[00:00.000 --> 00:11.680]  In Baghdad Friday, 27 people were killed and 50 wounded in bomb attacks targeting Shiite
[00:11.680 --> 00:16.120]  Muslim worshippers as they emerged from mosques.
[00:16.120 --> 00:21.480]  The leader of Boko Haram, a Nigerian Islamic group blamed for a series of deadly attacks
[00:21.480 --> 00:25.160]  in the north of the country, has been shot dead by police.
[00:25.160 --> 00:31.080]  However, Human Rights Watch described Yusuf's death as an extrajudicial killing.
[00:31.080 --> 00:36.000]  At least 50 Iranians were arrested Thursday in Tehran when thousands of people gathered
[00:36.000 --> 00:40.960]  to commemorate the 30 people killed in the country's post-election unrest.
[00:40.960 --> 00:47.400]  Mourners swarmed Tehran's main cemetery on the 40th day since the death of Nader Agha
[00:47.400 --> 00:52.360]  Sultan, a young woman whose death shocked Iranians and people around the world.
[00:52.360 --> 00:56.960]  This news brief brought to you by the International News Net.
[00:56.960 --> 01:02.640]  Colonel Timothy Reese, a senior U.S. advisor to the Iraqi military, has concluded in a
[01:02.640 --> 01:08.080]  blunt memo, it is time for the U.S. to declare victory and go home.
[01:08.080 --> 01:13.440]  The memo details tensions that emerged between Iraqi and U.S. military officers when American
[01:13.440 --> 01:16.720]  troops withdrew from Iraqi cities last month.
[01:16.720 --> 01:22.280]  The Iraqi government's forceful moves to assert authority since then have concerned some American
[01:22.280 --> 01:23.560]  officers.
[01:23.560 --> 01:29.280]  The memo criticizes Iraqi military weaknesses, including corruption, poor management, and
[01:29.280 --> 01:32.640]  the inability to resist Shiite political pressure.
[01:32.640 --> 01:37.960]  Reese argues extending the American military presence beyond August 2010 will do little
[01:37.960 --> 01:43.880]  to improve the Iraqis' military performance while fueling growing resentment of Americans.
[01:43.880 --> 01:50.440]  Reese wrote, as the old saying goes, guests, like fish, begin to smell after three days,
[01:50.440 --> 01:57.200]  adding, since signing the 2009 security agreement, we are guests in Iraq, and after six years
[01:57.200 --> 02:03.960]  we now smell bad to the Iraqi nose.
[02:03.960 --> 02:08.540]  Former British Prime Minister Tony Blair will be called to give evidence before a full-scale
[02:08.540 --> 02:11.400]  inquiry into the Iraq war.
[02:11.400 --> 02:16.600]  Sir John Chilcott, the former senior civil servant who chairs the inquiry, said Thursday
[02:16.600 --> 02:19.960]  the inquiry will be rigorous, fair, and frank.
[02:19.960 --> 02:25.280]  But critics raised fears Blair and others could escape the spotlight after Sir John
[02:25.280 --> 02:31.000]  said some sessions could be behind closed doors to ensure complete candor as well as
[02:31.000 --> 02:33.120]  protect national security.
[02:33.120 --> 02:39.120]  Chilcott said the formal giving of oral open witness testimony is crucial for the key actors
[02:39.120 --> 02:45.240]  and decision makers, opening the prospect of some being televised and streamed online.
[02:45.240 --> 02:49.360]  Chilcott added, if we find mistakes were made, we will say so.
[02:49.360 --> 02:54.240]  Prime Minister Gordon Brown was forced to back away from suggestions the inquiry be
[02:54.240 --> 03:01.120]  held in private after a public outcry.
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[03:20.040 --> 03:24.000]  I had no idea that the number one cause of the disease is found in almost every home
[03:24.000 --> 03:26.160]  in America, the television.
[03:26.160 --> 03:31.160]  Unfortunately, that puts most Americans at risk of catching stupidity, but there is hope.
[03:31.160 --> 03:34.920]  The staff at Brave New Books have helped me and thousands of other foxaholics suffering
[03:34.920 --> 03:39.820]  from sports-zombieism recover, and because of Brave New Books, I now enjoy reading and
[03:39.820 --> 03:44.720]  watching educational documentaries without feeling tired or uninterested, so if you or
[03:44.720 --> 03:51.960]  anybody you know suffers from stupidity, then you need to call 512-480-2503 or visit them
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[04:00.960 --> 04:09.440]  You are listening to the Rule of Law Radio Network at ruleoflawradio.com, live free speech
[04:09.440 --> 04:16.440]  talk radio at it's best.
[05:09.440 --> 05:39.200]  All right, bad boys, whatcha gonna do?
[05:39.200 --> 05:46.880]  Randy Kelton and Deborah Stevens and Eddie Craig, of course.
[05:46.880 --> 05:52.240]  It's Friday evening, our four-hour info marathon.
[05:52.240 --> 06:00.680]  Okay, tonight we wanted to start off the show talking about this case where there was a
[06:00.680 --> 06:04.760]  ruling on the 27th by Judge Hellerstein.
[06:04.760 --> 06:10.200]  This is an ongoing case for the last several years, Con Edison, an electric company that
[06:10.200 --> 06:16.040]  ran infrastructure in the basement of World Trade Center 7, suing the New York City Port
[06:16.040 --> 06:25.200]  Authority for reimbursement of damages, has to do with collection of insurance, and they
[06:25.200 --> 06:27.720]  have two torts.
[06:27.720 --> 06:33.840]  Now we want to go over this case because part of it, we don't want to get everyone up in
[06:33.840 --> 06:42.840]  a big to-do that there's a court ruling where it shows that the construction of the World
[06:42.840 --> 06:49.400]  Trade Center, negligence in the construction, this is the BS line of thinking.
[06:49.400 --> 06:51.520]  It's not even an official story.
[06:51.520 --> 06:57.680]  This is just a line of talk in propaganda articles, in propaganda publications like
[06:57.680 --> 07:06.440]  Popular Mechanics and other such writings in WorldNet Daily and other mainstream news
[07:06.440 --> 07:07.440]  articles.
[07:07.440 --> 07:12.560]  There hasn't even been an official government story regarding the destruction of Building
[07:12.560 --> 07:17.480]  7, except I think recently NIST said something about thermal inversion, which didn't even
[07:17.480 --> 07:26.520]  make any sense, but the popular propaganda is that, oh, there was a defect, faulty construction,
[07:26.520 --> 07:34.680]  a faulty design in the architecture of World Trade Center 7 is what caused the building
[07:34.680 --> 07:40.000]  to collapse due to a fire.
[07:40.000 --> 07:42.600]  That was one of the claims of Con Edison.
[07:42.600 --> 07:47.360]  They were saying, well, their infrastructure that was under the building in the basement
[07:47.360 --> 07:53.560]  got damaged due to the collapse of the building, and they are claiming that there was a faulty
[07:53.560 --> 07:58.640]  design and that there was not only breach of contract on the part of the contract that
[07:58.640 --> 08:03.240]  Con Edison had with the Port Authority, but they're also claiming tort.
[08:03.240 --> 08:09.880]  Now, I've read through this case as best I could in the last hour or two since I got
[08:09.880 --> 08:16.000]  home, and basically it's like yes and no.
[08:16.000 --> 08:17.920]  We may have something to stand on.
[08:17.920 --> 08:20.040]  We may not here.
[08:20.040 --> 08:26.640]  Okay, now one of the reasons that their tort claim was blown off is, and here it is on
[08:26.640 --> 08:34.960]  page 20, it's saying Con Edison cannot succeed on the tort claim because they did not maintain,
[08:34.960 --> 08:40.800]  they did not show any proof that any state or municipal ordinance was violated, okay?
[08:40.800 --> 08:47.400]  They can't show that there were any fire or safety codes or any municipal building codes
[08:47.400 --> 08:53.840]  or ordinances that were violated, okay, and so they can't, they have no leg to stand on
[08:53.840 --> 08:54.840]  there.
[08:54.840 --> 09:01.800]  Okay, now that just means to me that they haven't shown legitimate evidence that there
[09:01.800 --> 09:09.920]  were defects in the building, but the judge also said that even if they were able to show
[09:09.920 --> 09:16.920]  certain things, it wouldn't necessarily mean that they wouldn't have suffered any damage,
[09:16.920 --> 09:20.080]  and so it's too much extrapolation.
[09:20.080 --> 09:28.200]  It's too much conjecture in order to reach that point, so basically they haven't shown
[09:28.200 --> 09:35.000]  by matter of fact that because of specific engineering construction and here's the angles
[09:35.000 --> 09:40.800]  and here's the forces, et cetera, et cetera, that that's why this fire was able to cause
[09:40.800 --> 09:45.160]  this kind of damage to cause the collapse in this particular manner, which everyone
[09:45.160 --> 09:51.040]  knows is seven second free fall perfect style demolition, okay?
[09:51.040 --> 09:57.080]  Now it looks to me like the judge kind of skirts the issue most of the time and is basically
[09:57.080 --> 10:02.760]  saying, well, you know, he granted them some insurance relief, but he didn't grant them
[10:02.760 --> 10:09.040]  reimbursement because they were not able to show that any acts or omissions on the part
[10:09.040 --> 10:12.080]  of the port authority caused any damage.
[10:12.080 --> 10:19.000]  Now here is, here's the catch phrase, here's the key that shows me that this is like almost
[10:19.000 --> 10:29.320]  a smoking gun to separate out what this official propaganda line of crapola is that they're
[10:29.320 --> 10:36.160]  trying to feed the American public that because of intrinsic design flaws, that's why the
[10:36.160 --> 10:40.400]  fire was able to cause a seven second free fall collapse, okay?
[10:40.400 --> 10:47.720]  On page 16 of this ruling, okay, he's saying the phrase caused by the acts or omissions
[10:47.720 --> 10:53.340]  of the port authority, that's in their contract that they had, okay, tied to the phrase immediately
[10:53.340 --> 10:58.280]  falling in connection with the construction or maintenance of the story structures, buildings
[10:58.280 --> 11:04.280]  or improvement design in section eight was not intended to extend to damages arising
[11:04.280 --> 11:11.840]  when some outside event causes damage to the structure of the building, in turn causing
[11:11.840 --> 11:20.520]  damage allegedly in combination with the latent effects of design negligence to the Con Edison
[11:20.520 --> 11:23.440]  structure beneath and beside the building, okay?
[11:23.440 --> 11:31.440]  So he's very clearly saying here that, okay, on the part of the port authority, they can't
[11:31.440 --> 11:39.840]  claim negligence in the design structure if an outside event caused damage to the structure,
[11:39.840 --> 11:40.840]  okay?
[11:40.840 --> 11:47.720]  And the judge was saying earlier that in this document that debris from World Trade Center
[11:47.720 --> 11:52.480]  one and two fell on World Trade Center seven, so he, and I'll read a part earlier where
[11:52.480 --> 11:57.520]  he's very clearly saying that these were outside events, all right, and here he goes again,
[11:57.520 --> 12:03.880]  the acts of the terrorists against towers one and two were not acts or omissions of
[12:03.880 --> 12:10.240]  the port authority in relation to World Trade Center seven, nor were the design and existence
[12:10.240 --> 12:16.960]  of the World Trade Center seven incidents, quote, in connection with the construction
[12:16.960 --> 12:21.360]  or maintenance of that building, okay?
[12:21.360 --> 12:26.840]  To me, that's the dead bang phrase right there, the World Trade Center seven incidents were
[12:26.840 --> 12:33.440]  not in connection with the construction or maintenance of that building, period.
