed money from Joe Esquivel and you would file this into public record
[14:34.000 --> 14:45.000]  and you would have a lien on my property. And I could not do anything until this lien was taken care of.
[14:45.000 --> 14:54.000]  So if I was looking at incurring a debt, like you call me over and say, okay, Randy, I want you to build me a porch on the back of this property.
[14:54.000 --> 15:00.000]  But I don't have the money to pay you. I want to pay you out. I'm going to say, okay, well, if you do that,
[15:00.000 --> 15:05.000]  I'm going to want a mechanics lien and materials man's lien against your property.
[15:05.000 --> 15:13.000]  But before I do that, I want to make sure that there's not another lien standing in front of me.
[15:13.000 --> 15:22.000]  So I'm going to go down to the county record and look at it and see what's already there. I should be able to trust what's in there.
[15:22.000 --> 15:30.000]  Nobody should have a claim against that property that I can't see right there in the record.
[15:30.000 --> 15:31.000]  Correct.
[15:31.000 --> 15:33.000]  Is that okay?
[15:33.000 --> 15:46.000]  That's very correct. So this is why it is so important. If you have a mortgage or if you have a deed of trust,
[15:46.000 --> 15:58.000]  you should have the peace of mind to be able to go down to your local county recorder's office and look into public record and see what is filed
[15:58.000 --> 16:09.000]  and have a sense of knowing that those records are true and correct and you can count on those records.
[16:09.000 --> 16:17.000]  Unfortunately, that's not working today. Not at all.
[16:17.000 --> 16:34.000]  Today, we have that electronic registry called MERS that has taken over the United States and has not used the county recorder's office.
[16:34.000 --> 16:37.000]  But we're getting ready for a break.
[16:37.000 --> 16:42.000]  So we will address that and we will continue after the break.
[16:42.000 --> 16:50.000]  Okay. This is Randy Kelton, Deborah Stevens, Wheel of Law Radio. Our call-in number, 512-646-1984.
[16:50.000 --> 17:13.000]  We have about three callers online and as soon as we finish this first hour, then we'll go to callers on the subject we'll be writing.
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[18:49.000 --> 19:01.000]  That's ruleoflawradio.com or email m-i-c-h-a-e-l-m-i-r-r-a-s at yahoo.com to learn how to stop debt collectors now.
[19:01.000 --> 19:11.000]  You are listening to the Logos Radio Network, logosradio.com.
[19:31.000 --> 19:36.000]  I see justice, yeah.
[19:36.000 --> 19:44.000]  The world is spinning like it's out of control, on the edge of a hole, inside a deep dark hole.
[19:44.000 --> 19:51.000]  I'm always going to look out for something to soothe my soul.
[19:51.000 --> 19:56.000]  So I sit back and I watch the evidence unfold.
[19:56.000 --> 20:02.000]  And I see justice, it's a goal.
[20:02.000 --> 20:10.000]  Yeah, I see justice, it's a goal.
[20:10.000 --> 20:13.000]  Because we fell a little too far at sea.
[20:13.000 --> 20:16.000]  And then we got to get back on course, we will see.
[20:16.000 --> 20:19.000]  There is a world of heavy advisory.
[20:19.000 --> 20:26.000]  Okay, this is Randy Kelton, Deborah Stevens, Rule of Law Radio. We're having way too much fun on the break.
[20:26.000 --> 20:33.000]  Okay, we were here with Joe Esquivel, our newest host on the network.
[20:33.000 --> 20:40.000]  He will be co-hosting with me on the first hour of the four-hour info marathon.
[20:40.000 --> 20:49.000]  So we were talking about securitization and the effect, the purpose of the county clerk.
[20:49.000 --> 20:51.000]  Okay, Joe, will you pick it up?
[20:51.000 --> 20:52.000]  Sure. All right.
[20:52.000 --> 21:02.000]  So like I was talking earlier, the county clerk's recorder's office is where they record documents.
[21:02.000 --> 21:14.000]  Now, they are obligated to record just about anything that is brought to their attention that is true and accurate.
[21:14.000 --> 21:23.000]  Now, there are many times documents that are not filed of record that should have been filed.
[21:23.000 --> 21:27.000]  But that doesn't fall to the county recorder.
[21:27.000 --> 21:41.000]  So again, Randy, if you can interject, if you have anything regarding the county recorder's office for Texas as to the role of the county recorder,
[21:41.000 --> 21:48.000]  I believe that if I bring a document in, if it's true and accurate, that it will be recorded.
[21:48.000 --> 21:52.000]  So again, it gives constructive notice to the world.
[21:52.000 --> 21:55.000]  It lets the world know what is out there.
[21:55.000 --> 22:09.000]  So let's go back now in time that prior to the repeal of the Glass-Steagall Act and the replacement of the Gramm-Leach-Bylee Act, that these transactions were taking place.
[22:09.000 --> 22:12.000]  They were done in a timely fashion.
[22:12.000 --> 22:26.000]  However, once President Clinton repealed the Glass-Steagall Act, Wall Street was allowed to work with Main Street.
[22:26.000 --> 22:36.000]  Now, the reserves that the banks needed to keep had changed.
[22:36.000 --> 22:44.000]  The banks could now acquire funds from other sources.
[22:44.000 --> 22:48.000]  This was a time of jubilee.
[22:48.000 --> 23:04.000]  We had everybody and anybody that could get a loan be approached by a banker, by a real estate person.
[23:04.000 --> 23:08.000]  Securitization has been around for a long time.
[23:08.000 --> 23:14.000]  It was made popular in the 70s by the Solomon Brothers.
[23:14.000 --> 23:15.000]  And no, they weren't real brothers.
[23:15.000 --> 23:19.000]  Solomon Brothers was an investment bank.
[23:19.000 --> 23:28.000]  But once this repeal took place, the gloves were off.
[23:28.000 --> 23:35.000]  The banks could just do willy-nilly just about anything that they had wanted.
[23:35.000 --> 23:39.000]  Loans were written to anybody.
[23:39.000 --> 23:42.000]  Now, the rules were still out there.
[23:42.000 --> 23:46.000]  There were still rules that were supposed to be followed.
[23:46.000 --> 23:54.000]  These rules go back all the way to the Negotiable Instruments Act of 1881.
[23:54.000 --> 24:06.000]  We had laws that were set up for the transactions of doing commerce.
[24:06.000 --> 24:09.000]  It hasn't changed much.
[24:09.000 --> 24:17.000]  The only difference is today it's been codified into what we call the Uniform Commercial Code.
[24:17.000 --> 24:32.000]  And each of the 50 states has their own version or their equivalents of this Uniform Commercial Code and the different rules that apply.
[24:32.000 --> 24:35.000]  But they all work hand in hand.
[24:35.000 --> 24:51.000]  So if you're in New York and you're using the UCC 1961 version versus you're in Texas and you've got a completely different version, they still work hand in hand.
[24:51.000 --> 25:01.000]  Many of the same statutes or their equivalents are used back and forth.
[25:01.000 --> 25:13.000]  Most of the states adopted the Uniform Commercial Code like Texas adopted the Uniform Commercial Code into the Business and Commerce Code.
[25:13.000 --> 25:24.000]  But if you look at the codes, they adopted the Uniform Code so that no matter what state you went to, the laws were basically the same.
[25:24.000 --> 25:28.000]  And then the individual states made some adjustments.
[25:28.000 --> 25:32.000]  But there are differences, but they're minor.
[25:32.000 --> 25:34.000]  Most of them are all the same.
[25:34.000 --> 25:48.000]  And mostly I just reference the Uniform Commercial Code as it has been codified into the codes of the particular state because they are so consistent.
[25:48.000 --> 26:14.000]  Correct. The interesting thing is that if you were to go back and you were to look at this Negotiable Instruments Act of 1881, the whole purpose of that act was to present a set of rules related to negotiable instruments that could be acted upon by any state.
[26:14.000 --> 26:29.000]  And Randy, you said this very well. If we're in Texas and we want to do business with somebody in California, we know what rules of law we're going to operate with.
[26:29.000 --> 26:55.000]  The only difference is once they repealed the Glass-Steagall Act, they actually, just prior to the creation of the Glass-Steagall Act in 1993, they started the creation of MERS, which was this electronic registry because greed had overtaken common sense.
[26:55.000 --> 27:19.000]  The time that it was taking to get the note, the mortgage, and the intangible payment obligation as the entire instrument from party A to party B to party C to party D was taking too much time in the bank size because they were hundreds of billions of dollars at stake.
[27:19.000 --> 27:39.000]  And for the bank, if they could push this through instead of taking 120 days and they could do it in 30 days, that's 90 days worth of billions of dollars of interest that they make.
[27:39.000 --> 27:55.000]  And once greed stuck its teeth in, it wasn't letting go. It wasn't letting go at all. Shortcuts were being done left and right.
[27:55.000 --> 28:20.000]  IRS even got in on the act. IRS said that there's a publication called the IRS Publication 938. Now this publication comes out quarterly and it is required that if you are going to do business in public,
[28:20.000 --> 28:32.000]  in a trust, in a remake, which is a real estate investment mortgage conduit, that you must be listed with the IRS Publication.
[28:32.000 --> 28:51.000]  And within that publication, you put the issuing trust name, you put the CUSEP number, you put the number of classes, and all of this must be done in a timely manner.
[28:51.000 --> 29:10.000]  In addition, until the assets are within the remake, upon the startup day, the remake does not exist. So we need to have a conveyance of assets.
[29:10.000 --> 29:28.000]  And that's very, very important. So we have a set timeframe that things are to happen. However, in the bank's view, they didn't have to abide by those rules.
[29:28.000 --> 29:45.000]  They could just do willy-nilly what they wanted to do. So for the banks, there was no timeframe. Okay, hang on. We're not getting the bumper music so loud, so we're about to go to break.
[29:45.000 --> 30:00.000]  This is Randy Kelton, Deborah Stevens, here with our new co-host, Joe Esquivel. Our call in number 512-646-1984. We'll be right back.
[30:00.000 --> 30:15.000]  Email is a convenient way to send and receive information, but it can also let advertisers snoop on you. Invisible web bugs and email messages could be monitoring your every click. I'm Dr. Catherine Albrecht, and I'll be back with more in just a moment.
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[31:20.000 --> 31:30.000]  I'm Dr. Catherine Albrecht. More news and information at CatherineAlbrecht.com.
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[31:43.000 --> 31:53.000]  Over 6,000 of my fellow service members have given their lives. Thousands of my fellow first responders are dying. I'm not a conspiracy theorist. I'm a structural engineer. I'm a New York City correctional. I'm an Air Force pilot.
[31:53.000 --> 32:00.000]  I'm a father who lost his son. We're Americans, and we deserve the truth. Go to RememberBuilding7.org today.
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[33:01.000 --> 33:14.000]  You're listening to the Logos Radio Network at logosradionetwork.com.
[33:14.000 --> 33:32.000]  Yeah, I got a warrant, and I'm going to solve them, to help government them, prosecute them. Okay. Okay.
[33:32.000 --> 33:50.000]  Okay, we are back. Randy Kelton, Dempsey Stevens, Rule of Law Radio.
[33:50.000 --> 33:57.000]  And we're here with Joe Esquivel on our Friday night info marathon.
[33:57.000 --> 34:02.000]  Okay, Joe, where were we when we were out? I was having too much fun on the break.
[34:02.000 --> 34:12.000]  We were talking about the Iris Publication 938 and why it was so important.
[34:12.000 --> 34:24.000]  And the reason for it was to put rules into place so we didn't have another Great Depression that we did in 1929.
[34:24.000 --> 34:30.000]  Now, I don't remember that depression, but I'm told it was very, very bad.
[34:30.000 --> 34:35.000]  So I'm kind of glad that there's rules in place.
[34:35.000 --> 34:41.000]  Now, what I'm not impressed with is that the banks aren't following the rules.
[34:41.000 --> 35:01.000]  Because in addition to IRS having their own set of rules, and for IRS that falls under Title 26, and if you go to Rule 860D, it tells what a remake is to do in order to acquire an asset.
[35:01.000 --> 35:05.000]  So we know what they're supposed to do.
[35:05.000 --> 35:19.000]  And in addition, if we were to go to the SEC, which is the Security Exchange Commission, they have rules that are in place as well.
[35:19.000 --> 35:24.000]  And they're supposed to work in conjunction with each other, Randy.
[35:24.000 --> 35:37.000]  And this is why you have what's called the 424B5 rule, in which a prospectus is to be given to the potential investors.
[35:37.000 --> 35:43.000]  And these prospectuses can range anywhere from 300 pages to over 1,000.
[35:43.000 --> 35:53.000]  It depends how complex and how much word crafting they could cram into one document.
[35:53.000 --> 36:04.000]  And it's kind of funny because when you're reading these prospectuses, and basically it's like a big cookbook.
[36:04.000 --> 36:13.000]  However, you read one sentence, Randy, and the sentence could be half a page.
[36:13.000 --> 36:18.000]  It is just a run-on paragraph that does not stop.
[36:18.000 --> 36:27.000]  And I believe the reason was for when the investors were to read it, they didn't know where they were starting, they didn't know when they were stopping.
[36:27.000 --> 36:37.000]  But it's in the rules that they were to have this prospectus, and this was to be given to the investors.
[36:37.000 --> 36:46.000]  And that prospectus contained the information as to how that trust were to operate.
[36:46.000 --> 36:55.000]  There was also a document called the PSA, the Pulling and Servicing Agreement.
[36:55.000 --> 37:03.000]  Now, this is a very important document, and it goes hand in hand with the 424B5 prospectus.
[37:03.000 --> 37:10.000]  And these can be found on the SEC website.
[37:10.000 --> 37:22.000]  So if anyone would care to do their own research and look up their PSA or look for their 424B5 prospectus, this is something that you can do.
[37:22.000 --> 37:27.000]  This is something I would encourage you to do.
[37:27.000 --> 37:34.000]  Now, yes, it takes a little bit of time to get used to working in there.
[37:34.000 --> 37:48.000]  But my goodness, once you get in and you start reading the documents, it blows your mind as to how much information is in there.
[37:48.000 --> 38:03.000]  When we're in the prospectus and we're looking at it, it has a plethora of education that one can only gasp at.
[38:03.000 --> 38:06.000]  There's dates.
[38:06.000 --> 38:09.000]  There's parties to the transactions.
[38:09.000 --> 38:16.000]  They tell the role of the parties who are to be in the transactions.
[38:16.000 --> 38:30.000]  They then give descriptions of what was to be done, when it was to be done, and what would happen when it was done.
[38:30.000 --> 38:41.000]  So this 424B5 prospectus and this pooling and servicing agreement play a very, very vital role.
[38:41.000 --> 38:53.000]  If we look at the prospectus and we start breaking down the index and we look at what date was it issued,
[38:53.000 --> 39:01.000]  because many times we will find that there is more than one prospectus supplement.
[39:01.000 --> 39:07.000]  There will be the initial prospectus, which is filed for the investors.
[39:07.000 --> 39:12.000]  And then as they would amend it, there would be prospectus supplements.
[39:12.000 --> 39:16.000]  And they're updated is all that it is.
[39:16.000 --> 39:23.000]  But the interesting thing is that it talks about governing law.
[39:23.000 --> 39:30.000]  Under what law will these documents be covered by?
[39:30.000 --> 39:38.000]  And this is important because while we're talking about your house, your mortgage,
[39:38.000 --> 39:49.000]  I as a homeowner, when I'm reading this prospectus of a trust that I've realized that my loan was supposed to be put into,
[39:49.000 --> 39:53.000]  now I know what law governs it.
[39:53.000 --> 39:58.000]  I've got this magic book in front of me with all this information.
[39:58.000 --> 40:02.000]  And yes, I'll be the first to agree it is a bit overwhelming.
[40:02.000 --> 40:05.000]  Okay. What law governs it?
[40:05.000 --> 40:12.000]  Now, I've looked at some of these and I see a lot that says it's governed under the state of New York.
[40:12.000 --> 40:14.000]  Is that what you're referring to?
[40:14.000 --> 40:16.000]  Correct.
[40:16.000 --> 40:23.000]  So it's like a state law that governs it or a federal law?
[40:23.000 --> 40:36.000]  Well, it will tell you within the majority, I'd say 90% of the trusts that are set up are governed by New York trust law.
[40:36.000 --> 40:45.000]  So there is actual state laws that regulate what is to be done.
[40:45.000 --> 40:55.000]  So if you're looking for a prospectus and you're in California and the prospectus says that it's governed by New York law,
[40:55.000 --> 41:01.000]  you can't apply California law to the trust. Is that correct?
[41:01.000 --> 41:10.000]  Correct. You would want to apply the laws in which your document for your trust was created in.
[41:10.000 --> 41:17.000]  So New York has some very specific trust law, very specific.
[41:17.000 --> 41:29.000]  And it says any conveyances done in contravention to the trust are null and void, can't happen.
[41:29.000 --> 41:36.000]  And this is very important because they're not following the law.
[41:36.000 --> 41:46.000]  In addition to the governing law, there's also underwriting standards.
[41:46.000 --> 41:56.000]  The underwriting standards give the conditions in which were set forth for the banks to loan money and to who.
[41:56.000 --> 42:11.000]  And this is very, very important because a large number of homeowners have been snookered into loans that they shouldn't have gotten.
[42:11.000 --> 42:21.000]  They're thinking that they're applying for one thing and they end up in a completely different loan that they weren't supposed to be in.
[42:21.000 --> 42:31.000]  We have people that have gone for loans with documents that said one thing.
[42:31.000 --> 42:38.000]  However, when the loan was written, the gentleman that filled in everything changed it.
[42:38.000 --> 42:45.000]  So they went in with stated docs. However, the loan came out as no docs.
[42:45.000 --> 42:56.000]  We have people making $10 an hour being listed that they were making $35 an hour.
[42:56.000 --> 43:05.000]  So it's important to look at what were the underwriting standards for the loans that were going into the trust.
[43:05.000 --> 43:10.000]  The underwriting standards are very, very concise.
[43:10.000 --> 43:20.000]  Now, yes, they do take a bit of reading because it's probably 30 or 40 pages of technical legalese.
[43:20.000 --> 43:27.000]  But how do you eat an elephant, Randy? One piece at a time. Correct.
[43:27.000 --> 43:30.000]  Yeah, and we're about to go to break. Let me address part of that.
[43:30.000 --> 43:35.000]  You know, I tell people, read the code, but don't try to read code and understand everything.
[43:35.000 --> 43:42.000]  It's in there. Just read it. Read through it, blast through it, go back, start at the beginning and read it again.
[43:42.000 --> 43:47.000]  The second time you read it twice, you'll know more than the lawyers do.
[43:47.000 --> 43:55.000]  Hang on. This is Randy Kelton, Deborah Stevens, Rule of Law Radio, our call in number 512-646-1984.
[43:55.000 --> 44:01.000]  We've got one more segment. Then we'll go to calls. We'll be right back.
[44:01.000 --> 44:08.000]  Mr. President, members of Congress, you've been making a lot of noise about taking our guns away.
[44:08.000 --> 44:15.000]  But you might want to review history. 1835, Gonzales, Texas territory.
[44:15.000 --> 44:20.000]  The authorities wanted to confiscate the big gun that protected that colony.
[44:20.000 --> 44:24.000]  You know what the people said? Come and take it.
[44:24.000 --> 44:29.000]  Because they were willing to fight for their freedom and their guns.
[44:29.000 --> 44:31.000]  So are we.
[44:31.000 --> 44:36.000]  Come and take it if you want it. Come and take it if you think you can.
[44:36.000 --> 44:43.000]  Come and take it, but I warn you, you'll have to pry it from my folded hands.
[44:43.000 --> 44:49.000]  We want the freedom that God gave us, so you best not cross that line.
[44:49.000 --> 44:54.000]  If you want this gun, you gotta come through us and take it.
[44:54.000 --> 45:00.000]  One shot at a time. Just like Gonzales, we're keeping her guns.
[45:00.000 --> 45:04.000]  Are you the plaintiff or defendant in a lawsuit?
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[45:39.000 --> 45:43.000]  about the principles and practices that control our American courts.
[45:43.000 --> 45:49.000]  You'll receive our audio classroom, video seminar, tutorials, forms for civil cases,
[45:49.000 --> 45:56.000]  pro se tactics, and much more. Please visit ruleoflawradio.com and click on the banner
[45:56.000 --> 46:24.000]  or call toll-free 866-LAW-EZ.
[46:24.000 --> 46:30.000]  Always, I must be careful what I'm wishing for.
[46:30.000 --> 46:35.000]  When I'm hungry, I like to know just what I'm fishing for.
[46:35.000 --> 46:40.000]  I ain't asking for much, I ain't trying to be no blood.
[46:40.000 --> 46:47.000]  Okay, we are back. This is Randy Kelton, W. Stevens, Rule of Law Radio with Joe Esquivel.
[46:47.000 --> 46:52.000]  And Joe, when we went out, we were talking about the PSA. You want to pick it back up?
[46:52.000 --> 46:55.000]  Sure, let's pick this puppy up.
[46:55.000 --> 46:59.000]  All right, we were talking about underwriting standards.
[46:59.000 --> 47:05.000]  That's just one of the bits of information within the prospectus.
[47:05.000 --> 47:10.000]  In addition, it has what's called NIMM insurers.
[47:10.000 --> 47:14.000]  It has modification information.
[47:14.000 --> 47:20.000]  What can the trust do in regards to a modification?
[47:20.000 --> 47:26.000]  Because in contravention to what the banks are telling you can be done,
[47:26.000 --> 47:33.000]  there are certain instances where the trust can do a modification.
[47:33.000 --> 47:41.000]  Again, each one of these trusts are set up uniquely. They're all similar.
[47:41.000 --> 47:48.000]  It's like looking at a line of cars. They all have four wheels, they all have a different engine though.
[47:48.000 --> 47:51.000]  They're all painted different, but they're all cars.
[47:51.000 --> 47:59.000]  So when we're looking at all these remakes, they're all very similar.
[47:59.000 --> 48:12.000]  So when I'm looking at this prospectus or at the PSA, one of the things that I started to touch upon were the parties that were involved in the transactions.
[48:12.000 --> 48:25.000]  And this is real important because if a plaintiff, whom is usually the bank, is coming forth with an action against the homeowner,
[48:25.000 --> 48:38.000]  you want to make sure that it's the correct name of the party who was supposed to come after you with this alleged hearsay claim.
[48:38.000 --> 48:46.000]  All right? So when I look in the prospectus, I'm going to look at who was the issuing entity.
[48:46.000 --> 49:03.000]  What was the correct name? Who is the sponsor and seller? And what role do they play? The sponsor and seller sponsors the transactions.
[49:03.000 --> 49:21.000]  So most of the time, the loans that are originated within this remake come from a lender who then sells them to a sponsor,
[49:21.000 --> 49:30.000]  who then sells them to a depositor, who in return sells them to the trustee.
[49:30.000 --> 49:46.000]  That is what we are told is to happen. In addition to these transactions, there is to be true arm's length sales.
[49:46.000 --> 50:00.000]  Because there are pass-throughs and there are conduits, there is to be a minimum of a two-party transaction, minimum.
[50:00.000 --> 50:11.000]  However, I know in many of the documents that I see, it goes from the lender to the trustee.