[12:33.440 --> 12:40.560]  In other words, the building did not fall due to design flaws, all right?
[12:40.560 --> 12:49.160]  And that has been the crux of the lie that, oh, design flaws, that's why the fire was
[12:49.160 --> 12:50.480]  able to melt the building.
[12:50.480 --> 12:54.720]  So he says it right there, the existence of the incidents of the World Trade Center seven
[12:54.720 --> 12:58.240]  incidents were not in connection with the construction or maintenance of the building,
[12:58.240 --> 12:59.240]  okay?
[12:59.240 --> 13:02.440]  And that was one of the main reasons why the judge denied the claim.
[13:02.440 --> 13:07.000]  However, he still does purport the lie, the judge does still purport the lie because on
[13:07.000 --> 13:14.440]  page one, he says World Trade Center seven collapsed, brought down by the raging fires,
[13:14.440 --> 13:15.440]  okay?
[13:15.440 --> 13:20.800]  So he's still saying that the fires brought down the building, but he's saying that it
[13:20.800 --> 13:26.040]  wasn't because of the design flaw, any alleged design flaw which may or may not exist, that
[13:26.040 --> 13:30.160]  wasn't the reason that the fires brought down the building, okay?
[13:30.160 --> 13:36.640]  So at least we've poked a major hole in it so far, that's the way it looks to me.
[13:36.640 --> 13:37.640]  Randy?
[13:37.640 --> 13:38.640]  Don't agree.
[13:38.640 --> 13:43.160]  Well, that's what it says, I just read it in black and white.
[13:43.160 --> 13:46.760]  Well, what you did was read it out of context.
[13:46.760 --> 13:48.360]  Not exactly.
[13:48.360 --> 13:52.640]  He's not talking about what did or did not bring down the building.
[13:52.640 --> 14:00.960]  What he's talking about is Con Edison's claim against the Port Authority.
[14:00.960 --> 14:10.680]  And above he says that they can't claim structural flaws because the building was exempt from
[14:10.680 --> 14:13.960]  building code.
[14:13.960 --> 14:25.320]  And there was an apparent outside influence that in any case, Con Edison was insured and
[14:25.320 --> 14:27.480]  he gave them the insurance.
[14:27.480 --> 14:32.880]  They're claiming exemplary damages and what he's saying is because of the contract they
[14:32.880 --> 14:38.000]  had signed, they don't have a right to those exemplary damages.
[14:38.000 --> 14:43.880]  Con Edison tried to interpret the contract in a way that would give them extra damages
[14:43.880 --> 14:49.480]  and this is all about the fact that it doesn't make any difference.
[14:49.480 --> 14:50.840]  Yeah, I know.
[14:50.840 --> 14:51.840]  It doesn't make any difference.
[14:51.840 --> 14:57.280]  Why the building came down, that if it came down because of terrorists, Con Ed would have
[14:57.280 --> 14:58.280]  no claim.
[14:58.280 --> 15:01.840]  If it came down because of something in the building, they would still have no claim.
[15:01.840 --> 15:10.640]  Yeah, but the point is in his ruling, he is still making a statement and this was not
[15:10.640 --> 15:15.360]  claimed in Con Edison's pleadings either.
[15:15.360 --> 15:22.960]  He is just saying straight up that the incidents of the World Trade Center seven incidents
[15:22.960 --> 15:28.840]  are not in connection with the construction and maintenance of the building, period.
[15:28.840 --> 15:35.840]  And that is a very strong statement there to poke a hole in the official propaganda
[15:35.840 --> 15:40.920]  which states that because of the design flaw, that's why the fires were able to bring down
[15:40.920 --> 15:41.920]  the building.
[15:41.920 --> 15:49.280]  I'm just talking here about that there is now a high level judge that is drawing a line
[15:49.280 --> 15:50.280]  here.
[15:50.280 --> 15:51.280]  All right?
[15:51.280 --> 15:58.400]  If you read the rest of the case, he's saying that Con Ed brought them no evidence of any
[15:58.400 --> 15:59.400]  shoddy construction.
[15:59.400 --> 16:01.040]  Oh, I know that.
[16:01.040 --> 16:04.440]  So he's having to deal with what he has in front of it.
[16:04.440 --> 16:05.440]  Exactly.
[16:05.440 --> 16:07.240]  And he's saying that it doesn't matter.
[16:07.240 --> 16:11.840]  He's saying that it doesn't matter whether there were design flaws or not.
[16:11.840 --> 16:19.600]  He is just simply stating that whatever the construction of the building was, whether
[16:19.600 --> 16:26.520]  it was faulty or not, that had nothing to do with the fall of the building.
[16:26.520 --> 16:28.280]  Doesn't matter.
[16:28.280 --> 16:30.360]  And that is crucial to me.
[16:30.360 --> 16:33.480]  This case will be worthless for as president.
[16:33.480 --> 16:35.680]  I'm going to skip the break here.
[16:35.680 --> 16:40.800]  It's worthless as president because it doesn't directly address the issue.
[16:40.800 --> 16:41.800]  Okay.
[16:41.800 --> 16:44.800]  You don't understand the point here, okay?
[16:44.800 --> 16:51.000]  The point has to do with how the public perceives, okay?
[16:51.000 --> 16:58.680]  This is about education and this is about propaganda, all right?
[16:58.680 --> 17:06.000]  And this is about one guy is saying one thing and another guy is saying another thing.
[17:06.000 --> 17:07.880]  So which one is it?
[17:07.880 --> 17:15.360]  And it's enough to cause a question mark in people's minds that you've got NIST talking
[17:15.360 --> 17:20.360]  this bull crap about thermal inversion, which doesn't even make any sense to anyone, whether
[17:20.360 --> 17:28.040]  they're an engineer or not, and then you've got popular mechanics, which some people think
[17:28.040 --> 17:30.960]  is like the Bible of engineering, all right?
[17:30.960 --> 17:37.440]  And then you've just got mainstream media articles that are just spewing this crap saying
[17:37.440 --> 17:44.080]  that well, because there was a design flaw, that's why the fire was able to bring the
[17:44.080 --> 17:45.920]  building down, all right?
[17:45.920 --> 17:51.560]  And you've got this high-profile case of an electric company suing the Port Authority
[17:51.560 --> 17:58.120]  basically standing on that lie, okay, that it was a design flaw, that's why the fire
[17:58.120 --> 18:00.000]  was able to bring the building down.
[18:00.000 --> 18:05.800]  And now the judge is basically saying it doesn't matter whether the building was flawed in
[18:05.800 --> 18:11.200]  its design or not, that's not what brought the building down, okay?
[18:11.200 --> 18:17.880]  And so it's about education and showing people that what they're being fed in the mainstream
[18:17.880 --> 18:22.040]  media isn't necessarily true because it ain't standing up in court.
[18:22.040 --> 18:30.280]  Well, what he really said was he had no evidence before him, and because he wasn't addressing
[18:30.280 --> 18:35.040]  that issue, he didn't exhaustively examine that issue, he clearly said they're making
[18:35.040 --> 18:36.040]  a difference.
[18:36.040 --> 18:39.760]  But that's not all he said, Randy.
[18:39.760 --> 18:42.920]  It's not that he just wasn't broad enough.
[18:42.920 --> 18:49.960]  He is making a just straight-out statement that the World Trade Center seven incidents
[18:49.960 --> 18:56.920]  were not in connection and neither were the terrorist acts, acts or omissions of the Port
[18:56.920 --> 18:57.920]  Authority.
[18:57.920 --> 19:04.240]  I mean, he's just saying that as a matter of fact, that the acts of, I mean, so it says
[19:04.240 --> 19:09.240]  the acts of the terrorist against World Traders Center one and two were not acts or omissions
[19:09.240 --> 19:14.720]  of the Port Authority, neither were the design or the incidents of World Trade Center seven
[19:14.720 --> 19:18.120]  in connection with the construction and maintenance of that building, period.
[19:18.120 --> 19:24.000]  And he does not validate, he doesn't validate that decision, that statement by whatever
[19:24.000 --> 19:25.560]  they brought to him.
[19:25.560 --> 19:31.020]  He's just saying that as a matter of fact, just like on page one, he's just throwing
[19:31.020 --> 19:35.840]  it out there saying that, oh, fires brought down the building.
[19:35.840 --> 19:42.320]  That is not, he's not, those particular statements have nothing to do with what evidence or lack
[19:42.320 --> 19:45.920]  thereof that the plaintiff or defendant brought to him.
[19:45.920 --> 19:47.280]  That is his opinion.
[19:47.280 --> 19:49.720]  That is what he's saying of his own accord.
[19:49.720 --> 19:54.880]  The rest just stay and have no probative effect, so they're worthless for us.
[19:54.880 --> 20:00.760]  They're not worthless for us because in the court of public opinion, it's not worthless
[20:00.760 --> 20:07.440]  because you have a high level judge that is saying there's the, anything that has anything
[20:07.440 --> 20:11.920]  to do with the design of the building did not bring the building down.
[20:11.920 --> 20:16.200]  And then you've got other people who are speaking on the part of the government of the official
[20:16.200 --> 20:21.280]  story, quote unquote, propaganda, who are saying that it does.
[20:21.280 --> 20:26.200]  And the point is in the court of public opinion, it makes a difference because in mainstream,
[20:26.200 --> 20:30.640]  here we go, in mainstream media, high level profile court cases, they are contradicting
[20:30.640 --> 20:31.640]  themselves.
[20:31.640 --> 20:36.280]  And that is enough to raise the question in people's mind to do further investigation
[20:36.280 --> 20:40.480]  so that we can get, so that we can get to the bottom of this.
[20:40.480 --> 20:46.640]  See, this is about, this part here is about education and showing people who are so convinced
[20:46.640 --> 20:52.800]  and entrenched in the lie that, well, which liar are you going to believe when they're
[20:52.800 --> 20:55.240]  feeding you multiple stories here?
[20:55.240 --> 20:57.200]  Doesn't that tell you something's wrong?
[20:57.200 --> 20:58.880]  It's about waking people up.
[20:58.880 --> 21:01.400]  It's about, it's a psychological op.
[21:01.400 --> 21:02.400]  Okay.
[21:02.400 --> 21:06.640]  It's not, I'm not talking about, oh, this shows something that we have court precedents
[21:06.640 --> 21:07.640]  on.
[21:07.640 --> 21:08.640]  Okay.
[21:08.640 --> 21:10.280]  Maybe, maybe not.
[21:10.280 --> 21:15.100]  But the point is you've got a high level judge saying these things, totally debunking the
[21:15.100 --> 21:16.640]  official lie.
[21:16.640 --> 21:17.640]  That means something.
[21:17.640 --> 21:20.800]  Oh, didn't totally debunk the official lie.
[21:20.800 --> 21:21.800]  That's the problem.
[21:21.800 --> 21:24.680]  It wasn't probative in any manner.
[21:24.680 --> 21:27.120]  And it comes up, we're kind of grasping at straws.
[21:27.120 --> 21:28.120]  I don't think so.
[21:28.120 --> 21:32.560]  I don't think a case ought to point and spin it so it appears to me.
[21:32.560 --> 21:36.960]  Well, he does still make the stupid claim that the fires brought down the building,
[21:36.960 --> 21:44.840]  but he has debunked straight up that the design structure of the building had anything to
[21:44.840 --> 21:46.520]  do at all with the collapse.
[21:46.520 --> 21:52.200]  And maybe you haven't been following this as much as me, okay, because this is my particular
[21:52.200 --> 21:53.200]  issue.