[50:11.000 --> 50:22.000]  Now, that does not sound like a two-transaction minimum that was to take place to keep this transaction bankruptcy remote.
[50:22.000 --> 50:37.000]  Now, the interesting thing is that when we look at the parties that are to be with this transaction, every party that is listed plays a role.
[50:37.000 --> 50:46.000]  So that I want to get out my piece of paper, I'm going to say, okay, where did my loan originate at? Who is the lender?
[50:46.000 --> 50:53.000]  Then I'm going to look at the prospectus. Who is the sponsor? Who is the depositor?
[50:53.000 --> 51:04.000]  Do their names match this note that's been exhibited into court? No, they don't. But wait a minute.
[51:04.000 --> 51:13.000]  That's what the pooling and servicing agreement said. That's what the prospectus said.
[51:13.000 --> 51:20.000]  Now, they want me to hold mine of the bargain up, but they're not holding their end up.
[51:20.000 --> 51:30.000]  I just want to get an even playing field. And they're not playing by the rules. Does that mean I don't have to play by the rules?
[51:30.000 --> 51:39.000]  Well, if you don't play that by the rules, they're going to file a notice of default.
[51:39.000 --> 51:46.000]  Ah, notice of default. That sounds scary.
[51:46.000 --> 52:08.000]  So if they don't play by the rules, you know, the way I read that deed of trust, the deed of trust grants privileges to the lender with certain restrictions.
[52:08.000 --> 52:21.000]  And if he breaches one of those restrictions, then I would say he couldn't exercise the privilege and default it on the document.
[52:21.000 --> 52:26.000]  That's certainly what they're going to accuse you of if you don't keep all the payments up.
[52:26.000 --> 52:41.000]  Ah, okay. So then if I were to take this further, then what you're telling me is I've got a deed of trust and it says state of Texas.
[52:41.000 --> 53:06.000]  All right. And I'm reading them. Let me see 13, 14, 15, 16 governing law rules of self ability. This document shall be governed by federal state and local laws of jurisdiction in which the real property resides in.
[53:06.000 --> 53:08.000]  Wow.
[53:08.000 --> 53:15.000]  That's telling me that I've got a set of rules that I've got to abide by.
[53:15.000 --> 53:26.000]  So they're being very specific within that document as to what rules apply to this contract.
[53:26.000 --> 53:42.000]  Because this deed of trust is a separate contract that is an alternative means of collection of should I not pay on the note.
[53:42.000 --> 53:57.000]  And the note in which I'm talking about is the tangible promissory note. That is the actual physical paper that evidences the debt.
[53:57.000 --> 54:06.000]  And this debt that we're talking about is the promise to pay.
[54:06.000 --> 54:14.000]  I, Joe Lesko, will promise to pay for the next 360 months, thousand dollars to Bank of America.
[54:14.000 --> 54:18.000]  That is your promise. That is what gives value.
[54:18.000 --> 54:23.000]  And that is what everybody is after.
[54:23.000 --> 54:28.000]  Everybody wants to buy that promise to pay.
[54:28.000 --> 54:35.000]  And that is what is bought and sold day in and day out, Randy.
[54:35.000 --> 54:44.000]  Okay. This is the one thing that you brought up that was so important for me.
[54:44.000 --> 55:01.000]  They don't exactly sell the promise to pay in terms of the note itself, but they sell the right to collect the income stream from the promise to pay.
[55:01.000 --> 55:03.000]  Is that correct?
[55:03.000 --> 55:06.000]  That's right on the head.
[55:06.000 --> 55:10.000]  And what we can do to break this down even more.
[55:10.000 --> 55:22.000]  If one were to go back into the case, which is Kemp versus Countrywide, K-E-M-P, there is a deposition of Linda Demartini.
[55:22.000 --> 55:33.000]  And on page 14 of this deposition, Linda Demartini states, Countrywide is not in the business of selling notes.
[55:33.000 --> 55:40.000]  Countrywide is in the business of selling beneficial interest.
[55:40.000 --> 55:44.000]  And when I read that, my eyes bugged out.
[55:44.000 --> 55:56.000]  So that's what Covenant 20 means when it says the lender may sell a portion of the note or the entire note.
[55:56.000 --> 56:03.000]  They're not necessarily saying we're breaking up the note in separate little pieces,
[56:03.000 --> 56:19.000]  but we're separating the note into different parts like the promise to pay and the right to receive the income from the payment.
[56:19.000 --> 56:21.000]  Is that correct?
[56:21.000 --> 56:25.000]  We're talking about rights, rights acquired.
[56:25.000 --> 56:36.000]  So in Covenant 20, it states this note or a partial interest of the note may be sold one or more times together with the security instrument.
[56:36.000 --> 56:49.000]  Randy, the security instrument follows the tangible promissory note.
[56:49.000 --> 56:57.000]  It cannot follow a partial interest of that tangible promissory note.
[56:57.000 --> 57:00.000]  That is fraud in the factum.
[57:00.000 --> 57:04.000]  It is a misrepresentation.
[57:04.000 --> 57:09.000]  And that was their intent.
[57:09.000 --> 57:15.000]  And that is prima facie evidence because it's recorded into public record.
[57:15.000 --> 57:20.000]  It's evidence of intent to breach the contract.
[57:20.000 --> 57:28.000]  And the way I look at it, if it doesn't make any sense to a unsophisticated purchaser,
[57:28.000 --> 57:43.000]  which a consumer is as a matter of statute, then the contract is unenforceable because it is too vague to be enforced.
[57:43.000 --> 57:45.000]  Correct.
[57:45.000 --> 57:47.000]  What the heck does that mean?
[57:47.000 --> 57:49.000]  Oh, don't worry about it, Mr. Kelton.
[57:49.000 --> 57:51.000]  I looked at the documents.
[57:51.000 --> 57:53.000]  They're fine.
[57:53.000 --> 58:04.000]  Oh, well, that's good because you're a licensed professional and I can expect good faith and fair dealing from you because you're subject to governmental oversight.
[58:04.000 --> 58:08.000]  Of course.
[58:08.000 --> 58:15.000]  So we are going to the top of the hour break and when we come back, we'll start taking calls.
[58:15.000 --> 58:22.000]  The next hour, we'll take calls on the securitization and mortgage issue.
[58:22.000 --> 58:26.000]  And then in the next hour, we'll take calls on any subject.
[58:26.000 --> 58:35.000]  This is Randy Kelton, Joe Esquivel, Deborah Stevens, Rule of Law Radio, our call-in number, 512-646-1984.
[58:35.000 --> 58:38.000]  We have about five callers on the board.
[58:38.000 --> 58:50.000]  So if you want to get in on the questions and answers and play stomp the chumps, give us a call, get in line, we'll be right back.
[58:50.000 --> 58:54.000]  Would you like to make more definite progress in your walk with God?
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[59:27.000 --> 59:40.000]  To order your free New Testament Recovery Version and Basic Elements of the Christian Life, call Bibles for America toll-free at 888-551-0102.
[59:40.000 --> 01:00:02.000]  That's 888-551-0102 or visit us online at bfa.org.
[01:00:02.000 --> 01:00:14.000]  You're listening to the Liberty Beat, your daily source for Liberty News and activist updates, online at TheLibertyBeats.com.
[01:00:14.000 --> 01:00:20.000]  John Bush here with your Liberty Beat for Thursday, August 15th, 2013.
[01:00:20.000 --> 01:00:29.000]  Gold opened today at $1,326, silver at $21.82, and Bitcoin is trading at $97.39.
[01:00:29.000 --> 01:00:35.000]  Support for the Liberty Beat comes from Brave New Books, Austin's only brick-and-mortar store, carrying $2.0.
[01:00:35.000 --> 01:00:40.000]  In Austin, at 1904 Guadalupe Street or online at BraveNewBooks.com.
[01:00:40.000 --> 01:00:45.000]  And from Cabo Bob's, the first high-fructose corn syrup-free quick-serve restaurant in the country,
[01:00:45.000 --> 01:00:50.000]  serving Baja California-style burritos and non-GMO corn tortillas and chips.
[01:00:50.000 --> 01:00:57.000]  In Austin, at 500 East Ben White Boulevard or by phone at 512-432-1111.
[01:00:57.000 --> 01:01:03.000]  And now the news. On Wednesday afternoon, Bradley Manning's defense rested after calling a number of witnesses,
[01:01:03.000 --> 01:01:06.000]  including Manning's Aunt Debra and Sister Casey.
[01:01:06.000 --> 01:01:13.000]  Manning himself gave a statement apologizing for hurting the United States and for unintended consequences of his actions.
[01:01:13.000 --> 01:01:20.000]  He also told Colonel Lind that he realized after having much self-reflection, he should have worked within the system to achieve change.
[01:01:20.000 --> 01:01:25.000]  For most of the afternoon, the defense attempted to portray Manning as idealistic and naive,
[01:01:25.000 --> 01:01:29.000]  at one point stating that he was stuck in post-adolescent idealism.
[01:01:29.000 --> 01:01:33.000]  The defense also detailed Manning's experience growing up with abusive alcoholic parents.
[01:01:33.000 --> 01:01:39.000]  The prosecution spent their time questioning Manning's empathy and painting him as unsympathetic to his fellow soldiers.
[01:01:39.000 --> 01:01:42.000]  Manning is currently facing life in military prison.
[01:01:42.000 --> 01:01:50.000]  Colonel Lind is expected to rule on final sentencing early next week.
[01:01:50.000 --> 01:01:56.000]  Police accountability activists from all around the country are descending on Austin, Texas this week for the upcoming Peaceful Streets Project
[01:01:56.000 --> 01:02:03.000]  Police Accountability Summit this Saturday from 10 a.m. to 4 p.m. at the AT&T Executive Conference Center on UT campus.
[01:02:03.000 --> 01:02:09.000]  Among those scheduled to speak are Pete Ayer of CopLock.org and Jacob Crawford of WeCopWatch.org,
[01:02:09.000 --> 01:02:15.000]  who are currently embarking on a police accountability tour that will take them all throughout the U.S. and even to South Africa.
[01:02:15.000 --> 01:02:17.000]  Their first stop, Austin, Texas.
[01:02:17.000 --> 01:02:21.000]  We caught up with Pete, who filled us in on the goal of the police accountability tour.
[01:02:21.000 --> 01:02:25.000]  Right now there's existing CopWatch groups in a lot of towns that aren't as much online,
[01:02:25.000 --> 01:02:29.000]  and there's a lot of CopLock and Peaceful Streets groups springing up all over the place.
[01:02:29.000 --> 01:02:34.000]  And I think when people connect, when we can focus on our comparative advantages and, you know,
[01:02:34.000 --> 01:02:39.000]  look out for each other, we can accomplish a lot. So I think it's very timely.
[01:02:39.000 --> 01:02:45.000]  To learn more about their efforts or to support their journey, visit CopLock.org slash tour.
[01:02:45.000 --> 01:02:48.000]  Support for the Liberty Beat comes from Carmacazi Productions,
[01:02:48.000 --> 01:02:52.000]  specializing in high-quality audio recording and video production for the Liberty Movement,
[01:02:52.000 --> 01:03:00.000]  online at carmacazi.tv, and from Central Texas Gunworks, CHL courses, self-defense training, and firearm sales.
[01:03:00.000 --> 01:03:19.000]  It's all according to the will of the Almighty. I read his book and it says it cares not for the unsightly.
[01:03:19.000 --> 01:03:31.000]  These warm arms will come by that term rightly. I wouldn't pay for the war with my body.
[01:03:31.000 --> 01:03:38.000]  Ain't gonna pay for the car with my money. I won't pay for the fun with my body.
[01:03:38.000 --> 01:03:45.000]  The plans wicked and their logic shoddy. Ain't gonna pay for the oil with my body.
[01:03:45.000 --> 01:03:49.000]  I won't pay for the boys with my money.
[01:03:49.000 --> 01:03:56.000]  Okay, we are back. Randy Kelton, Joe Esquivel, Debra Stevens, Rule of Law Radio,
[01:03:56.000 --> 01:04:04.000]  and we're going to go to our calls. We're going to start with Thomas in Virginia.
[01:04:04.000 --> 01:04:11.000]  Hello Thomas, what do you have for us tonight?
[01:04:11.000 --> 01:04:15.000]  Hello Thomas, are you there?
[01:04:15.000 --> 01:04:21.000]  Okay, sometimes we have a little trouble with these calls that once they've been on a while,
[01:04:21.000 --> 01:04:25.000]  sometimes they can't hear us and we get a bad connection.
[01:04:25.000 --> 01:04:34.000]  So Thomas, if you can hear us and I can't hear you, hang up and call back in and we'll bump you up to the top of the board.
[01:04:34.000 --> 01:04:41.000]  Okay, we're going to go to Debbie in Texas. Debbie, what do you have for us tonight?
[01:04:41.000 --> 01:04:45.000]  Well, it doesn't have anything to do with mortgages.
[01:04:45.000 --> 01:04:53.000]  I got a message from Texans Against Smart Meters to give you guys a call.
[01:04:53.000 --> 01:04:57.000]  Right, say that again. You got a message from who?
[01:04:57.000 --> 01:05:01.000]  Texans Against Smart Meters.
[01:05:01.000 --> 01:05:04.000]  Okay.
[01:05:04.000 --> 01:05:06.000]  I'm not really sure how much y'all can help.
[01:05:06.000 --> 01:05:11.000]  We're just kind of at a war right now with our city
[01:05:11.000 --> 01:05:19.000]  and we're fighting the smart meter they installed and then uninstalled because it doubled our water usage.
[01:05:19.000 --> 01:05:21.000]  Okay, now wait a minute, Debbie.
[01:05:21.000 --> 01:05:30.000]  Those smart meters, if you've got too many kids, you won't even have to go get your tubes tied.
[01:05:30.000 --> 01:05:35.000]  Those smart meters will make you sterile from the radiation from them.
[01:05:35.000 --> 01:05:38.000]  Just think of the benefits.
[01:05:38.000 --> 01:05:44.000]  Well, you know, I'm way beyond that.
[01:05:44.000 --> 01:05:51.000]  We've had Ms. Katherine Albrecht and we've had others talk about these smart meters.
[01:05:51.000 --> 01:06:01.000]  We had a PhD who's heading up the, unfortunately I forget her name at the moment, but she was excellent.
[01:06:01.000 --> 01:06:09.000]  And these smart meters throw out so much radiation that she said to her,
[01:06:09.000 --> 01:06:17.000]  watched her husband sleeping and she could see him twitch every time these meters, they click on and off.
[01:06:17.000 --> 01:06:20.000]  She could see him twitch every time it clicked on.
[01:06:20.000 --> 01:06:28.000]  But how does that go to foreclosure?
[01:06:28.000 --> 01:06:29.000]  I'm sorry?
[01:06:29.000 --> 01:06:31.000]  How does that go to foreclosure?
[01:06:31.000 --> 01:06:34.000]  We're doing foreclosure this first hour.
[01:06:34.000 --> 01:06:39.000]  We've certainly had to talk about the smart meters in the second, I mean in the third hour.
[01:06:39.000 --> 01:06:41.000]  This is our second hour.
[01:06:41.000 --> 01:06:46.000]  Okay, well, and see, and when I called, I told the gentleman that's what I was calling about.
[01:06:46.000 --> 01:06:52.000]  But then when I started listening to you guys, it's like, okay, this has nothing to do with this.
[01:06:52.000 --> 01:06:55.000]  So I just need to call you back?
[01:06:55.000 --> 01:06:57.000]  Yeah, call back in the next hour.
[01:06:57.000 --> 01:07:01.000]  Then we'll take questions on any subjects.
[01:07:01.000 --> 01:07:09.000]  We want to kind of stay with foreclosure this hour and then the last two hours we'll take calls on anything.
[01:07:09.000 --> 01:07:11.000]  Okay, Randy, I'll call you back.
[01:07:11.000 --> 01:07:13.000]  Okay, thank you, Deb.
[01:07:13.000 --> 01:07:14.000]  Thank you.
[01:07:14.000 --> 01:07:19.000]  We're going to go to, let me go back to Thomas to see if we can get Thomas in.
[01:07:19.000 --> 01:07:21.000]  Thomas, are you there?
[01:07:21.000 --> 01:07:23.000]  Can you hear me?
[01:07:23.000 --> 01:07:25.000]  Yes.
[01:07:25.000 --> 01:07:27.000]  Good evening, how are you?
[01:07:27.000 --> 01:07:28.000]  I am fine.
[01:07:28.000 --> 01:07:31.000]  Thomas, you have such a sweet voice.
[01:07:31.000 --> 01:07:33.000]  Thank you very much.
[01:07:33.000 --> 01:07:36.000]  I'm being facetious.
[01:07:36.000 --> 01:07:37.000]  Of course you are.
[01:07:37.000 --> 01:07:41.000]  I was accused of being patronizing yesterday, so today I'm just being facetious.
[01:07:41.000 --> 01:07:45.000]  Okay, do you have a question or a comment for us?
[01:07:45.000 --> 01:07:47.000]  I just have a comment.
[01:07:47.000 --> 01:07:53.000]  I've spoken to Joe on several occasions, and I just want to commend you for having him with you as your co-host,
[01:07:53.000 --> 01:07:56.000]  because as we already know, he shares an awful lot of information,
[01:07:56.000 --> 01:08:03.000]  and I just think it's fantastic that he's going to be with you on a regular basis so that we can listen in and get educated.
[01:08:03.000 --> 01:08:04.000]  Well, thank you.
[01:08:04.000 --> 01:08:08.000]  I have been doing this show for about six years now,
[01:08:08.000 --> 01:08:16.000]  and in that amount of time I have recommended three people as hosts on the network.
[01:08:16.000 --> 01:08:18.000]  One of them is Eddie Craig.
[01:08:18.000 --> 01:08:29.000]  One we lost, but Mike Beiter, we lost him, and Joe.
[01:08:29.000 --> 01:08:40.000]  I have spent a long time trying to find someone to give me an analysis, a securities analysis that I could use.
[01:08:40.000 --> 01:08:45.000]  I have a lot of people that do these securities analysis, and they give me this analysis that says,
[01:08:45.000 --> 01:08:49.000]  well, you can't do this, you can't do that, these guys did this, and they can't do that.
[01:08:49.000 --> 01:08:52.000]  And I tell them, don't waste my time with that garbage.
[01:08:52.000 --> 01:09:01.000]  Do not make a proactive statement of law out of your mouth, because it's worthless to me.
[01:09:01.000 --> 01:09:08.000]  If you're going to make a proactive statement of law, make it out of the mouth of the court or the legislature.
[01:09:08.000 --> 01:09:15.000]  And when I got a copy of Joe's evaluation, that's exactly what it did.
[01:09:15.000 --> 01:09:22.000]  So that was something I could use, that was the first one ever I could use.
[01:09:22.000 --> 01:09:30.000]  And I recommended him to someone in California, and he called me back, and he said he talked to a couple people he knew,
[01:09:30.000 --> 01:09:34.000]  and they had somebody who was really good.
[01:09:34.000 --> 01:09:39.000]  And they were two separate people, I happened to know both of them.
[01:09:39.000 --> 01:09:46.000]  And they said, I don't know who you're going to use, but you really should use this guy, Joe Esquivel.
[01:09:46.000 --> 01:09:48.000]  So that was a real good recommendation.
[01:09:48.000 --> 01:09:52.000]  I've got recommendations from him from different directions.
[01:09:52.000 --> 01:09:59.000]  So I didn't make the recommendation lightly.
[01:09:59.000 --> 01:10:09.000]  And so far, I think this is going to turn out to be a great asset to people who have mortgage issues
[01:10:09.000 --> 01:10:13.000]  and are dealing with this securitization problem.
[01:10:13.000 --> 01:10:18.000]  We need people to understand how this thing works.
[01:10:18.000 --> 01:10:22.000]  And I think Joe is going to be able to help people understand that better than I do,
[01:10:22.000 --> 01:10:33.000]  because I kind of think I understand it, but I know enough about it to give people really stupid advice.
[01:10:33.000 --> 01:10:35.000]  And I think Joe can correct me on that.
[01:10:35.000 --> 01:10:38.000]  Do you have a comment on that, Joe?
[01:10:38.000 --> 01:10:41.000]  No, you're doing fine.
[01:10:41.000 --> 01:10:42.000]  Okay.
[01:10:42.000 --> 01:10:46.000]  Do you have anything else for us, Thomas?
[01:10:46.000 --> 01:10:52.000]  No, no, just I think you two are doing a fantastic job, and Joe, I look forward to talking with you soon.
[01:10:52.000 --> 01:10:56.000]  Well, thank you very much, and I appreciate that.
[01:10:56.000 --> 01:10:57.000]  Okay.
[01:10:57.000 --> 01:10:58.000]  Thank you very much.
[01:10:58.000 --> 01:11:03.000]  Now we're going to go to Gloria in Florida.
[01:11:03.000 --> 01:11:04.000]  Hello, Gloria.
[01:11:04.000 --> 01:11:05.000]  Hi, Randy.
[01:11:05.000 --> 01:11:06.000]  Hi, Joe.
[01:11:06.000 --> 01:11:07.000]  I have a question.
[01:11:07.000 --> 01:11:16.000]  Well, let me start off by I re-financed my house in 2004 to American Mortgage Acceptance Corporation,
[01:11:16.000 --> 01:11:18.000]  which was a broker lender.
[01:11:18.000 --> 01:11:25.000]  Then it was sold to IndyMac.
[01:11:25.000 --> 01:11:28.000]  Then American Mortgage—
[01:11:28.000 --> 01:11:30.000]  Okay, hold on, hold on.
[01:11:30.000 --> 01:11:35.000]  I generally stop people here.
[01:11:35.000 --> 01:11:39.000]  How do you know it was sold to them?
[01:11:39.000 --> 01:11:45.000]  Well, if—okay, maybe I'm misunderstanding.
[01:11:45.000 --> 01:11:46.000]  Okay.
[01:11:46.000 --> 01:11:48.000]  No, no, okay, okay, hold on.
[01:11:48.000 --> 01:11:51.000]  I'm not really being facetious here.
[01:11:51.000 --> 01:12:00.000]  The bank wants you to think that when another company comes to you and say you need to pay me,
[01:12:00.000 --> 01:12:03.000]  that it's been sold to them.
[01:12:03.000 --> 01:12:06.000]  But that's not necessarily the case.
[01:12:06.000 --> 01:12:15.000]  The person collecting the payments, they tend to present themselves as the holder,
[01:12:15.000 --> 01:12:26.000]  but generally they're just a contractor that somebody has hired to collect this money for them.
[01:12:26.000 --> 01:12:30.000]  And that's kind of the point of what Merge was.
[01:12:30.000 --> 01:12:35.000]  They don't really want you to know who actually owns it.
[01:12:35.000 --> 01:12:41.000]  They want you to think that this person who's demanding payment bought it.
[01:12:41.000 --> 01:12:43.000]  So that's why I asked that question.
[01:12:43.000 --> 01:13:01.000]  Is there anything in the record showing that the deed of trust and the note has been transferred to this entity?
[01:13:01.000 --> 01:13:06.000]  Well, it was Amira's mortgage, plus it was robo-signed.
[01:13:06.000 --> 01:13:08.000]  Okay, well, okay.
[01:13:08.000 --> 01:13:10.000]  I didn't mean to interrupt you, but—
[01:13:10.000 --> 01:13:11.000]  That's okay.