[21:53.200 --> 22:01.200]  And over the years, that has been the key point of the mainstream media lie propaganda
[22:01.200 --> 22:09.840]  campaign, okay, that it was design structural flaws, that that was the reason that a stupid
[22:09.840 --> 22:13.960]  little piddly, piddly fire was able to bring the building down, okay.
[22:13.960 --> 22:19.720]  And now you've got this judge that is saying this, that that's not true, that that doesn't
[22:19.720 --> 22:22.080]  matter at all, okay.
[22:22.080 --> 22:26.800]  And so, to me, in the court of public opinion, it means a lot.
[22:26.800 --> 22:33.200]  Okay, and maybe it will in that case, but I'm looking at it from his probative effect
[22:33.200 --> 22:37.600]  and I didn't see any in there because it was sort of off point.
[22:37.600 --> 22:43.960]  He never really got to examine the issue of whether or not there were flaws in the building.
[22:43.960 --> 22:50.680]  He said, even if there were flaws in the building, that Con Ed wouldn't have a claim.
[22:50.680 --> 22:53.080]  So he didn't go there.
[22:53.080 --> 22:56.760]  And yeah, but why are you saying that Con Ed wouldn't have a claim if there were flaws
[22:56.760 --> 22:57.760]  in the building?
[22:57.760 --> 23:02.840]  Because this went to the contract and this is what the judge was saying, according to
[23:02.840 --> 23:09.920]  the contract, according to a fair reading of the contract, that Con Ed had no say in
[23:09.920 --> 23:15.520]  the building and Con Ed was insured for all its losses and was reimbursed for all its
[23:15.520 --> 23:18.040]  losses.
[23:18.040 --> 23:27.720]  And the issue of flaws in the building were immaterial to the contract Con Ed had with
[23:27.720 --> 23:30.360]  the Port Authority.
[23:30.360 --> 23:34.840]  So they're trying to introduce an issue that doesn't apply because of the contract.
[23:34.840 --> 23:38.440]  And he states in there that these are very sophisticated contracts.
[23:38.440 --> 23:44.880]  Okay, but Randy, what I'm trying, yes, I understand that, but what I'm trying to say is why do
[23:44.880 --> 23:46.840]  they introduce that issue?
[23:46.840 --> 23:54.560]  The reason they introduce that issue is because that is the heart of the propaganda campaign
[23:54.560 --> 23:55.560]  lie.
[23:55.560 --> 23:59.800]  They were trying to get $250 million in punitive damages.
[23:59.800 --> 24:04.960]  And they were trying to push the point and get it adjudicated in the court system, the
[24:04.960 --> 24:08.120]  heart of the propaganda lie.
[24:08.120 --> 24:12.040]  Which is that they're saying that there's design flaws that caused the building to fall
[24:12.040 --> 24:14.680]  and the judge is saying no.
[24:14.680 --> 24:16.560]  But they produce no evidence to that effect.
[24:16.560 --> 24:18.360]  Because there is none.
[24:18.360 --> 24:24.120]  Well, in their defense, the judge allowed no discovery in that respect.
[24:24.120 --> 24:31.400]  So he didn't even get there because he didn't allow them to develop the evidence.
[24:31.400 --> 24:39.120]  He didn't allow Con Ed to do discovery on the design flaws and just said there wasn't
[24:39.120 --> 24:41.840]  any, that it didn't matter.
[24:41.840 --> 24:45.560]  So he didn't really say there weren't any, he just said it doesn't matter.
[24:45.560 --> 24:51.200]  Yeah, but the point is it doesn't matter either way.
[24:51.200 --> 24:59.400]  Because the reason, the reason he didn't allow the discovery is because he has been told,
[24:59.400 --> 25:02.640]  and I read this on the air last week, I don't have the article pulled up in front of me,
[25:02.640 --> 25:10.360]  he was told by the Justice Department to squash any investigation into 9-11 of any cases that
[25:10.360 --> 25:11.640]  came before his court.
[25:11.640 --> 25:17.160]  And he's the judge that has been overseeing all the civil litigation regarding 9-11.
[25:17.160 --> 25:20.560]  Yeah, and when I read the case, that looked like what he was doing.
[25:20.560 --> 25:27.880]  He was trying to do this dance to go to a lot of trouble not to get to the issues.
[25:27.880 --> 25:30.600]  And that's what this was about.
[25:30.600 --> 25:32.480]  This is about avoiding the issue altogether.
[25:32.480 --> 25:33.480]  But he slipped.
[25:33.480 --> 25:36.760]  He slipped on page 16 and 17.
[25:36.760 --> 25:44.040]  He didn't have to put in his own little two cents there.
[25:44.040 --> 25:45.320]  I kind of agree with that.
[25:45.320 --> 25:49.280]  He could have worded that differently.
[25:49.280 --> 25:52.880]  I mean, there is no reason, there is no reason for that.
[25:52.880 --> 25:53.880]  You know?
[25:53.880 --> 25:58.160]  And he struck a devastating blow to the propaganda by saying that.
[25:58.160 --> 25:59.520]  I don't know.
[25:59.520 --> 26:03.840]  I think it's going to come up a straw in a way.
[26:03.840 --> 26:05.480]  No, you don't understand.
[26:05.480 --> 26:09.520]  I'm not talking about adjudicating a legal point.
[26:09.520 --> 26:16.080]  I'm talking about, again, the media, the message, propaganda.
[26:16.080 --> 26:19.800]  Eddie, help me out here.
[26:19.800 --> 26:20.800]  Okay?
[26:20.800 --> 26:22.800]  I would, Randy.
[26:22.800 --> 26:26.800]  Unfortunately, I have not read the information y'all are discussing, so I'm keeping my two
[26:26.800 --> 26:32.040]  cents in my own pocket.
[26:32.040 --> 26:36.200]  Had I read it and been informed for this discussion, I would have been glad to chime in.
[26:36.200 --> 26:38.720]  Yeah, I was hoping to find something more definitive.
[26:38.720 --> 26:47.160]  You know, it may be something that they can wave in front of the doubters, but it's not
[26:47.160 --> 26:51.160]  as definitive as I was hoping I would find.
[26:51.160 --> 26:56.080]  Well, there's a lot of things going on.
[26:56.080 --> 27:01.000]  I know that Deborah's pet peeve is 9-11 on a lot of this, and this goes to the heart
[27:01.000 --> 27:05.800]  of that from what I understand she's arguing about it, but you have to be some sort of
[27:05.800 --> 27:13.440]  really, really gullible type of individual to believe that the trade centers fell naturally.
[27:13.440 --> 27:19.680]  You just have to be.
[27:19.680 --> 27:24.360]  And if you are that gullible, then I would have to say your head should be caving in
[27:24.360 --> 27:26.760]  from the vacuum.
[27:26.760 --> 27:36.280]  But denial, what we have to admit in order to accept and believe what we saw is pretty
[27:36.280 --> 27:37.280]  devastating.
[27:37.280 --> 27:40.560]  Well, it's easier to stay in denial.
[27:40.560 --> 27:45.680]  Since both of you have served as government employees within the military and seen the
[27:45.680 --> 27:51.040]  way they do things, we're beyond the point of denial because we know what they're capable
[27:51.040 --> 27:52.840]  of and what they're willing to do.
[27:52.840 --> 27:58.800]  Well, yeah, I'm well aware of it.
[27:58.800 --> 28:06.600]  It's not that hard for me to accept that they're really conniving scoundrels, but the vast
[28:06.600 --> 28:10.480]  majority of the public, this is a hard thing to get over.
[28:10.480 --> 28:13.080]  Well, and look, here's the thing too.
[28:13.080 --> 28:14.080]  Okay?
[28:14.080 --> 28:18.240]  When push comes to shove, let's just use a little bit of common sense here.
[28:18.240 --> 28:25.000]  We're talking a $250 million lawsuit that's ongoing for years and years and years.
[28:25.000 --> 28:34.080]  You think that if they had some dead bang evidence linking some design structural flaw
[28:34.080 --> 28:37.400]  to the collapse of the building, they would have been able to come up with it?
[28:37.400 --> 28:38.400]  I would think so.
[28:38.400 --> 28:39.400]  Okay.
[28:39.400 --> 28:40.400]  And they didn't.
[28:40.400 --> 28:42.880]  And the judge said no go.
[28:42.880 --> 28:47.640]  And so that's enough to put a huge question mark in people's minds.
[28:47.640 --> 28:48.640]  I think so.
[28:48.640 --> 28:53.360]  Who are fooled by the propaganda like, well, then what is this?
[28:53.360 --> 28:56.560]  Why didn't these guys win this lawsuit then?
[28:56.560 --> 28:57.560]  Yeah.
[28:57.560 --> 28:58.560]  Yeah.
[28:58.560 --> 29:02.600]  He went on to say that, see, if there had been negligence in the building, this was
[29:02.600 --> 29:12.640]  a building in which Con Ed had no contractual interest, therefore negligence in the construction
[29:12.640 --> 29:16.440]  of the building would have wrang in tort.
[29:16.440 --> 29:24.120]  And the judge did that little song and dance saying that they claimed actions under contract.
[29:24.120 --> 29:29.160]  And that if under contract, they would have no claim.
[29:29.160 --> 29:31.560]  And then they also claimed under tort.
[29:31.560 --> 29:36.480]  And he essentially said, if you claimed it under contract, you can't claim it under
[29:36.480 --> 29:37.480]  tort.
[29:37.480 --> 29:40.040]  And that's horse manure.
[29:40.040 --> 29:45.640]  If it doesn't wring in contract, it could wring in tort as tort outside the contract.
[29:45.640 --> 29:55.160]  All the first consideration was is that they didn't have a contract that addressed shoddy
[29:55.160 --> 29:56.320]  construction of the building.
[29:56.320 --> 30:03.360]  They clearly said that Con Ed had no say in the building, had nothing to do with the building.
[30:03.360 --> 30:04.680]  So they had no contractual arrangement.
[30:04.680 --> 30:11.400]  And then he turns right around and says that because you claimed a contractual violation,
[30:11.400 --> 30:20.040]  that you can't also claim a tort claim out of incidents arising in the same circumstances.
[30:20.040 --> 30:22.960]  And that was horse manure.
[30:22.960 --> 30:27.400]  And I'm sure hoping Con Ed appeals that nonsense decision.
[30:27.400 --> 30:31.720]  Because this is a problem.
[30:31.720 --> 30:36.520]  If they're saying that if you claim contract, then you can't claim tort.
[30:36.520 --> 30:38.560]  Well, that goes to con tort.
[30:38.560 --> 30:40.520]  There's a special name for that.
[30:40.520 --> 30:41.800]  It rings in both.
[30:41.800 --> 30:49.080]  Well, I think I took it to mean that just because there's a violation of the contract
[30:49.080 --> 30:52.320]  doesn't necessarily mean that a tort has been created.
[30:52.320 --> 30:57.000]  No, a tort does, that's the whole point of a tort, a tort doesn't have anything to do
[30:57.000 --> 30:58.000]  with a contract.
[30:58.000 --> 30:59.000]  Okay.
[30:59.000 --> 31:01.440]  So is that not what he was saying?
[31:01.440 --> 31:10.120]  I thought that he's saying that because you claimed a cause of action under contract,
[31:10.120 --> 31:15.400]  that you couldn't claim a cause of action under tort for circumstances arising out of
[31:15.400 --> 31:16.960]  the same situation.
[31:16.960 --> 31:20.640]  Well, of course you can.
[31:20.640 --> 31:26.720]  And he's saying the contract didn't apply, so the contract claim was like it never happened.