[01:13:11.000 --> 01:13:13.000]  So go ahead.
[01:13:13.000 --> 01:13:20.000]  Okay, we're going to assume that these are transfers, but we don't know if they're actually sales or not.
[01:13:20.000 --> 01:13:25.000]  Okay, you had—so it went to Fannie Mae Freddie Mac?
[01:13:25.000 --> 01:13:28.000]  No, no, no.
[01:13:28.000 --> 01:13:29.000]  No.
[01:13:29.000 --> 01:13:35.000]  The race—I went to a broker lender, American Mortgage Acceptance Corporation.
[01:13:35.000 --> 01:13:38.000]  Then it went to IndyMac.
[01:13:38.000 --> 01:13:44.000]  And then from there it went to the FDIC because IndyMac went belly up.
[01:13:44.000 --> 01:13:48.000]  Then from there it went to OneWest Bank.
[01:13:48.000 --> 01:13:56.000]  And then Deutsche Bank was the bank that came in through the pooling of—Deutsche Bank turned around
[01:13:56.000 --> 01:14:08.000]  and sued me through the pooling and servicing agreement of my IndyMac PSA pooling and servicing agreement, IndyMac.
[01:14:08.000 --> 01:14:09.000]  Joe, you want to—
[01:14:09.000 --> 01:14:10.000]  Okay, all right.
[01:14:10.000 --> 01:14:13.000]  I have an understanding of what you're saying.
[01:14:13.000 --> 01:14:22.000]  Now let's just clarify just a little bit so our listeners have an understanding and can follow this with me.
[01:14:22.000 --> 01:14:23.000]  Okay.
[01:14:23.000 --> 01:14:31.000]  Originally your original lender sold, you're saying, your loan.
[01:14:31.000 --> 01:14:32.000]  Okay.
[01:14:32.000 --> 01:14:41.000]  Or was it the servicing rights that were sold?
[01:14:41.000 --> 01:14:54.000]  The important part about that is you should absolutely know that because it should have been noticed to you exactly what was done.
[01:14:54.000 --> 01:14:56.000]  Correct, Randy.
[01:14:56.000 --> 01:14:57.000]  Go ahead.
[01:14:57.000 --> 01:14:59.000]  I'm going to butt out.
[01:14:59.000 --> 01:15:11.000]  When your original lender, you stated, sold to IndyMac, your loan.
[01:15:11.000 --> 01:15:19.000]  Many times you receive in the mail a letter that purports to say, your loan has been sold.
[01:15:19.000 --> 01:15:25.000]  You will now make payments to Randy Kelton, Bank NA.
[01:15:25.000 --> 01:15:34.000]  Now many times it is not your loan that has been sold to that company.
[01:15:34.000 --> 01:15:41.000]  It is the rent to service that loan that has been sold.
[01:15:41.000 --> 01:15:45.000]  But let's go forward even more.
[01:15:45.000 --> 01:15:57.000]  You then allege that the FDIC bought it or acquired it through the bankruptcy of IndyMac.
[01:15:57.000 --> 01:15:58.000]  Correct.
[01:15:58.000 --> 01:16:02.000]  Again, what did they acquire?
[01:16:02.000 --> 01:16:05.000]  What date was your loan?
[01:16:05.000 --> 01:16:06.000]  And what year?
[01:16:06.000 --> 01:16:10.000]  The RAFI was done November 2004.
[01:16:10.000 --> 01:16:12.000]  All right.
[01:16:12.000 --> 01:16:19.000]  So in 2004, a loan was created.
[01:16:19.000 --> 01:16:25.000]  Now, in what year was it that IndyMac went out of business?
[01:16:25.000 --> 01:16:27.000]  Was it 2009?
[01:16:27.000 --> 01:16:31.000]  Yes, it was a large number of years later.
[01:16:31.000 --> 01:16:32.000]  Correct.
[01:16:32.000 --> 01:16:38.000]  So if we back up, all right, and let's look at this logical point.
[01:16:38.000 --> 01:16:42.000]  So, okay, hold on, Joe, we're about to go to break.
[01:16:42.000 --> 01:16:50.000]  This is Randy Kelton, Deborah Stevens, Rule of Law Radio, our calling number, 512-646-1984.
[01:16:50.000 --> 01:16:55.000]  For the next three segments, we'll be taking calls on foreclosure issues.
[01:16:55.000 --> 01:17:03.000]  Give us a call, get in line, we'll be right back.
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[01:19:23.000 --> 01:19:28.000]  Well, you ain't gonna fool me with that same old trick again.
[01:19:28.000 --> 01:19:33.000]  I was blindsided, but now I can see your plan.
[01:19:33.000 --> 01:19:38.000]  You put the fear in my pocket.
[01:19:38.000 --> 01:19:43.000]  Okay, we are back, Randy Kelton, Joe Esquivel,
[01:19:43.000 --> 01:19:48.000]  and we're talking to Dee in...
[01:19:48.000 --> 01:19:53.000]  Florida.
[01:19:53.000 --> 01:19:55.000]  Okay, Dee, one thing we didn't do,
[01:19:55.000 --> 01:19:59.000]  I kind of bushwhacked you there at the beginning,
[01:19:59.000 --> 01:20:05.000]  and I really didn't get to your question.
[01:20:05.000 --> 01:20:07.000]  My question?
[01:20:07.000 --> 01:20:12.000]  Okay, I'm trying to understand the whole pooling and servicing agreement
[01:20:12.000 --> 01:20:15.000]  and the securitization, okay?
[01:20:15.000 --> 01:20:21.000]  Because I originally had the refi with American Morganist Acceptance Corporation,
[01:20:21.000 --> 01:20:23.000]  then it went to IndyMac, and Indy...
[01:20:23.000 --> 01:20:25.000]  Okay, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait.
[01:20:25.000 --> 01:20:28.000]  This will get too long.
[01:20:28.000 --> 01:20:32.000]  If you're generally trying to understand the whole issue,
[01:20:32.000 --> 01:20:36.000]  is there a question that you have?
[01:20:36.000 --> 01:20:40.000]  Let's get the question, and then we can back up to this information.
[01:20:40.000 --> 01:20:42.000]  That way, we'll get the information.
[01:20:42.000 --> 01:20:46.000]  In a context that will make it all make sense to us.
[01:20:46.000 --> 01:20:48.000]  Does that sound reasonable?
[01:20:48.000 --> 01:20:53.000]  My question is, what is the truth behind the securitization?
[01:20:53.000 --> 01:20:58.000]  Because there's just so much out there, like on Facebook and a lot of people,
[01:20:58.000 --> 01:21:05.000]  and I'm not sure that we're really getting the true facts and the true answers.
[01:21:05.000 --> 01:21:08.000]  Because, you know, a lot of people seem, you know,
[01:21:08.000 --> 01:21:13.000]  like people that are pro se are going into court and they're losing their cases,
[01:21:13.000 --> 01:21:16.000]  and I happen to be, I lost my case.
[01:21:16.000 --> 01:21:20.000]  I showed the fraud and everything, and it's just didn't,
[01:21:20.000 --> 01:21:23.000]  you know, with the pooling and servicing agreement
[01:21:23.000 --> 01:21:25.000]  and the robo-signing and assignment...
[01:21:25.000 --> 01:21:27.000]  Okay, okay, okay, hold on, hold on.
[01:21:27.000 --> 01:21:30.000]  There is a lot to know here.
[01:21:30.000 --> 01:21:34.000]  And especially if you're pro se,
[01:21:34.000 --> 01:21:40.000]  once the first thing to understand is when you go into court,
[01:21:40.000 --> 01:21:46.000]  it sounds like they're speaking English, but they're not.
[01:21:46.000 --> 01:21:48.000]  Yeah, I got that.
[01:21:48.000 --> 01:21:50.000]  Yeah, they're speaking with legalese,
[01:21:50.000 --> 01:21:55.000]  and it takes a while to get an idea of how this is different.
[01:21:55.000 --> 01:21:58.000]  If you listen to our show regularly,
[01:21:58.000 --> 01:22:01.000]  not only do we talk about the foreclosure issues,
[01:22:01.000 --> 01:22:04.000]  but we talk about how these things work,
[01:22:04.000 --> 01:22:07.000]  how to present evidence to the court,
[01:22:07.000 --> 01:22:09.000]  how to frame your arguments,
[01:22:09.000 --> 01:22:14.000]  and it's way, way too much to do here in a sound bite.
[01:22:14.000 --> 01:22:17.000]  So your question is a great question,
[01:22:17.000 --> 01:22:21.000]  and really that goes to everything we're doing here,
[01:22:21.000 --> 01:22:23.000]  is trying to make that make sense.
[01:22:23.000 --> 01:22:25.000]  Do you have a comment on that, Joe?
[01:22:25.000 --> 01:22:26.000]  Sure.
[01:22:26.000 --> 01:22:31.000]  This is the reason that we are doing the show,
[01:22:31.000 --> 01:22:37.000]  to give people a better understanding of what is to take place,
[01:22:37.000 --> 01:22:41.000]  what was to take place, what did not take place.
[01:22:41.000 --> 01:22:45.000]  I'll tell you what I will do for you.
[01:22:45.000 --> 01:22:49.000]  If you send me an email,
[01:22:49.000 --> 01:22:57.000]  I will send you a highlighted prospectus.
[01:22:57.000 --> 01:23:01.000]  I will send you an index that I have created
[01:23:01.000 --> 01:23:04.000]  that goes with this prospectus,
[01:23:04.000 --> 01:23:12.000]  and you can use it in an educational format
[01:23:12.000 --> 01:23:19.000]  to teach yourself how to understand what goes on
[01:23:19.000 --> 01:23:21.000]  within the pool and servicing agreements
[01:23:21.000 --> 01:23:24.000]  and the 424 prospectus.
[01:23:24.000 --> 01:23:27.000]  The one I will send you is not yours,
[01:23:27.000 --> 01:23:32.000]  but it's a boilerplated prospectus.
[01:23:32.000 --> 01:23:35.000]  And I've already gone through, I've highlighted everything,
[01:23:35.000 --> 01:23:42.000]  I've created an index based on the items that I felt
[01:23:42.000 --> 01:23:46.000]  were of relative importance
[01:23:46.000 --> 01:23:51.000]  for parties wishing to have a better understanding.
[01:23:51.000 --> 01:23:54.000]  And once I went through the entire prospectus supplement,
[01:23:54.000 --> 01:23:58.000]  I then created this index.
[01:23:58.000 --> 01:24:02.000]  I will also send you a set of instructions as to how to use it,
[01:24:02.000 --> 01:24:05.000]  which is very simple.
[01:24:05.000 --> 01:24:08.000]  And I will send it to anyone that is on the air tonight
[01:24:08.000 --> 01:24:11.000]  that emails me asking for a copy of this.
[01:24:11.000 --> 01:24:15.000]  And what you will get is a set of instructions,
[01:24:15.000 --> 01:24:19.000]  a 424B5 prospectus supplement, and an index,
[01:24:19.000 --> 01:24:29.000]  and it can help you in your educational fight.
[01:24:29.000 --> 01:24:32.000]  Does that help you?
[01:24:32.000 --> 01:24:34.000]  Yes, it does. Thank you very much.
[01:24:34.000 --> 01:24:36.000]  Jeff, what's your email?
[01:24:36.000 --> 01:24:41.000]  The email is info.
[01:24:41.000 --> 01:24:45.000]  I'll tell you, Randy, can you give her an email address?
[01:24:45.000 --> 01:24:46.000]  Yes, yes.
[01:24:46.000 --> 01:24:50.000]  Just any inquiries you have, send them to me,
[01:24:50.000 --> 01:24:53.000]  randy at ruleoflawradio.com.
[01:24:53.000 --> 01:24:56.000]  You can go to ruleoflawradio.com website
[01:24:56.000 --> 01:25:01.000]  or to logosradionetwork.com website,
[01:25:01.000 --> 01:25:03.000]  and you'll find my email on there.
[01:25:03.000 --> 01:25:06.000]  Rule of what?
[01:25:06.000 --> 01:25:11.000]  Ruleoflawradio.com.
[01:25:11.000 --> 01:25:15.000]  That's randy at ruleoflawradio.com.
[01:25:15.000 --> 01:25:18.000]  Just send it there, and I will forward it to Joe.
[01:25:18.000 --> 01:25:24.000]  We will get him a local email here so we can...
[01:25:24.000 --> 01:25:26.000]  so you'll have an easy place to get to him,
[01:25:26.000 --> 01:25:32.000]  and you're welcome to give out your email, Joe.
[01:25:32.000 --> 01:25:40.000]  My email would be info at mortgage, compliance,
[01:25:40.000 --> 01:25:46.000]  investigators, that's plural, dot com.
[01:25:46.000 --> 01:25:49.000]  And all you need to put in the subject line is
[01:25:49.000 --> 01:25:54.000]  prospectus supplement requested,
[01:25:54.000 --> 01:25:58.000]  and I will see that you get a copy.
[01:25:58.000 --> 01:26:00.000]  And again, it's very simple.
[01:26:00.000 --> 01:26:04.000]  You're going to print out the entire prospectus supplement.
[01:26:04.000 --> 01:26:07.000]  You're going to get a 4-inch D-ring binder.
[01:26:07.000 --> 01:26:11.000]  You will then punch the printed papers,
[01:26:11.000 --> 01:26:13.000]  put them in the binder.
[01:26:13.000 --> 01:26:16.000]  You will take the index, have that printed out.
[01:26:16.000 --> 01:26:18.000]  That will be on the left side.
[01:26:18.000 --> 01:26:23.000]  You will get a Sharpie and a set of signature tabs,
[01:26:23.000 --> 01:26:26.000]  and you're going to start with the index,
[01:26:26.000 --> 01:26:27.000]  and you're going to read.
[01:26:27.000 --> 01:26:32.000]  It's going to say P2, page 2.
[01:26:32.000 --> 01:26:34.000]  And you're going to get out your little signature tab
[01:26:34.000 --> 01:26:36.000]  and you're sharp, and you're going to write P2.
[01:26:36.000 --> 01:26:39.000]  And you're going to flip the page over to page 2,
[01:26:39.000 --> 01:26:42.000]  and you're going to start at the top in a descending order
[01:26:42.000 --> 01:26:43.000]  from top to bottom.
[01:26:43.000 --> 01:26:45.000]  You're just going to go down the index.
[01:26:45.000 --> 01:26:48.000]  So for every page that I have in the index,
[01:26:48.000 --> 01:26:51.000]  you're going to turn to that page in the prospectus.
[01:26:51.000 --> 01:26:52.000]  And when you get to the bottom,
[01:26:52.000 --> 01:26:54.000]  you're going to go back up to the top.
[01:26:54.000 --> 01:26:55.000]  And when you get done,
[01:26:55.000 --> 01:26:59.000]  you're going to have a fully indexed 424B5 prospectus
[01:26:59.000 --> 01:27:03.000]  supplement that you can learn to read
[01:27:03.000 --> 01:27:06.000]  and have a better understanding.
[01:27:06.000 --> 01:27:09.000]  And you may have to read something four or five times,
[01:27:09.000 --> 01:27:12.000]  and that's okay.
[01:27:12.000 --> 01:27:16.000]  But then when you're talking about parties to the transaction,
[01:27:16.000 --> 01:27:17.000]  what is the cutoff date?
[01:27:17.000 --> 01:27:19.000]  What is the closing date?
[01:27:19.000 --> 01:27:22.000]  It will say, within that prospectus,
[01:27:22.000 --> 01:27:28.000]  what a closing date is, what a cutoff date is.
[01:27:28.000 --> 01:27:36.000]  It will say, what does it mean to be a sponsor?
[01:27:36.000 --> 01:27:37.000]  Well, that, I believe,
[01:27:37.000 --> 01:27:40.000]  answers your question as to what you will get.
[01:27:40.000 --> 01:27:46.000]  Do you have another quick question relating to this that I could answer?
[01:27:46.000 --> 01:27:48.000]  Joe, just do me a favor.
[01:27:48.000 --> 01:27:51.000]  Just tell me I have info at mortgage compliance.
[01:27:51.000 --> 01:27:52.000]  What was the rest of the email?
[01:27:52.000 --> 01:27:53.000]  I'm sorry.
[01:27:53.000 --> 01:28:06.000]  Investigators.com.
[01:28:06.000 --> 01:28:10.000]  Is there more than one, just one quick question.
[01:28:10.000 --> 01:28:16.000]  In these pools, or is there more than one pool per loan, mortgage,
[01:28:16.000 --> 01:28:18.000]  whatever you want to call it?
[01:28:18.000 --> 01:28:20.000]  Is there more than one pool?
[01:28:20.000 --> 01:28:24.000]  Is there more than one tranche or more than one class?
[01:28:24.000 --> 01:28:26.000]  Well, no.
[01:28:26.000 --> 01:28:32.000]  I know that my mortgage was supposed to be in a Maryland pool.
[01:28:32.000 --> 01:28:33.000]  Okay.
[01:28:33.000 --> 01:28:40.000]  Is there more than one more, is it in other trusts besides that one?
[01:28:40.000 --> 01:28:42.000]  It should not be.
[01:28:42.000 --> 01:28:48.000]  I'm not going to rule that out, but usually when an asset is put into a trust,
[01:28:48.000 --> 01:28:55.000]  it stays within that trust until the trust sells it or until it is paid off.
[01:28:55.000 --> 01:28:56.000]  Okay.
[01:28:56.000 --> 01:29:02.000]  Now, within that trust, it could be in 15 different classes.
[01:29:02.000 --> 01:29:10.000]  It could be in 20 different classes, but they would all be within that trust.
[01:29:10.000 --> 01:29:13.000]  So depending on what the underwriting standards were,
[01:29:13.000 --> 01:29:18.000]  and depending on what the risk of loss was for the investor and the
[01:29:18.000 --> 01:29:29.000]  underwriting standards would determine how many classes your loan would be in.
[01:29:29.000 --> 01:29:35.000]  Are you as confused as I am, Gloria?
[01:29:35.000 --> 01:29:38.000]  Actually, I'm learning this as you are.
[01:29:38.000 --> 01:29:39.000]  All right.
[01:29:39.000 --> 01:29:41.000]  I'll break it a little bit more.
[01:29:41.000 --> 01:29:45.000]  However, we are getting ready for our next break.
[01:29:45.000 --> 01:29:50.000]  So this is Joe Esquivel, Randy Kelton, Debra Stevens with Rule of Law Radio,
[01:29:50.000 --> 01:29:52.000]  and we will be back shortly.
[01:29:52.000 --> 01:29:57.000]  Our call-in number is 512-646-1984.
[01:29:57.000 --> 01:30:01.000]  Thank you.
[01:30:01.000 --> 01:30:04.000]  When consumers objected to genetically modified foods,
[01:30:04.000 --> 01:30:07.000]  big companies leapt into action, but instead of changing their products,
[01:30:07.000 --> 01:30:10.000]  they hired a marketing guru to change our minds.
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[01:30:44.000 --> 01:30:48.000]  Companies like Monsanto, Kraft, and Procter & Gamble,
[01:30:48.000 --> 01:30:51.000]  know consumers don't like their genetically modified foods.
[01:30:51.000 --> 01:30:54.000]  But rather than take our concerns seriously,
[01:30:54.000 --> 01:30:59.000]  they opted to overcome opposition with their secret weapon, Dr. Clotaire Rapail.
[01:30:59.000 --> 01:31:03.000]  Rapail specializes in accessing what he calls the reptilian brain of consumers
[01:31:03.000 --> 01:31:06.000]  to change how we think about things like GMO foods.
[01:31:06.000 --> 01:31:08.000]  His advice to the GMO industry?
[01:31:08.000 --> 01:31:13.000]  Avoid using terms like DNA, experiments, pesticides, and profits.
[01:31:13.000 --> 01:31:17.000]  Replace them instead with farmers, children, earth, and flowers.
[01:31:17.000 --> 01:31:20.000]  Unfortunately, pretty words alone don't make GMO foods safe.
[01:31:20.000 --> 01:31:22.000]  I say let's get back to natural.
[01:31:22.000 --> 01:31:30.000]  I'm Dr. Catherine Albrecht. More news and information at CatherineAlbrecht.com.
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[01:33:11.000 --> 01:33:40.000]  The way you come with temptation
[01:33:40.000 --> 01:33:47.000]  They're trying to buy the whole place
[01:33:47.000 --> 01:33:53.000]  They want to force the nation
[01:33:53.000 --> 01:33:58.000]  Because they're falling from grace
[01:33:58.000 --> 01:34:04.000]  I will not drink that cup
[01:34:04.000 --> 01:34:09.000]  I just can't act out of way
[01:34:09.000 --> 01:34:14.000]  They got this problem they're dreaming of
[01:34:14.000 --> 01:34:19.000]  And I won't be the slave from what makes
[01:34:19.000 --> 01:34:20.000]  Cause I'm
[01:34:20.000 --> 01:34:23.000]  Oh yes you can come and you can kick any man
[01:34:23.000 --> 01:34:26.000]  Because I'll save myself from the Almighty One
[01:34:26.000 --> 01:34:28.000]  We know that everyone can save my man
[01:34:28.000 --> 01:34:31.000]  We love him with all our heart and peace in his face man
[01:34:31.000 --> 01:34:34.000]  We love God and mercy and we love him badly
[01:34:34.000 --> 01:34:37.000]  But I'm not another man in the world to come and prove it
[01:34:37.000 --> 01:34:39.000]  I'm not another man to come and prove it
[01:34:39.000 --> 01:34:42.000]  You create other men and you do it equally
[01:34:42.000 --> 01:34:45.000]  But mankind still up for themselves really
[01:34:45.000 --> 01:34:48.000]  Because they're mad, Lord, they're not angry
[01:34:48.000 --> 01:34:51.000]  Mankind love them, they're not afraid
[01:34:51.000 --> 01:34:52.000]  They've got them up for themselves
[01:34:52.000 --> 01:34:57.000]  Okay, we are back. Randy Kelton, Douglas Stevens, Rue La Radio.
[01:34:57.000 --> 01:35:01.000]  And we have our next caller is known to Joe.
[01:35:01.000 --> 01:35:03.000]  Joe, you want to introduce our next caller?
[01:35:03.000 --> 01:35:07.000]  Sure, our next caller is James.
[01:35:07.000 --> 01:35:12.000]  James is my mentor.
[01:35:12.000 --> 01:35:21.000]  And James knows more than every attorney that I've met
[01:35:21.000 --> 01:35:27.000]  And what James has said has yet to be rebuted.
[01:35:27.000 --> 01:35:32.000]  Everything that I have seen, everything that I've heard from James
[01:35:32.000 --> 01:35:37.000]  Has been true and accurate.
[01:35:37.000 --> 01:35:45.000]  So James, James you wanted to comment on our previous caller.
[01:35:45.000 --> 01:35:50.000]  Yes, I was listening to the previous Florida caller
[01:35:50.000 --> 01:35:58.000]  And there was the question is how is the monetary value in one trust?
[01:35:58.000 --> 01:36:05.000]  Well, this is the question that I would propose to Joe, allow him to answer it.
[01:36:05.000 --> 01:36:12.000]  Is it possible that if it's the payment stream that has been securitized
[01:36:12.000 --> 01:36:21.000]  Is it possible that it could be in more than one trust but not likely?