[31:26.720 --> 31:30.960]  Then the tort claim should still apply.
[31:30.960 --> 31:34.040]  And even if there was, there can be con tort.
[31:34.040 --> 31:38.720]  There can be a cause that arises out of contract and out of...
[31:38.720 --> 31:44.880]  Okay, look, here's what he says according to what you're saying, all right.
[31:44.880 --> 31:51.200]  Con Edison cannot succeed on either tort claim for the Port Authority, did not owe it a duty
[31:51.200 --> 31:58.840]  in tort additional to its duties under the lease, and a negligence per se claim cannot
[31:58.840 --> 32:10.040]  be maintained without proof that a state statute or municipal ordinance was violated.
[32:10.040 --> 32:12.040]  He's right.
[32:12.040 --> 32:16.840]  Okay, so...
[32:16.840 --> 32:22.560]  But what he did was he blocked their discovery so that they couldn't prove the tort.
[32:22.560 --> 32:26.480]  Well, of course he's going to.
[32:26.480 --> 32:31.560]  Well, he said it doesn't ring in contract and block discovery.
[32:31.560 --> 32:32.840]  No, no, wait a minute.
[32:32.840 --> 32:37.040]  I read earlier why he blocked the discovery.
[32:37.040 --> 32:45.320]  The reason he blocked the discovery was because they were asking for summary judgment.
[32:45.320 --> 32:55.040]  And he says, okay, something about summary judgment, they have to prove, gosh, I was
[32:55.040 --> 32:57.680]  taking notes and then I forgot to write down that part.
[32:57.680 --> 33:02.120]  Something about when someone asks for summary judgment, they have to...
[33:02.120 --> 33:11.280]  The other side has to have some kind of ample opportunity to disprove blah, blah, blah.
[33:11.280 --> 33:13.520]  Okay, I remember that.
[33:13.520 --> 33:17.040]  Okay, and so it was something about the summary...
[33:17.040 --> 33:21.880]  The fact that they asked for a summary judgment, that there was some kind of a little legal
[33:21.880 --> 33:30.760]  maneuver, you know, loophole that he used, so to speak, to justify his denial of their
[33:30.760 --> 33:31.760]  request for discovery.
[33:31.760 --> 33:33.480]  Do you see what I'm saying?
[33:33.480 --> 33:34.480]  Yeah.
[33:34.480 --> 33:46.120]  Well, they asked for summary judgment, but he ruled in summary judgment on the tort claims
[33:46.120 --> 33:50.000]  when he didn't allow discovery on the tort claims.
[33:50.000 --> 33:55.520]  He should have, if he ruled it on the statutory claims, then he should have allowed discovery
[33:55.520 --> 34:00.120]  on the tort claims, but he ruled against them out of hand.
[34:00.120 --> 34:06.040]  I have to reread this thing, I was read it in a hurry.
[34:06.040 --> 34:09.120]  Yeah, I know, because I just saw it earlier.
[34:09.120 --> 34:12.720]  Yeah, I think we're giving this case more time than it deserves.
[34:12.720 --> 34:17.520]  Well, no, because I want to discuss the issues of summary judgment.
[34:17.520 --> 34:30.360]  I mean, these are important issues in general, okay, in tort.
[34:30.360 --> 34:37.480]  Okay, so can you please explain about this tort situation again?
[34:37.480 --> 34:38.480]  Why does...
[34:38.480 --> 34:40.200]  Okay, I don't understand this here.
[34:40.200 --> 34:47.680]  The port authority does not owe Con Edison a duty in tort additional to its duties under
[34:47.680 --> 34:49.320]  the lease.
[34:49.320 --> 34:51.840]  What does that mean?
[34:51.840 --> 34:55.040]  Okay, read that again, I was doing two things at once.
[34:55.040 --> 34:56.040]  Okay, I'm sorry.
[34:56.040 --> 35:02.400]  The port authority does not owe Con Edison a duty in tort additional to its duties under
[35:02.400 --> 35:03.400]  the lease.
[35:03.400 --> 35:04.400]  What does that mean?
[35:04.400 --> 35:05.400]  Horse manure.
[35:05.400 --> 35:06.400]  What does that mean?
[35:06.400 --> 35:15.200]  Well, he's saying that because they have a contract that the port authority can do nothing
[35:15.200 --> 35:16.200]  wrong.
[35:16.200 --> 35:18.960]  That's what I thought that meant.
[35:18.960 --> 35:24.680]  And horse manure, tort action stand separate.
[35:24.680 --> 35:26.680]  That's what I thought.
[35:26.680 --> 35:30.400]  Okay, what page is that on?
[35:30.400 --> 35:35.840]  This is on page 20, okay, about the middle of the page.
[35:35.840 --> 35:41.920]  Con Edison cannot succeed on either tort claim for the port authority, does not owe it a
[35:41.920 --> 35:50.400]  duty in tort additional to its duties under the lease.
[35:50.400 --> 35:54.240]  That means that as long...
[35:54.240 --> 35:58.640]  To me, that means that the port authority could do whatever it wants in negligence,
[35:58.640 --> 36:03.920]  and as long as it's not forbidden in the contract, well then, too bad.
[36:03.920 --> 36:05.400]  The port authority wouldn't be liable.
[36:05.400 --> 36:07.000]  That's what that sounds like to me.
[36:07.000 --> 36:09.040]  Yes, that's what it sounds like.
[36:09.040 --> 36:10.040]  That's unbelievable.
[36:10.040 --> 36:17.720]  I sure hope that gets appealed.
[36:17.720 --> 36:25.720]  And what he's trying to do is rule on the merits of the contract and avoid the tort.
[36:25.720 --> 36:35.840]  But then again, if Con Ed is allowed to do discovery on the shodding construction, that
[36:35.840 --> 36:45.840]  might not work in our favor at all if they find it, because he did say in here that they
[36:45.840 --> 36:48.760]  were exempt from building codes.
[36:48.760 --> 36:54.520]  But just being exempt from building codes does not exempt you from the consequences
[36:54.520 --> 37:02.040]  of your failing to act in accordance with prudent building practices.
[37:02.040 --> 37:09.760]  So if they fail to be prudent and their lack of prudence caused injury, that's a tort.
[37:09.760 --> 37:16.560]  That's the reason there's torts, that's the reason claims ring in tort and contract, because
[37:16.560 --> 37:21.440]  you don't always have to be in a contractual arrangement to be harmed.
[37:21.440 --> 37:28.680]  So if Con Ed was harmed by port authority outside the contract, that rings in tort.
[37:28.680 --> 37:33.640]  And here the judge is saying that because they had a contract, there can be no tort
[37:33.640 --> 37:34.640]  action.
[37:34.640 --> 37:39.280]  Now, I don't see where the judge denied them any discovery.
[37:39.280 --> 37:40.520]  That's what I was looking back.
[37:40.520 --> 37:48.880]  They denied, I was trying to listen to you and read the section.
[37:48.880 --> 37:54.880]  I don't think that Con Edison ever moved for discovery on the nature of the structure of
[37:54.880 --> 37:56.880]  the building.
[37:56.880 --> 37:59.920]  They were moving for discovery on the contract.
[37:59.920 --> 38:06.040]  Because the parties had not completed discovery as to the meaning of the 1968 lease.
[38:06.040 --> 38:08.320]  That was one of the discoveries.
[38:08.320 --> 38:09.320]  Next discovery.
[38:09.320 --> 38:17.040]  As the same discovery described, the parties will not create or help resolve the tribal
[38:17.040 --> 38:18.040]  issue.
[38:18.040 --> 38:24.120]  As I discussed later in this opinion and order, the outstanding discovery as described by
[38:24.120 --> 38:28.760]  the parties will not create or help resolve tribal issues.
[38:28.760 --> 38:29.760]  Yes.
[38:29.760 --> 38:41.480]  See, they were doing discovery on the meaning of the contract as to exactly how liable or
[38:41.480 --> 38:53.300]  how much was the Port Authority endowed to Con Edison?
[38:53.300 --> 38:55.560]  They were doing discovery on the contract.
[38:55.560 --> 39:00.720]  They never even tried to do discovery on the actual structure of the building.
[39:00.720 --> 39:08.600]  They never even attempted to prove from an engineering standpoint or an architectural
[39:08.600 --> 39:19.800]  standpoint exactly how and what types of design flaws caused it to be such an unreasonably
[39:19.800 --> 39:23.200]  shabby building that a fire would bring it down.
[39:23.200 --> 39:28.080]  They never even tried to go there.
[39:28.080 --> 39:32.120]  They threw out crazy things.
[39:32.120 --> 39:33.120]  Page 19.
[39:33.120 --> 39:34.120]  Wait a minute.
[39:34.120 --> 39:39.080]  Here's where we bring in Ken Magnuson's argument.
[39:39.080 --> 39:46.680]  We really need to look at the filings in the case because it's very likely that this opinion
[39:46.680 --> 39:50.800]  ignores the real issues that are before the court.
[39:50.800 --> 39:53.720]  The courts do this all of the time.
[39:53.720 --> 39:58.240]  Any issue they don't want to deal with, they simply ignore it.
[39:58.240 --> 40:07.200]  Unless this opinion doesn't address efforts on the part of Con Ed to do discovery as to
[40:07.200 --> 40:12.480]  the torts, doesn't mean they didn't try to do discovery as to the torts.
[40:12.480 --> 40:13.480]  Okay.
[40:13.480 --> 40:14.480]  Listen to this.
[40:14.480 --> 40:15.480]  Listen to this.
[40:15.480 --> 40:18.480]  This is from page 19.
[40:18.480 --> 40:23.200]  Con Edison alleges seven specific acts or omissions.
[40:23.200 --> 40:27.600]  Inadequate fireproofing, inadequate fire stopping, inadequate attachments between steel connections,
[40:27.600 --> 40:31.440]  beams, girders, columns, violation of New York City Building Code as to the bracing
[40:31.440 --> 40:35.960]  of columns, inadequate robustness, redundancy, and ductility, failure to investigate and
[40:35.960 --> 40:41.600]  improve World Traders Center 7 after the 93 bombing of Tower 1, improper maximization
[40:41.600 --> 40:42.600]  of space.
[40:42.600 --> 40:43.600]  Okay.
[40:43.600 --> 40:51.080]  And they cite something P1 post-HGR MEM 12, April 24, 2008.
[40:51.080 --> 40:53.360]  I don't know what that is.
[40:53.360 --> 40:54.360]  Okay.
[40:54.360 --> 41:00.960]  And the judge is saying that the first, second, third, fifth, and seventh alleged acts or omissions
[41:00.960 --> 41:07.720]  are claims of faulty design in 1980 that cannot constitute the specific particularized incidents
[41:07.720 --> 41:13.920]  of action or inaction causing damage temporarily proximate to the construction of the maintenance
[41:13.920 --> 41:19.120]  or maintenance of the building that are required for reimbursement under the lease.
[41:19.120 --> 41:20.120]  Okay.
[41:20.120 --> 41:29.200]  So basically, he's saying the things that they're claiming are not necessarily acts
[41:29.200 --> 41:34.240]  or omissions as defined under the lease.
[41:34.240 --> 41:37.240]  Does it matter?
[41:37.240 --> 41:38.240]  This goes to tort.
[41:38.240 --> 41:39.240]  Yeah, I know.
[41:39.240 --> 41:41.240]  So even the judge seems like he's flip-flipping.
[41:41.240 --> 41:46.240]  First, second, third, fifth, and seventh.
[41:46.240 --> 41:48.240]  No, no, no, no, no.
[41:48.240 --> 41:49.240]  I'm sorry.