[01:36:21.000 --> 01:36:26.000]  Correct, it is not likely.
[01:36:26.000 --> 01:36:28.000]  But it is possible.
[01:36:28.000 --> 01:36:31.000]  Of course it's possible, we've seen it time and time again
[01:36:31.000 --> 01:36:35.000]  Where the asset is sold to multiple trusts.
[01:36:35.000 --> 01:36:40.000]  Okay, now my next question is your mortgage payment insurance or your credit default swaps
[01:36:40.000 --> 01:36:49.000]  When those are paid out, do they pay off the tangible mortgage note or what do they actually pay off?
[01:36:49.000 --> 01:36:53.000]  Well, it's like a side bet and poker.
[01:36:53.000 --> 01:36:59.000]  Those are going to the parties that invested in those derivatives
[01:36:59.000 --> 01:37:04.000]  That invested in those credit default swaps
[01:37:04.000 --> 01:37:09.000]  That has nothing to do with the obligations of the homeowners.
[01:37:09.000 --> 01:37:17.000]  So you're saying that they're actually paying off the payment intangible stream that somebody else created.
[01:37:17.000 --> 01:37:19.000]  Is that what you're saying?
[01:37:19.000 --> 01:37:26.000]  Correct, I'm saying this intangible payment obligation was created by the account debtor.
[01:37:26.000 --> 01:37:29.000]  A separate third party.
[01:37:29.000 --> 01:37:36.000]  That is what was secured by this collateralized debt obligation.
[01:37:36.000 --> 01:37:40.000]  This brings a question to my mind.
[01:37:40.000 --> 01:37:48.000]  If the amount of the private mortgage insurance is added to my payment
[01:37:48.000 --> 01:37:56.000]  And I default, have I not bought insurance against the default?
[01:37:56.000 --> 01:37:59.000]  No, not your default, no.
[01:37:59.000 --> 01:38:05.000]  If I haven't, then my payments are unconscionable.
[01:38:05.000 --> 01:38:07.000]  I'm paying for nothing.
[01:38:07.000 --> 01:38:15.000]  If you go read most of the data trusts, and there's another question that I'm going to get to real quick.
[01:38:15.000 --> 01:38:20.000]  When Joe Esquivel would talk about federal, state, and local law jurisdictions,
[01:38:20.000 --> 01:38:25.000]  Is that and or do all those laws apply?
[01:38:25.000 --> 01:38:31.000]  The question that needs to be looked at and addressed because it's interesting.
[01:38:31.000 --> 01:38:38.000]  And it's like with the data trust, if you sell the note,
[01:38:38.000 --> 01:38:49.000]  Does the mortgage automatically follow it in accordance to what law?
[01:38:49.000 --> 01:38:53.000]  Yes, the mortgage follows the note.
[01:38:53.000 --> 01:38:59.000]  The properly secured note.
[01:38:59.000 --> 01:39:03.000]  That is what follows.
[01:39:03.000 --> 01:39:08.000]  If it is a properly secured note, yes, the mortgage follows it.
[01:39:08.000 --> 01:39:12.000]  If it is not properly secured and it's an unsecured obligation.
[01:39:12.000 --> 01:39:22.000]  If the mortgage follows it, would it also not be required that every time the note is sold into securitization,
[01:39:22.000 --> 01:39:25.000]  And according to local laws or jurisdiction or state law,
[01:39:25.000 --> 01:39:34.000]  To perfect an interest in it, that they need to comply with whatever recording laws are applicable.
[01:39:34.000 --> 01:39:43.000]  In many states, they do not have certain assignment statutes.
[01:39:43.000 --> 01:39:53.000]  However, that does not stop what is required by law to have a properly perfected lien.
[01:39:53.000 --> 01:39:56.000]  Let me address a little bit here.
[01:39:56.000 --> 01:40:08.000]  While the law does not require the person to report the change in holdership of the deed of trust,
[01:40:08.000 --> 01:40:13.000]  Especially in Texas, they don't have to report it if they don't want to.
[01:40:13.000 --> 01:40:18.000]  But if they don't, the claim is void as to the holder.
[01:40:18.000 --> 01:40:24.000]  This is a free country and you are free to screw yourself if you want to.
[01:40:24.000 --> 01:40:27.000]  That would be correct.
[01:40:27.000 --> 01:40:32.000]  What I am getting to is while they may not be required to file it,
[01:40:32.000 --> 01:40:37.000]  If they don't file it, then they lose the claim.
[01:40:37.000 --> 01:40:39.000]  Would you agree with that James?
[01:40:39.000 --> 01:40:44.000]  They don't have a perfected right to claim the title.
[01:40:44.000 --> 01:40:52.000]  In Texas, 13.001 says that any claim against title not acknowledged or proven
[01:40:52.000 --> 01:40:58.000]  And properly filed with the county recorder is void as to the holder.
[01:40:58.000 --> 01:41:03.000]  That's pretty well common across all the 50 states too.
[01:41:03.000 --> 01:41:11.000]  I would think if that's not there, then there is no reason to have a county registrar.
[01:41:11.000 --> 01:41:18.000]  While I haven't seen that requirement in every state, it almost has to be there.
[01:41:18.000 --> 01:41:24.000]  Okay, now let's look at MERS and let's look at the negotiable instrument.
[01:41:24.000 --> 01:41:29.000]  If the negotiable instrument are the homeowner's note, if the banks argue in court,
[01:41:29.000 --> 01:41:34.000]  It's a better instrument if we didn't identify who they are.
[01:41:34.000 --> 01:41:40.000]  How can MERS be an agent of an unidentified party?
[01:41:40.000 --> 01:41:41.000]  They cannot.
[01:41:41.000 --> 01:41:47.000]  There is no agency relationship to an anti-Vietnamese party.
[01:41:47.000 --> 01:41:52.000]  So MERS cannot be a party.
[01:41:52.000 --> 01:41:55.000]  MERS cannot claim an agency relationship.
[01:41:55.000 --> 01:41:57.000]  Okay, next question.
[01:41:57.000 --> 01:42:09.000]  If the PSAs in all of this say we're going to go and use the MERS membership to avoid state law,
[01:42:09.000 --> 01:42:13.000]  is that in violation of the U.S. Constitution?
[01:42:13.000 --> 01:42:23.000]  That would be in violation of the state's rights to follow the state's law.
[01:42:23.000 --> 01:42:28.000]  They cannot force one to commit a crime.
[01:42:28.000 --> 01:42:39.000]  Do they still follow state law requirements for the lien perfection?
[01:42:39.000 --> 01:42:48.000]  So I would denote in the sale of the payment stream and the sale of the mortgage,
[01:42:48.000 --> 01:42:51.000]  and I use the term mortgage, loosey goosey,
[01:42:51.000 --> 01:42:57.000]  is because the mortgage could be in the tangible homeowner's or the intangible payment stream world.
[01:42:57.000 --> 01:43:05.000]  So I use that term loosey goosey, and I forgot what I was saying or what my question was.
[01:43:05.000 --> 01:43:14.000]  My 92-year-old mama says that is not going to get better.
[01:43:14.000 --> 01:43:20.000]  Okay, we have a stack of callers, and I have one that I'd like to bring up.
[01:43:20.000 --> 01:43:24.000]  The next actually next to me in line is Carlos in California,
[01:43:24.000 --> 01:43:29.000]  and I'd like to bring him up because Carlos always has good questions,
[01:43:29.000 --> 01:43:34.000]  and I think he'll give us some good questions that we can dance with.
[01:43:34.000 --> 01:43:36.000]  Hello, Carlos.
[01:43:36.000 --> 01:43:39.000]  Hello, hi, and thank you, thank you.
[01:43:39.000 --> 01:43:43.000]  Do you have a real mind vendor for us?
[01:43:43.000 --> 01:43:48.000]  Yes, I have a question for all three.
[01:43:48.000 --> 01:43:53.000]  No, I've been foreclosed three years ago.
[01:43:53.000 --> 01:43:55.000]  Carlos, we're going to have to come back to you.
[01:43:55.000 --> 01:44:00.000]  This is Randy Kelton, Joe Esquivel, Deborah Stevens, Rule of Law Radio.
[01:44:00.000 --> 01:44:04.000]  You feel tired when talking about important topics like money and politics?
[01:44:04.000 --> 01:44:05.000]  Sorry.
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[01:44:08.000 --> 01:44:09.000]  What?
[01:44:09.000 --> 01:44:13.000]  If so, you may be diagnosed with the deadliest disease known today, stupidity.
[01:44:13.000 --> 01:44:16.000]  Hi, my name is Steve Holt, and like millions of other Americans,
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[01:44:57.000 --> 01:45:00.000]  and enlarged vocabulary and an overall increase in mental functioning.
[01:45:00.000 --> 01:45:04.000]  Are you the plaintiff or defendant in a lawsuit?
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[01:46:01.000 --> 01:46:21.000]  MUSIC
[01:46:21.000 --> 01:46:23.000]  Okay, we are back.
[01:46:23.000 --> 01:46:27.000]  Randy Kelton, David Stevens, Rule of Law Radio, and my bad, Carlos.
[01:46:27.000 --> 01:46:29.000]  I wasn't watching the clock.
[01:46:29.000 --> 01:46:31.000]  I think Joe Bay will be out.
[01:46:31.000 --> 01:46:36.000]  Okay, where were we, Carlos?
[01:46:36.000 --> 01:46:38.000]  Okay, can you hear me now?
[01:46:38.000 --> 01:46:40.000]  Yes, we can.
[01:46:40.000 --> 01:46:41.000]  Okay, good, good.
[01:46:41.000 --> 01:46:44.000]  Now, how far can I go on?
[01:46:44.000 --> 01:46:46.000]  I've been for Rose three years ago.
[01:46:46.000 --> 01:46:51.000]  How far can I go and try to locate my Pulling Services Agreement
[01:46:51.000 --> 01:46:56.000]  or anything that has to do with the private securitization
[01:46:56.000 --> 01:47:03.000]  that was done by World Savings, Wells Fargo, and Wachovia?
[01:47:03.000 --> 01:47:05.000]  That's going to be a tough one,
[01:47:05.000 --> 01:47:10.000]  because there are no World Savings prospectuses out there,
[01:47:10.000 --> 01:47:17.000]  as World Savings Bank is a privately traded entity.
[01:47:17.000 --> 01:47:19.000]  There is a limited number of investors,
[01:47:19.000 --> 01:47:25.000]  and they were not required to put out a 424B5 prospectus.
[01:47:25.000 --> 01:47:31.000]  I do have a copy of a 424B5 prospectus
[01:47:31.000 --> 01:47:35.000]  for one of the World Savings Bank remakes.
[01:47:35.000 --> 01:47:38.000]  However, World Savings Bank, Carlos,
[01:47:38.000 --> 01:47:46.000]  they were their own seller, sponsor, depositor, trustee,
[01:47:46.000 --> 01:47:51.000]  and it's very hard to get information on World Savings Bank,
[01:47:51.000 --> 01:47:54.000]  and yes, they were taken over by Wachovia,
[01:47:54.000 --> 01:47:58.000]  and again, yes, there are requirements of law
[01:47:58.000 --> 01:48:02.000]  that were to have taken place,
[01:48:02.000 --> 01:48:06.000]  but getting access to the information is very hard.
[01:48:06.000 --> 01:48:12.000]  You're not going to find any prospectus on the SEC for this.
[01:48:12.000 --> 01:48:14.000]  Okay, now, good.
[01:48:14.000 --> 01:48:15.000]  I kind of knew that,
[01:48:15.000 --> 01:48:20.000]  but I weapon that you had a better answer for me, but it's fine.
[01:48:20.000 --> 01:48:26.000]  Now, my question is this, were they supposed to do an assignment
[01:48:26.000 --> 01:48:30.000]  or conveyance from World to Wachovia to Wells Fargo
[01:48:30.000 --> 01:48:33.000]  and record it, or even if they don't record it,
[01:48:33.000 --> 01:48:38.000]  to have done an assessment?
[01:48:38.000 --> 01:48:41.000]  All right, were they supposed to do an assignment
[01:48:41.000 --> 01:48:47.000]  regarding your personal asset?
[01:48:47.000 --> 01:48:53.000]  Anything, anything that says that World Savings hereby conveys
[01:48:53.000 --> 01:48:58.000]  the Addito Trust or makes Wells Fargo the holder,
[01:48:58.000 --> 01:49:01.000]  what really counts is the holder.
[01:49:01.000 --> 01:49:04.000]  Let me address that, Carlos.
[01:49:04.000 --> 01:49:09.000]  If World Savings merged with Wachovia,
[01:49:09.000 --> 01:49:13.000]  then they became the same entity.
[01:49:13.000 --> 01:49:20.000]  There wouldn't have to be a filing in the record of change of holder status.
[01:49:20.000 --> 01:49:29.000]  If Wachovia took over World Savings, accrued their assets,
[01:49:29.000 --> 01:49:31.000]  there would have to be,
[01:49:31.000 --> 01:49:38.000]  World Savings would have had to transfer the right to the privilege
[01:49:38.000 --> 01:49:45.000]  to foreclose, to exercise a claim against the property and a confessed judgment.
[01:49:45.000 --> 01:49:50.000]  That privilege would have had to have been transferred to Wachovia.
[01:49:50.000 --> 01:49:53.000]  Otherwise, World Savings would have abandoned it.
[01:49:53.000 --> 01:49:57.000]  That's what Washington Mutual did.
[01:49:57.000 --> 01:50:02.000]  They didn't transfer any of their claims, so they abandoned them.
[01:50:02.000 --> 01:50:03.000]  Okay.
[01:50:03.000 --> 01:50:05.000]  Have you looked in the county record?
[01:50:05.000 --> 01:50:14.000]  Is there an assignment of note and deed of trust from World Savings to Wachovia?
[01:50:14.000 --> 01:50:15.000]  No.
[01:50:15.000 --> 01:50:16.000]  No, there's none.
[01:50:16.000 --> 01:50:18.000]  This is what happened.
[01:50:18.000 --> 01:50:26.000]  At the end, Wells Fargo ended up foreclosing on me, right?
[01:50:26.000 --> 01:50:30.000]  They sent me everything.
[01:50:30.000 --> 01:50:32.000]  They foreclosed on me.
[01:50:32.000 --> 01:50:34.000]  That's Wells Fargo.
[01:50:34.000 --> 01:50:40.000]  On the trustee's deed of unsale, it says very clearly, as I already mentioned this,
[01:50:40.000 --> 01:50:46.000]  it says very clearly the grantee, I mean that's Wells Fargo because the property did not sell,
[01:50:46.000 --> 01:50:50.000]  and the property went back to Wells Fargo.
[01:50:50.000 --> 01:50:53.000]  It says the grantee was not the foreclosing beneficiary.
[01:50:53.000 --> 01:50:58.000]  Now, if he's not the foreclosing beneficiary, why did they foreclose?
[01:50:58.000 --> 01:51:00.000]  This is a question for Joe.
[01:51:00.000 --> 01:51:09.000]  Okay, you're going to issues that you're jumping over a couple of things.
[01:51:09.000 --> 01:51:15.000]  The foreclosing agent, whoever is claiming authority to foreclose,
[01:51:15.000 --> 01:51:20.000]  they have to have subject matter jurisdiction.
[01:51:20.000 --> 01:51:21.000]  I'm sorry.
[01:51:21.000 --> 01:51:28.000]  They have to have standing to invoke the subject matter jurisdiction of the court.
[01:51:28.000 --> 01:51:31.000]  We don't go anywhere until we get past that part.
[01:51:31.000 --> 01:51:38.000]  Now, this entity came to the court and said, I'm going to foreclose on this entity.
[01:51:38.000 --> 01:51:44.000]  Well, how did they accrue authority to do that?
[01:51:44.000 --> 01:51:49.000]  The only way they can do that is by the county record.
[01:51:49.000 --> 01:51:55.000]  If it's not in the county record, they don't have it, period.
[01:51:55.000 --> 01:52:01.000]  That was the statute I referred to here in Texas, 13.001 property code.
[01:52:01.000 --> 01:52:08.000]  You're going to have one similar in California that says we have this county registrar.
[01:52:08.000 --> 01:52:12.000]  If you don't file your claims with the county registrar,
[01:52:12.000 --> 01:52:22.000]  then the claim is void as to the holder because if you want me to work on your property
[01:52:22.000 --> 01:52:31.000]  and you want to pay me on time, I need a warranty deed or a material man's lien or a mechanics lien.
[01:52:31.000 --> 01:52:38.000]  I'm going to go to the record, and I have a right to trust what I see there.
[01:52:38.000 --> 01:52:44.000]  If I don't see a claim by this company, I have a right to trust that.
[01:52:44.000 --> 01:52:48.000]  They can't come back later and say, well, I had a claim before you did
[01:52:48.000 --> 01:52:50.000]  because he didn't file it in the record.
[01:52:50.000 --> 01:52:54.000]  So the first place to look is in that record.
[01:52:54.000 --> 01:52:57.000]  If you're getting in there, they can't get past that.
[01:52:57.000 --> 01:53:01.000]  My point is this, that on the trusted upon sale,
[01:53:01.000 --> 01:53:06.000]  he says that what was possible was not double-closing beneficiary.
[01:53:06.000 --> 01:53:08.000]  He says right on there.
[01:53:08.000 --> 01:53:16.000]  I mean, the question is, if you're not double-closing beneficiary, why did you foreclose?
[01:53:16.000 --> 01:53:21.000]  They're claiming that they had acquired the right when, in fact,
[01:53:21.000 --> 01:53:31.000]  an interest of your loan was sold many years ago prior to World Savings Bank going under.
[01:53:31.000 --> 01:53:40.000]  It's similar to JPMorgan Chase coming forth and claiming as successor an interest to Washington Mutual.
[01:53:40.000 --> 01:53:47.000]  However, if you look deeper at it, if an interest of your loan was sold to a World Savings Trust,
[01:53:47.000 --> 01:53:56.000]  which it probably was, however, it was not entered into public record.
[01:53:56.000 --> 01:54:02.000]  And when Wells Fargo took over Wachovia, they claimed successor an interest.
[01:54:02.000 --> 01:54:11.000]  However, that asset had been sold long years prior to that.
[01:54:11.000 --> 01:54:13.000]  Yeah, and they just claimed successor an interest.
[01:54:13.000 --> 01:54:16.000]  We don't care about that.
[01:54:16.000 --> 01:54:26.000]  If they did not have the claim properly transferred to them in the record, they may be the legitimate holder.
[01:54:26.000 --> 01:54:31.000]  They still don't have capacity to foreclose.
[01:54:31.000 --> 01:54:34.000]  It's not enough to hold the note.
[01:54:34.000 --> 01:54:40.000]  You have to have standing and capacity, capacity by way,
[01:54:40.000 --> 01:54:45.000]  by virtue of being in compliance with all the covenants of the deed of trust,
[01:54:45.000 --> 01:54:49.000]  and by virtue of compliance with all law.
[01:54:49.000 --> 01:54:57.000]  And the law in every state is going to say, if you didn't file that in the record, you can't claim it.
[01:54:57.000 --> 01:54:59.000]  So we don't care if they actually hold it or not.
[01:54:59.000 --> 01:55:02.000]  Does that make sense, Carlos?
[01:55:02.000 --> 01:55:05.000]  It makes a lot of sense, and let's comment.
[01:55:05.000 --> 01:55:15.000]  I went to the IRS, and the 1099 was filed by Wachovia.
[01:55:15.000 --> 01:55:23.000]  And Wachovia did not merge with Washington, I mean, with Wells Fargo.
[01:55:23.000 --> 01:55:26.000]  Wells Fargo purchased it.
[01:55:26.000 --> 01:55:38.000]  And if Wells Fargo purchases it, then Wachovia would have to transfer its claim from Wachovia to Wells Fargo.
[01:55:38.000 --> 01:55:43.000]  If they didn't do that in the county record, then they abandoned it.
[01:55:43.000 --> 01:55:48.000]  I have a property in Frisco, Texas that was Washington Mutual.
[01:55:48.000 --> 01:55:57.000]  And five years later, JPMorgan Chase came and filed an assignment of substitute trustee.
[01:55:57.000 --> 01:56:00.000]  And I said, who the heck are you?
[01:56:00.000 --> 01:56:02.000]  And they say they accrued all the assets.
[01:56:02.000 --> 01:56:05.000]  So what?
[01:56:05.000 --> 01:56:07.000]  What assets, Randy?
[01:56:07.000 --> 01:56:11.000]  Are we talking simple possession with no legal rights?
[01:56:11.000 --> 01:56:19.000]  Because if they would come forth saying that we are successor in interest, all right, sure, all right, you've purchased it.
[01:56:19.000 --> 01:56:21.000]  What did you purchase?
[01:56:21.000 --> 01:56:24.000]  You purchased personal property.
[01:56:24.000 --> 01:56:33.000]  You purchased boxes of these documents, just papers, which have been stripped of their value.
[01:56:33.000 --> 01:56:41.000]  So now you become the owner of this personal property assets.
[01:56:41.000 --> 01:56:53.000]  And you have simple possession with no legal rights versus legal possession with legal rights to enforce.
[01:56:53.000 --> 01:57:07.000]  Yes, and you know, you brought up selling the rights to the income stream if you hold the note and you hold the deed of trust, but you sold the right to the income stream.
[01:57:07.000 --> 01:57:20.000]  And well, if you if you just sold the right to collect the income, you as a claimant cannot be harmed.
[01:57:20.000 --> 01:57:30.000]  Therefore, you cannot come to the court and bring a true controversy to the court because you have to show harm and you can't do that.
[01:57:30.000 --> 01:57:35.000]  The person who bought the income stream can show harm, but they don't hold the deed of trust.
[01:57:35.000 --> 01:57:38.000]  So they can't come to the court and enforce that.
[01:57:38.000 --> 01:57:41.000]  All they can do is go against the account debtor.
[01:57:41.000 --> 01:57:42.000]  Exactly.
[01:57:42.000 --> 01:57:46.000]  Well, they can't even go against the account debtor because you didn't agree to pay them squat.
[01:57:46.000 --> 01:57:53.000]  No, no, no, no. The intangible obligate can go against the account debtor because the account debtor defaulting on his loan.
[01:57:53.000 --> 01:58:01.000]  But the intangible obligate cannot go against the tangible obligor.
[01:58:01.000 --> 01:58:05.000]  You just gave me a headache.
[01:58:05.000 --> 01:58:07.000]  I get that. Hang on.
[01:58:07.000 --> 01:58:09.000]  Let's pick this up on the other side.
[01:58:09.000 --> 01:58:12.000]  We're about to go to the top of the hour break.
[01:58:12.000 --> 01:58:20.000]  This is Randy Kelton, Debbie Stevens, Rule of Law Radio, our call in number 512-646-1984.
[01:58:20.000 --> 01:58:26.000]  We have a stack of callers, Gloria, Darlene, Clayton, Thomas, Robert.
[01:58:26.000 --> 01:58:29.000]  We will get you all in order.
[01:58:29.000 --> 01:58:34.000]  But from there, since this is going into the third hour, we'll take calls on any subject.
[01:58:34.000 --> 01:58:39.000]  So give us a call, 512-646-1984.
[01:58:39.000 --> 01:58:43.000]  We'll be right back on the other side.
[01:59:09.000 --> 01:59:13.000]  First, this new translation is extremely faithful and accurate.
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