[41:49.240 --> 41:54.240]  This has to go with the reimbursement of monies under the lease.
[41:54.240 --> 41:56.040]  That's where he's citing this.
[41:56.040 --> 41:57.040]  Okay.
[41:57.040 --> 42:00.120]  They're not talking about, he's not addressing the tort issue here.
[42:00.120 --> 42:01.120]  Okay.
[42:01.120 --> 42:04.520]  He's addressing the reimbursement issue here under the lease.
[42:04.520 --> 42:05.520]  Okay.
[42:05.520 --> 42:07.120]  And they got reimbursed under the lease?
[42:07.120 --> 42:09.240]  No, they did not.
[42:09.240 --> 42:17.680]  They had two claims under the lease and they got granted one but not the other.
[42:17.680 --> 42:25.160]  Anything that had to do with acts of omission or negligence under reimbursement and as well
[42:25.160 --> 42:30.240]  as the tort, that was all thrown out.
[42:30.240 --> 42:39.520]  And this paragraph here says that it doesn't make any difference if the building was faulty.
[42:39.520 --> 42:45.600]  No evidence of faulty construction would give rise to a claim.
[42:45.600 --> 42:46.600]  Yes.
[42:46.600 --> 42:56.640]  On page 16 and 17, basically he's saying that the acts of the terrorists and that the incident,
[42:56.640 --> 43:03.680]  he calls it the WTC 7 incident, is not in connection with the construction or maintenance
[43:03.680 --> 43:07.060]  of the building.
[43:07.060 --> 43:17.360]  But he made that after denying a discovery, claiming that or rendering summary judgment,
[43:17.360 --> 43:21.200]  claiming that wouldn't make any difference.
[43:21.200 --> 43:24.880]  That was the discovery of the meaning of the contract though.
[43:24.880 --> 43:28.360]  That wasn't discovery of the construction of the building.
[43:28.360 --> 43:33.640]  But he also gave summary judgment on the torts.
[43:33.640 --> 43:38.720]  So he only, and this is common for federal courts, to only address the issue they want
[43:38.720 --> 43:39.720]  to address.
[43:39.720 --> 43:40.720]  Well, of course.
[43:40.720 --> 43:47.000]  They addressed the tort act, the contract action and just blew off the torts.
[43:47.000 --> 43:55.360]  Well the point, the main point is this, he says with his own words, just throwing it
[43:55.360 --> 44:00.400]  out there that basically the collapse of the building had nothing to do with the design
[44:00.400 --> 44:05.240]  of the building, whether the design of the building was flawed or not, and that's enough
[44:05.240 --> 44:06.240]  for me.
[44:06.240 --> 44:09.080]  Yeah, but he says that without any evidence.
[44:09.080 --> 44:10.080]  He just said it.
[44:10.080 --> 44:14.040]  He just says it out of hand.
[44:14.040 --> 44:16.480]  Yeah, that's right.
[44:16.480 --> 44:21.600]  Because anybody can see, anybody with any common sense can see that.
[44:21.600 --> 44:25.680]  And so like I said, to me that has to do with the court of public opinion.
[44:25.680 --> 44:32.800]  These reported acts or omissions are allegations of faulty design not embraced by section 16
[44:32.800 --> 44:35.900]  of the contract.
[44:35.900 --> 44:45.480]  So this only goes to what's in the contract, and he's, this particular ruling only goes
[44:45.480 --> 44:52.000]  to what's in the contract, but these, since they're outside the contract, they clearly
[44:52.000 --> 44:56.960]  go to torrent.
[44:56.960 --> 44:59.760]  And then on down, he just blows off the torrent.
[44:59.760 --> 45:05.640]  Oh, I know.
[45:05.640 --> 45:06.720]  There's no justice.
[45:06.720 --> 45:07.720]  There's just no justice.
[45:07.720 --> 45:15.160]  Well, see, at any rate, the main point I was trying to make is the way the general public
[45:15.160 --> 45:20.440]  would perceive this, okay, we're nitpicking the case and what it means and the difference
[45:20.440 --> 45:26.120]  between contract and torrent, and he grants some of the contract relief, but not in other
[45:26.120 --> 45:31.080]  parts of the contract relief, and he throws the torrent all together and all these things,
[45:31.080 --> 45:35.120]  and the judge just throws blanket statements out there that have nothing to do with the
[45:35.120 --> 45:36.120]  case and stuff like that.
[45:36.120 --> 45:42.440]  These are all kinds of details that a lot of people in the public may or may not get
[45:42.440 --> 45:43.440]  into.
[45:43.440 --> 45:51.600]  But the main point is the guy said that the incident of the World Trade Center 7 collapse
[45:51.600 --> 45:57.760]  had nothing to do with the design of the building and the story, okay, and that pokes a major
[45:57.760 --> 46:05.000]  hole in the official propaganda, and that's mainly what means a lot to me because these
[46:05.000 --> 46:10.120]  guys just can't come up with a good lie, and it's obvious that they're not going to the
[46:10.120 --> 46:17.600]  real issues and that Conair, the judge says in this ruling, they didn't, Conair did not
[46:17.600 --> 46:24.720]  come forward with any evidence to prove this point, okay, now either Conair didn't bring
[46:24.720 --> 46:28.400]  it forth of their own accord or the judge may have blocked it, we don't know at this
[46:28.400 --> 46:33.280]  point, but the point is it's not there, somebody didn't do it, somebody didn't do it on purpose,
[46:33.280 --> 46:39.840]  somebody stopped them from doing it, and there's a reason for that because it's impossible
[46:39.840 --> 46:45.000]  for that to have been the case, everyone could see it with their own eyes, that's not brainwashed
[46:45.000 --> 46:49.560]  by the TV, so I think it's a good thing.
[46:49.560 --> 46:50.560]  I kind of do too.
[46:50.560 --> 46:54.320]  Even though this judge is corrupt as the day is long.
[46:54.320 --> 46:55.320]  And that's a given.
[46:55.320 --> 46:56.680]  But we do have a whole lot of support.
[46:56.680 --> 47:02.680]  Especially since the Justice Department told him, and that was in a mainstream article
[47:02.680 --> 47:08.600]  to suppress all evidence coming forth regarding details of 9-11.
[47:08.600 --> 47:17.120]  I read that article last week, Hellerstein, all right, so, let's open the phone lines
[47:17.120 --> 47:27.080]  now, 512-646-1984, we're going to start taking your calls, we are going to go to Kathy, I
[47:27.080 --> 47:32.880]  don't see what, Kathy from Texas, Kathy thanks for calling in, what's on your mind tonight?
[47:32.880 --> 47:38.880]  Well, hello, I'm calling in about Hayes County again, but you guys have got me going on this
[47:38.880 --> 47:42.880]  thing, and what I was wondering about the stuff you've been talking about here is how
[47:42.880 --> 47:49.000]  can a judge just throw stuff out, or not take evidence?
[47:49.000 --> 47:56.400]  They do that all the time, Ken Magnuson, that's one of his pet peeves, he was in a case that
[47:56.400 --> 48:02.360]  when he read the opinion, if you knew anything about the case, you would have no idea they
[48:02.360 --> 48:10.160]  were related, because the case, the judge addressed the issues he wanted to address,
[48:10.160 --> 48:15.520]  the ones he could easily rule against Ken on, and all of the other issues and all the
[48:15.520 --> 48:17.480]  other evidence, he just ignored it.
[48:17.480 --> 48:21.920]  But only the judge is seeing that stuff, right?
[48:21.920 --> 48:27.480]  Yeah, well, it's available in the court record if you go look, and that's why we need to
[48:27.480 --> 48:32.000]  pull up the records in this case to find out what really went on, because you certainly
[48:32.000 --> 48:37.000]  can't tell what went on in the case from what the judge produces in their opinions.
[48:37.000 --> 48:44.960]  Okay, because with that, let me ask here in our Hayes County situation, and I'm not sure
[48:44.960 --> 48:51.120]  who's aware of what, but we had a pre-trial hearing scheduled on the 15th, and we showed
[48:51.120 --> 48:59.720]  up, and the attorney went into the courtroom and came out and talked with the new young
[48:59.720 --> 49:04.800]  DA and said, oh, he doesn't know about it because he knew he doesn't know what's going
[49:04.800 --> 49:05.800]  on.
[49:05.800 --> 49:11.600]  And then the judge who was supposed to hear it was in the hospital, subsequently has died,
[49:11.600 --> 49:15.600]  and it's like, well, okay, it's been shoved into the other judge's court, and we don't
[49:15.600 --> 49:16.600]  know.
[49:16.600 --> 49:23.680]  We can't rule on this because it would be redundant to rulings at trial, but the motions
[49:23.680 --> 49:31.520]  that we had filed had nothing to do with anything except procedure, which they completely and
[49:31.520 --> 49:33.480]  utterly ignored.
[49:33.480 --> 49:40.040]  So we sat for four hours and waited while the attorney went in and out and in and out,
[49:40.040 --> 49:46.480]  and finally she said to us that they were making another deal, making another offer.
[49:46.480 --> 49:50.240]  And so we said no offers, and we went home.
[49:50.240 --> 49:54.000]  And they said, well, okay, we'll let you know in a couple of days what we're going to do
[49:54.000 --> 49:55.000]  or what we're going to offer.
[49:55.000 --> 49:56.000]  That's fine.
[49:56.000 --> 49:57.000]  Okay.
[49:57.000 --> 50:04.000]  So we came back, and since we said no offer, they said, okay, we've just set a date for
[50:04.000 --> 50:05.000]  trial in December.
[50:05.000 --> 50:11.080]  Just no pre-trial hearing, no hear the motions that we put in, nothing.
[50:11.080 --> 50:17.240]  And then when we complained about it being so far off, they moved it to September.
[50:17.240 --> 50:23.040]  So I'm not sure if you know that one yet, Andy, but now our new date is September.
[50:23.040 --> 50:24.640]  Good.
[50:24.640 --> 50:28.640]  Now we need to move for a pre-trial hearing.
[50:28.640 --> 50:37.700]  And I have a document I'm preparing on a preemptory demand for findings of fact and conclusions
[50:37.700 --> 50:44.960]  at law, and it will stipulate a demand for findings on each due process issue raised.
[50:44.960 --> 50:45.960]  Okay.
[50:45.960 --> 50:49.600]  That's fine, because that's all we had submitted is due process issues.
[50:49.600 --> 50:50.600]  Yeah.
[50:50.600 --> 51:02.240]  Now I understood from talking earlier that the attorney in the case had passed on the
[51:02.240 --> 51:03.600]  motions filed in the court.
[51:03.600 --> 51:06.640]  He passed on a pre-trial hearing.
[51:06.640 --> 51:10.240]  Well, we will un-pass on a pre-trial hearing.
[51:10.240 --> 51:15.360]  Yeah, and that's what I was thinking, because Sally called me this afternoon, and she says,
[51:15.360 --> 51:16.360]  we have to find witnesses.
[51:16.360 --> 51:20.960]  We've only got a few weeks to find witnesses, and all my witnesses are working in it, and
[51:20.960 --> 51:22.720]  I said, wait, time out.
[51:22.720 --> 51:24.520]  I said, we have complaints to file.
[51:24.520 --> 51:26.320]  We have bar grievances to file.
[51:26.320 --> 51:27.320]  That's my reaction.
[51:27.320 --> 51:37.520]  It seems to me that the thing that we haven't done properly is to be absolutely on the offensive.
[51:37.520 --> 51:39.120]  We went halfway on the offensive.
[51:39.120 --> 51:46.240]  We went to the grand jury, and we don't know yet whether they even got our complaint.
[51:46.240 --> 51:48.680]  And now, all of a sudden, we've got a trial date.
[51:48.680 --> 51:50.880]  So can we step back?
[51:50.880 --> 51:55.520]  Is it time to just start throwing the grievances down the pipeline and...
[51:55.520 --> 51:57.920]  Absolutely.
[51:57.920 --> 52:03.560]  If this attorney passed on a pre-trial hearing, this gets a bar grievance.
[52:03.560 --> 52:04.560]  Okay.
[52:04.560 --> 52:10.880]  She's got the notice in demand, so she passed on the bar grievance without noticing the
[52:10.880 --> 52:12.040]  client.
[52:12.040 --> 52:17.000]  We didn't get to file that notice in demand.
[52:17.000 --> 52:18.000]  You didn't?
[52:18.000 --> 52:19.000]  No.
[52:19.000 --> 52:20.000]  We didn't get to do anything.
[52:20.000 --> 52:21.600]  We sat in the hallway for four hours.
[52:21.600 --> 52:22.600]  Wait, wait.
[52:22.600 --> 52:23.600]  Did you file it with the clerk?
[52:23.600 --> 52:24.600]  No.
[52:24.600 --> 52:25.600]  They wouldn't let us in the court.
[52:25.600 --> 52:26.600]  Oh, you don't do that at the court.
[52:26.600 --> 52:27.600]  They wouldn't let us walk into the room.
[52:27.600 --> 52:28.600]  We do that at the clerk's office.
[52:28.600 --> 52:29.600]  Okay.
[52:29.600 --> 52:30.600]  We can do that anytime now?
[52:30.600 --> 52:31.600]  I mean, we can go ahead and do that.
[52:31.600 --> 52:32.600]  Yes.
[52:32.600 --> 52:33.600]  Yes.
[52:33.600 --> 52:34.600]  We need to get that in immediately.
[52:34.600 --> 52:35.600]  Okay.
[52:35.600 --> 52:41.600]  Because my understanding was we were going to present the notice in demand when we went
[52:41.600 --> 52:43.600]  into the courtroom for the pre-trial hearing.
[52:43.600 --> 52:45.600]  That was the first thing we were going to do.
[52:45.600 --> 52:48.600]  They never let us even enter the courtroom.
[52:48.600 --> 52:53.600]  The attorney and the district attorney went in and out, in and out, in and out, piddling
[52:53.600 --> 52:54.600]  around.
[52:54.600 --> 52:58.600]  Every time they came out, they said, oh, well, we're not on the doctor exactly because they
[52:58.600 --> 53:03.600]  didn't move the schedule, and this time it's old, the guy's new, so he needs a few days
[53:03.600 --> 53:06.600]  to read up and find out what it is.
[53:06.600 --> 53:08.600]  The DA that had it didn't want it.
[53:08.600 --> 53:11.600]  He dropped it like hot potato and put it on the new guy.
[53:11.600 --> 53:13.600]  So here we are.
[53:13.600 --> 53:17.600]  But that notice in demand has not been filed.
[53:17.600 --> 53:18.600]  Okay.
[53:18.600 --> 53:25.600]  We need to get that filed, and I'll have, by Monday, I will have the demand for findings,
[53:25.600 --> 53:32.600]  effective conclusions at law, and this demands that the judge rule specifically on each due
[53:32.600 --> 53:40.600]  process violation so that they can't just give a blanket denial.
[53:40.600 --> 53:43.600]  Right.
[53:43.600 --> 53:49.600]  And you really need to start filing bar grievances against the attorney.
[53:49.600 --> 53:50.600]  Yes.
[53:50.600 --> 53:55.600]  And so what's happening, supposed to be happening this evening that I will follow up on in the
[53:55.600 --> 54:02.600]  morning is Kelly is writing the grievance for the attorney and the three for their police
[54:02.600 --> 54:05.600]  officer because we haven't filed those either.
[54:05.600 --> 54:06.600]  Okay.
[54:06.600 --> 54:08.600]  We need T-closed complaints for the police officers.
[54:08.600 --> 54:09.600]  Right.
[54:09.600 --> 54:10.600]  We've got the form.
[54:10.600 --> 54:19.600]  And so my next question is, the grand jury meets again this week, this coming week, and
[54:19.600 --> 54:25.600]  so we don't know yet whether they received the complaints we put in last month because
[54:25.600 --> 54:32.600]  all that we could get out of them was a list of indictments, and our names were not on
[54:32.600 --> 54:33.600]  there.
[54:33.600 --> 54:34.600]  And so...
[54:34.600 --> 54:40.600]  So we have reason to believe they weren't giving the complaints.
[54:40.600 --> 54:46.600]  So now what we need to do is prepare a set of complaints and include a set of complaints
[54:46.600 --> 54:51.600]  against the prosecuting attorney accusing him of secreting these complaints from the
[54:51.600 --> 54:57.600]  grand jury and mail these to the district attorney's office addressed to the grand jury
[54:57.600 --> 54:58.600]  members.
[54:58.600 --> 54:59.600]  Right.
[54:59.600 --> 55:04.600]  And we did send a letter to the grand jury members asking them if they received our complaints,
[55:04.600 --> 55:11.600]  but it didn't go out until probably Tuesday or Wednesday this week.
[55:11.600 --> 55:14.600]  So we really haven't had it out long enough to have a response back.
[55:14.600 --> 55:15.600]  Okay.
[55:15.600 --> 55:18.600]  Did you send that registered return receipt?
[55:18.600 --> 55:19.600]  Yes.
[55:19.600 --> 55:20.600]  Good.
[55:20.600 --> 55:26.600]  So then we just prepare another set of complaints without the district attorney and without
[55:26.600 --> 55:28.600]  the prosecuting attorney in there.
[55:28.600 --> 55:29.600]  Right.
[55:29.600 --> 55:34.600]  And mail them to the grand jury at the district attorney's address.
[55:34.600 --> 55:40.600]  So do we send the same complaints as last month again or do we have new ones?
[55:40.600 --> 55:41.600]  Yes.
[55:41.600 --> 55:43.600]  Same complaints as last month.
[55:43.600 --> 55:44.600]  Okay.
[55:44.600 --> 55:54.600]  And this time you need to put a letter in there asking each grand jury member to initial
[55:54.600 --> 55:59.600]  this letter and return it to you so that you will know they received the documents that
[55:59.600 --> 56:04.600]  you've had trouble in the past with the district attorney secreting complaints from the grand
[56:04.600 --> 56:13.600]  jury so that if you don't get that letter back within a week, then you have cause to
[56:13.600 --> 56:18.600]  believe that the district attorney is secreting mail from the grand jury, then we go to the
[56:18.600 --> 56:19.600]  postal inspectors.
[56:19.600 --> 56:20.600]  Right.
[56:20.600 --> 56:27.600]  And we did send with the letter to the grand jury, we did send them a return letter to
[56:27.600 --> 56:30.600]  please acknowledge this or know that you did it.
[56:30.600 --> 56:34.600]  I said it hasn't been long enough to get that back, but we can't, we didn't send any of
[56:34.600 --> 56:35.600]  that to the mail.
[56:35.600 --> 56:36.600]  Right.
[56:36.600 --> 56:39.600]  So we need to give that time to mature.
[56:39.600 --> 56:40.600]  Right.
[56:40.600 --> 56:49.600]  And but what we can do if you don't get letters back from the grand jury, then we're looking
[56:49.600 --> 56:52.600]  at tampering with the grand jury.
[56:52.600 --> 56:53.600]  Oh, okay.
[56:53.600 --> 56:56.600]  That's almost better than tampering with the mail.
[56:56.600 --> 56:57.600]  Oh, yeah.
[56:57.600 --> 57:03.600]  And the next set of complaints will go to the district judge who impaneled the grand jury.
[57:03.600 --> 57:04.600]  Okay.
[57:04.600 --> 57:07.600]  So we just kind of follow the steps.
[57:07.600 --> 57:08.600]  Okay.
[57:08.600 --> 57:10.600]  Well, we have more work to do.
[57:10.600 --> 57:13.600]  I was just taking a tiny little breather.
[57:13.600 --> 57:14.600]  I had a...
[57:14.600 --> 57:15.600]  Wait a minute.
[57:15.600 --> 57:18.600]  We have a motion in to disqualify the judge.
[57:18.600 --> 57:19.600]  Yes, we do.
[57:19.600 --> 57:23.600]  But the judge can't see the motion or hear the motion.
[57:23.600 --> 57:33.600]  What we need to do is send a letter to Judge Schrob in Seguin notifying him that we have
[57:33.600 --> 57:37.600]  filed a motion to disqualify in this case.
[57:37.600 --> 57:38.600]  Oh, huh.
[57:38.600 --> 57:41.600]  That sure worked in Robert Fox's case.
[57:41.600 --> 57:43.600]  That got him off the dime real quick.
[57:43.600 --> 57:44.600]  Okay.
[57:44.600 --> 57:48.600]  Then they have to have a hearing on that motion.
[57:48.600 --> 57:51.600]  And that motion is a whopper.
[57:51.600 --> 57:56.600]  And that Judge Schrob, that's just the district judge in the other district?
[57:56.600 --> 57:57.600]  Who is that?
[57:57.600 --> 58:00.600]  He's the head administrative judge of the entire district.
[58:00.600 --> 58:01.600]  Okay.
[58:01.600 --> 58:05.600]  Well, I hear the break coming up, so I think I'm done.
[58:05.600 --> 58:09.600]  I just needed to touch base and make sure we're still on track.
[58:09.600 --> 58:10.600]  Thank you for calling in.
[58:10.600 --> 58:13.600]  And I really appreciate you guys going after it.
[58:13.600 --> 58:14.600]  Okay.
[58:14.600 --> 58:15.600]  Bye-bye.
[58:15.600 --> 58:16.600]  All right.
[58:16.600 --> 58:17.600]  Thank you, Kathy.
[58:17.600 --> 58:24.600]  Okay, callers, if you'd like to call in, 512-646-1984.
[58:24.600 --> 58:49.600]  We'll be right back.
[58:54.600 --> 59:22.600]  Thank you.
[59:22.600 --> 59:49.600]  Thank you.
[59:49.600 --> 01:00:06.600]  You are listening to the Rule of Law Radio Network at RuleOfLawRadio.com, live free
[01:00:06.600 --> 01:00:20.600]  speech talk radio at its best.
[01:00:20.600 --> 01:00:37.600]  Thank you.
[01:00:37.600 --> 01:01:05.600]  Thank you.
[01:01:05.600 --> 01:01:07.600]  Thank you.
[01:01:35.600 --> 01:02:02.600]  Okay, we are back.
[01:02:02.600 --> 01:02:09.600]  The Rule of Law, Randy Kelton, Deborah Stevens, Eddie Craig.
[01:02:09.600 --> 01:02:14.600]  And don't forget, if you want the traffic seminar, send us an email so we can get an
[01:02:14.600 --> 01:02:20.600]  idea of how many people are actually interested so we can plan a venue and all that kind of
[01:02:20.600 --> 01:02:21.600]  good stuff.
[01:02:21.600 --> 01:02:24.600]  All right, we are going to go through your calls.
[01:02:24.600 --> 01:02:28.600]  And callers, please call in, 512-646-1984.
[01:02:28.600 --> 01:02:31.600]  We've got pretty much an open phone board right now.
[01:02:31.600 --> 01:02:33.600]  We've got three callers on the line.
[01:02:33.600 --> 01:02:39.600]  But don't wait until 11 o'clock because we really can't go into overtime mode tonight.
[01:02:39.600 --> 01:02:41.600]  Okay, we've got too much going on.
[01:02:41.600 --> 01:02:46.600]  So if you want to be on the air tonight, if you want to talk to us, then please call in now.
[01:02:46.600 --> 01:02:47.600]  All right, get in the queue.
[01:02:47.600 --> 01:02:51.600]  All right, we're going to go to George in Texas.
[01:02:51.600 --> 01:02:52.600]  George, thanks for calling in.
[01:02:52.600 --> 01:02:54.600]  What's on your mind tonight?
[01:02:54.600 --> 01:02:55.600]  How are you doing?
[01:02:55.600 --> 01:02:56.600]  Pretty good.
[01:02:56.600 --> 01:02:58.600]  I'm trying to draft up a resolution.
[01:02:58.600 --> 01:03:06.600]  I just hope somebody can look it over and sort of like put a little polish on it too because I want
[01:03:06.600 --> 01:03:13.600]  to bring a resolution before my county commission about this swine flu pandemic saying that the
[01:03:13.600 --> 01:03:18.600]  county commission along with the sheriff will say you're not going to come in this county and force
[01:03:18.600 --> 01:03:25.600]  everybody to take shots against their will because these people up in the United Nations and the
[01:03:25.600 --> 01:03:30.600]  federal government don't think that federal law supersedes state law but actually it's the vice versa
[01:03:30.600 --> 01:03:35.600]  that the states supersede federal law.
[01:03:35.600 --> 01:03:38.600]  Be a good point to bring up.
[01:03:38.600 --> 01:03:44.600]  So get all the data that you can.
[01:03:44.600 --> 01:03:49.600]  You might want to get this swine flu scare from the 70s.
[01:03:49.600 --> 01:03:52.600]  There's a video going around on that.
[01:03:52.600 --> 01:03:58.600]  It would be a nice opportunity to get before them and educate them.
[01:03:58.600 --> 01:03:59.600]  Yes.
[01:03:59.600 --> 01:04:07.600]  I'd like to know, Randy, have you heard of John Stadtmiller of the other evil rival network got arrested
[01:04:07.600 --> 01:04:09.600]  a week ago?
[01:04:09.600 --> 01:04:11.600]  Yeah, I wasn't going to bring that up.
[01:04:11.600 --> 01:04:14.600]  It was just a minor thing, a traffic issue.
[01:04:14.600 --> 01:04:16.600]  And nobody called me?
[01:04:16.600 --> 01:04:17.600]  What's that?
[01:04:17.600 --> 01:04:20.600]  No, he was driving with a suspended license.
[01:04:20.600 --> 01:04:23.600]  Yeah, I heard about it.
[01:04:23.600 --> 01:04:26.600]  I'm sure he's out.
[01:04:26.600 --> 01:04:28.600]  You know, I don't think it was really.
[01:04:28.600 --> 01:04:32.600]  Okay, this is the official story that I got.
[01:04:32.600 --> 01:04:40.600]  He pulled over to investigate a situation where a police officer had pulled someone else over and they
[01:04:40.600 --> 01:04:41.600]  were being searched.
[01:04:41.600 --> 01:04:49.600]  And so he pulled over to witness the event and basically just, I guess, stand there as a witness so the
[01:04:49.600 --> 01:04:51.600]  police would know they were under some kind of scrutiny.
[01:04:51.600 --> 01:04:53.600]  So he put himself into the situation.
[01:04:53.600 --> 01:04:54.600]  This is my understanding now.
[01:04:54.600 --> 01:04:58.600]  So, you know, this is just what I've been told is the official story.
[01:04:58.600 --> 01:05:06.600]  And so then the police proceed to question him and want his ID and driver's license and all this kind of
[01:05:06.600 --> 01:05:07.600]  thing.
[01:05:07.600 --> 01:05:12.600]  And then apparently he gets arrested for driving with a suspended license or not having a license or something
[01:05:12.600 --> 01:05:13.600]  like that.
[01:05:13.600 --> 01:05:19.600]  And he's claiming that he took care of that situation a month previous to that.
[01:05:19.600 --> 01:05:24.600]  Well, what was their probable cause for questioning him to begin with if all he did was pull over to witness?
[01:05:24.600 --> 01:05:26.600]  I don't know.
[01:05:26.600 --> 01:05:28.600]  I don't know.
[01:05:28.600 --> 01:05:29.600]  Their safety?
[01:05:29.600 --> 01:05:34.600]  Yeah, they feel this guy obviously pulled over because of them.
[01:05:34.600 --> 01:05:41.600]  He's standing out watching them and they know what a bunch of jerks they are and everybody hates them.
[01:05:41.600 --> 01:05:43.600]  Now, remember, this is hearsay now.
[01:05:43.600 --> 01:05:44.600]  This is just what I've been told.
[01:05:44.600 --> 01:05:48.600]  Now, what they mean by their safety is that they were afraid he was recording them so they wouldn't be able to
[01:05:48.600 --> 01:05:49.600]  get away with much.
[01:05:49.600 --> 01:05:56.600]  Yeah, they wouldn't be able to beat the crap out of this guy and then go testify about it.
[01:05:56.600 --> 01:06:01.600]  Well, I heard Williamson County got the most honorable police officers in Texas.
[01:06:01.600 --> 01:06:07.600]  You only say that because you're a truck driver and you've been breathing too many of those diesel fumes.
[01:06:07.600 --> 01:06:12.600]  Well, I always avoid Williamson County.
[01:06:12.600 --> 01:06:14.600]  I'll drive around it.
[01:06:14.600 --> 01:06:21.600]  I hear good things about Williamson County and I'm trying to get my lawsuit put together for them.
[01:06:21.600 --> 01:06:24.600]  But just one more question.
[01:06:24.600 --> 01:06:33.600]  I went and observed in the court and once while ago when I observed the court proceedings and I had a pro se person up there
[01:06:33.600 --> 01:06:41.600]  and then I go and listen to the jurisdiction and why this pro se guy probably got beaten in court because he never objected.
[01:06:41.600 --> 01:06:42.600]  Use the word objection.
[01:06:42.600 --> 01:06:45.600]  Randy, you ever use that word objection in court?
[01:06:45.600 --> 01:06:48.600]  Pretty often.
[01:06:48.600 --> 01:06:49.600]  I love to use that word.
[01:06:49.600 --> 01:06:52.600]  Usually it's the moment they start talking.
[01:06:52.600 --> 01:06:55.600]  Here's what you get to do with objections.
[01:06:55.600 --> 01:07:00.600]  You get to feed the jury.
[01:07:00.600 --> 01:07:06.600]  See, you're not doing testimony, you're arguing over a point.
[01:07:06.600 --> 01:07:12.600]  So you can say all kind of stuff about the officer.
[01:07:12.600 --> 01:07:14.600]  There was one I objected to.
[01:07:14.600 --> 01:07:22.600]  I don't even remember what it was, but I just went on this tirade about the officer and the judge said, Mr.
[01:07:22.600 --> 01:07:25.600]  Kelton, are you going to get to your objection?
[01:07:25.600 --> 01:07:26.600]  Yeah, just a minute, Judge.
[01:07:26.600 --> 01:07:28.600]  I got some more to say.
[01:07:28.600 --> 01:07:34.600]  So I'm just telling them all this stuff I want to tell them about the officer under the guise of an objection.
[01:07:34.600 --> 01:07:44.600]  And the judge finally stopped me and he turned to the jury and told the jury they would ignore that tirade by defendant.
[01:07:44.600 --> 01:07:46.600]  But you know they're not going to.
[01:07:46.600 --> 01:07:49.600]  I have great fun with objections.
[01:07:49.600 --> 01:07:53.600]  We should object quickly and object often.
[01:07:53.600 --> 01:08:03.600]  And when they overrule your objection, then you should let the record reflect defendant's exception to the ruling.
[01:08:03.600 --> 01:08:08.600]  Yeah, and you should object the moment you see their lips part and words start out.
[01:08:08.600 --> 01:08:14.600]  I mean, have you ever seen that movie A Civil Action with John Travolta and Robert Duvall teaching in his law class?
[01:08:14.600 --> 01:08:18.600]  He's like, even if you fall asleep in court, yell objection.
[01:08:18.600 --> 01:08:22.600]  Yell objection at anything.
[01:08:22.600 --> 01:08:28.600]  I mean, because sometimes it screws up the train of thought in the other side, I heard.
[01:08:28.600 --> 01:08:29.600]  Yes, it does.
[01:08:29.600 --> 01:08:46.600]  And I did in one of the cases I was in, I put in a motion asking the court to restrict the prosecution from frivolous objections for the purpose of interfering with a proper presentation of a case.
[01:08:46.600 --> 01:08:47.600]  I'd never seen one like that before.
[01:08:47.600 --> 01:08:50.600]  And the judge said he didn't know what to do with it.
[01:08:50.600 --> 01:08:51.600]  Well, prove it, Judge.
[01:08:51.600 --> 01:09:04.600]  Tell him to sit over and keep his mouth shut when I'm trying to present my case instead of objecting to the way I part my hair and the way I tie my shoes, just to interfere with the continuity of my presentation.
[01:09:04.600 --> 01:09:07.600]  Well, Mr. Colman, I can't do that.
[01:09:07.600 --> 01:09:09.600]  Well, I object.
[01:09:09.600 --> 01:09:16.600]  Well, if they're using a city attorney to prosecute the case, I'd just start yelling objection the moment they started speaking.
[01:09:16.600 --> 01:09:20.600]  And every time a word come out of their mouth, I'd yell objection.
[01:09:20.600 --> 01:09:25.600]  Simply because the attorney has no business being there.
[01:09:25.600 --> 01:09:28.600]  Yes, I want a good brief on that.
[01:09:28.600 --> 01:09:31.600]  I'm ready for this traffic seminar.
[01:09:31.600 --> 01:09:37.600]  Well, on the rules of the court, what conditions you can have an objection.
[01:09:37.600 --> 01:09:44.600]  You hear on the TV show, like, objection leading to witness or objection something.
[01:09:44.600 --> 01:09:50.600]  The jurisdiction area, I think he has 147 objections.
[01:09:50.600 --> 01:10:01.600]  Yeah, there's actually a website called objection.com that you can go to and download a sample program that you install on your computer, and it basically sets up this little cartoon courtroom,
[01:10:01.600 --> 01:10:09.600]  and it presents situations where things are said and you have to jump up and object to it and then select the objection you're going to use.
[01:10:09.600 --> 01:10:13.600]  It's actually pretty good practice for what you're going to hear in a courtroom.
[01:10:13.600 --> 01:10:17.600]  Oh, Ken Magnuson is going to be tickled to hear that.
[01:10:17.600 --> 01:10:24.600]  He told me about coming across that game 20 years ago and lost it.
[01:10:24.600 --> 01:10:28.600]  He's going to be thrilled to know that he can find it again.
[01:10:28.600 --> 01:10:30.600]  Yeah, it's out there.
[01:10:30.600 --> 01:10:32.600]  Well, Randy, I got more good news.
[01:10:32.600 --> 01:10:33.600]  I'll get off the phone.
[01:10:33.600 --> 01:10:39.600]  The lawyer couple, the judge and the retired DA, about three weeks they'll be back from vacation.
[01:10:39.600 --> 01:10:49.600]  But they want to send up this jurisdiction role playing because they say they see too many pro se people making mental mistakes in the courtroom.
[01:10:49.600 --> 01:10:52.600]  And get them in touch with us.
[01:10:52.600 --> 01:10:55.600]  We would very much like to get them on the air.
[01:10:55.600 --> 01:10:58.600]  Mike, did you think this is a good idea, having a role play?
[01:10:58.600 --> 01:10:59.600]  Yes, I do.
[01:10:59.600 --> 01:11:02.600]  And Ken and I have just been talking about that.
[01:11:02.600 --> 01:11:20.600]  Ken volunteered to be the obnoxious, disreputable judge so he can throw every kind of crap at us that the judges throw at us.
[01:11:20.600 --> 01:11:26.600]  And he can do it in a way that's so infuriating that you want to choke him.
[01:11:26.600 --> 01:11:29.600]  So it would be real good practice.
[01:11:29.600 --> 01:11:34.600]  No, I'm just saying, you see a lot of people make those mental mistakes in the courtroom?
[01:11:34.600 --> 01:11:35.600]  Yes.
[01:11:35.600 --> 01:11:37.600]  And that's because they have no experience.
[01:11:37.600 --> 01:11:38.600]  That's precisely it.
[01:11:38.600 --> 01:11:42.600]  And this is precisely what they need.
[01:11:42.600 --> 01:11:46.600]  I mean, because I could tell this old guy, he could play obnoxious.
[01:11:46.600 --> 01:11:48.600]  He was also a retired JAG lawyer too.
[01:11:48.600 --> 01:11:52.600]  So him and his wife, like I said, they got experience in the courtroom.
[01:11:52.600 --> 01:11:55.600]  And they don't like the way the legal system is going.
[01:11:55.600 --> 01:12:02.600]  They don't like the way the legal profession is going because he says, being pro se, you've got a plausible liability.
[01:12:02.600 --> 01:12:06.600]  The judge can't revoke your bar card because you don't carry a bar card, you know,
[01:12:06.600 --> 01:12:14.600]  because a lot of judges who threaten lawyers with their bar cards, they really fight for their clients.
[01:12:14.600 --> 01:12:21.600]  So yeah, that's part of the strategy we're going after is we're going to be more threatening to their bar cards than the judge can be.
[01:12:21.600 --> 01:12:35.600]  And now instead of the judge threatening the attorney, we enlist the judge to come to the attorney's defense and defend him against the unruly client.
[01:12:35.600 --> 01:12:37.600]  Judge, this guy is cremating me.
[01:12:37.600 --> 01:12:40.600]  You've got to help me.
[01:12:40.600 --> 01:12:46.600]  So we give the attorney plausible deniability.
[01:12:46.600 --> 01:12:52.600]  Working in my case, my attorney is being careful.
[01:12:52.600 --> 01:12:54.600]  And that's good.
[01:12:54.600 --> 01:12:57.600]  That's precisely what I want.
[01:12:57.600 --> 01:13:01.600]  Don't just blow around me and try some nonsense.
[01:13:01.600 --> 01:13:11.600]  And he actually asked me for a letter when I told him there will be no deals, period.
[01:13:11.600 --> 01:13:19.600]  He said, well, can you give me a letter to that effect so that I don't get in trouble with the court?
[01:13:19.600 --> 01:13:22.600]  Is that nuts?
[01:13:22.600 --> 01:13:27.600]  I mean, you know, I wouldn't want to be in that position.
[01:13:27.600 --> 01:13:32.600]  This guy goes to law school for six years and this is a crap hole that he has to put up with.
[01:13:32.600 --> 01:13:38.600]  If he don't screw his client, he's got to worry about getting in trouble with the court.
[01:13:38.600 --> 01:13:41.600]  I wouldn't want to be an attorney.
[01:13:41.600 --> 01:13:44.600]  I had someone tell me once that he was an attorney.
[01:13:44.600 --> 01:13:47.600]  He had ran for state representative and he watched me in court.
[01:13:47.600 --> 01:13:52.600]  And he said, Mr. Kelvin, have you ever thought about going to school and becoming an attorney?
[01:13:52.600 --> 01:13:54.600]  Oh, no, Robert, that idea.
[01:13:54.600 --> 01:13:56.600]  He said, well, you have yourself pretty good in there.
[01:13:56.600 --> 01:13:57.600]  You'd be good.
[01:13:57.600 --> 01:13:59.600]  I said, no, no, no, no, no.
[01:13:59.600 --> 01:14:04.600]  I wound up grabbing one of those smart mouth judges and chucking him right over that bitch.
[01:14:04.600 --> 01:14:07.600]  He said, well, maybe you shouldn't be an attorney.
[01:14:07.600 --> 01:14:08.600]  But I wouldn't.
[01:14:08.600 --> 01:14:13.600]  I'd have a hard time dealing with that.
[01:14:13.600 --> 01:14:17.600]  And so the attorneys are in a spot and we need to help them out.
[01:14:17.600 --> 01:14:24.600]  And the way we can help them is with a few well-chosen bar grievances.
[01:14:24.600 --> 01:14:25.600]  Okay.
[01:14:25.600 --> 01:14:30.600]  Some medicine is a little bitter.
[01:14:30.600 --> 01:14:37.600]  Do you see the bar association being a ball and chain around some of these lawyers?
[01:14:37.600 --> 01:14:39.600]  I don't know.
[01:14:39.600 --> 01:14:43.600]  I don't know if the bar association itself is.
[01:14:43.600 --> 01:14:48.600]  I do know that a lot of attorneys don't pay their bar dues.
[01:14:48.600 --> 01:14:53.600]  And that tells me that they don't think very much of the bar.
[01:14:53.600 --> 01:15:01.600]  And the bar is always complaining about all the attorneys that they had like some 70,000 attorneys,
[01:15:01.600 --> 01:15:10.600]  the last I heard the bar complaining about this, some 70,000 attorneys hadn't paid their bar dues.
[01:15:10.600 --> 01:15:14.600]  Do you think the bar association is necessary?
[01:15:14.600 --> 01:15:24.600]  I think the bar association as it stands should be eliminated and replaced by a regulatory agency not populated by attorneys.
[01:15:24.600 --> 01:15:29.600]  Yeah, by the people that have to go into court with them should be the ones reviewing them.
[01:15:29.600 --> 01:15:41.600]  We should use as a model the regulatory agencies for every other profession in Texas.
[01:15:41.600 --> 01:15:45.600]  Give them the same kind of regulatory agency every other profession has.
[01:15:45.600 --> 01:15:47.600]  Well, you know what my answer is?
[01:15:47.600 --> 01:15:50.600]  I don't believe in regulatory agencies.
[01:15:50.600 --> 01:15:57.600]  I say let the laws of supply and demand take it and let the laws of reputation take it in the free market
[01:15:57.600 --> 01:16:02.600]  because people who are going to be good attorneys or lawyers or whatever you want to call them,
[01:16:02.600 --> 01:16:07.600]  they're going to get the business and the clients are going to spread the word who's good and who's not,
[01:16:07.600 --> 01:16:09.600]  who's going to screw you, who's not.
[01:16:09.600 --> 01:16:11.600]  No, they can't.
[01:16:11.600 --> 01:16:14.600]  We have laws keeping them from doing that.
[01:16:14.600 --> 01:16:18.600]  What I'm saying is in general the laws of free market.
[01:16:18.600 --> 01:16:21.600]  I don't believe in regulatory agencies.
[01:16:21.600 --> 01:16:22.600]  Well, what about me?
[01:16:22.600 --> 01:16:24.600]  I have a commercial license.
[01:16:24.600 --> 01:16:27.600]  I mean I have, I answer to Texas Department of Transportation.
[01:16:27.600 --> 01:16:31.600]  No, not a commercial license, a professional license.
[01:16:31.600 --> 01:16:36.600]  Plumber, investigator, engineer, doctor, lawyer.
[01:16:36.600 --> 01:16:38.600]  Okay, listen, we're going to break.
[01:16:38.600 --> 01:16:39.600]  Thank you, Brother Callers.
[01:16:39.600 --> 01:16:42.600]  All right, thanks, George.
[01:16:42.600 --> 01:16:45.600]  Okay, we will be right back after this short break.
[01:16:45.600 --> 01:16:49.600]  Callers, if you'd like to call in, 512-646-1984.
[01:16:49.600 --> 01:16:58.600]  We'll be right back.
[01:16:58.600 --> 01:16:59.600]  You invest.
[01:16:59.600 --> 01:17:00.600]  You buy insurance.
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[01:17:04.600 --> 01:17:05.600]  But why?
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[01:18:13.600 --> 01:18:15.600]  All right, we are back.
[01:18:15.600 --> 01:18:17.600]  The Rule of Law.
[01:18:17.600 --> 01:18:20.600]  Randy Kelton, Deborah Stevens, Eddie Craig.
[01:18:20.600 --> 01:18:25.600]  And we are taking your calls tonight, 512-646-1984.
[01:18:25.600 --> 01:18:27.600]  We're going now to Bob in Texas.
[01:18:27.600 --> 01:18:28.600]  Bob, thanks for calling in.
[01:18:28.600 --> 01:18:31.600]  What's on your mind tonight?
[01:18:31.600 --> 01:18:32.600]  Hey, how are you doing?
[01:18:32.600 --> 01:18:33.600]  How is everybody?
[01:18:33.600 --> 01:18:35.600]  Good.
[01:18:35.600 --> 01:18:36.600]  Can you hear me?
[01:18:36.600 --> 01:18:37.600]  Yes, sir.
[01:18:37.600 --> 01:18:40.600]  Yeah, there's kind of a lot of background noise on your end, though.
[01:18:40.600 --> 01:18:44.600]  Yeah, I went from speakerphone to – it took you off speakerphone.
[01:18:44.600 --> 01:18:45.600]  That's my kids running around.
[01:18:45.600 --> 01:18:47.600]  Sorry about that.
[01:18:47.600 --> 01:18:51.600]  Yeah, I wanted to call in tonight and speak a little bit about the income tax.
[01:18:51.600 --> 01:19:00.600]  And I know you guys know that basically people in the private sector are not liable,
[01:19:00.600 --> 01:19:04.600]  but I don't think that people in the private sector generally know that,
[01:19:04.600 --> 01:19:06.600]  i.e., the American public.
[01:19:06.600 --> 01:19:12.600]  And if there's a way we can possibly educate them really quick
[01:19:12.600 --> 01:19:16.600]  and let people become a little bit more knowledgeable on how they're being fleeced,
[01:19:16.600 --> 01:19:20.600]  I think that it would be in our favor,
[01:19:20.600 --> 01:19:27.600]  especially if we could get the word out to get a more educated jury pool out there.
[01:19:27.600 --> 01:19:29.600]  So when people are up on income tax trials,
[01:19:29.600 --> 01:19:35.600]  then they can raise these questions in their minds and possibly in the jury deliberation room.
[01:19:35.600 --> 01:19:44.600]  A way to basically prove to people that the income tax is voluntary except for federal employees
[01:19:44.600 --> 01:19:53.600]  is if you go to the Office of Law Revision Council, which is uscode.house.gov,
[01:19:53.600 --> 01:20:00.600]  there's the website, and if you take it there, you can actually –
[01:20:00.600 --> 01:20:04.600]  this is where they keep the general and permanent laws of the United States.
[01:20:04.600 --> 01:20:10.600]  You can do a search on that code, and you can search Title 26.
[01:20:10.600 --> 01:20:15.600]  And if you put in a search argument on their search page for –
[01:20:15.600 --> 01:20:19.600]  and you have to put it in quotes, otherwise you'll get a gazillion hits.
[01:20:19.600 --> 01:20:23.600]  You search for income tax collected at source,
[01:20:23.600 --> 01:20:30.600]  which is commensurate with the 16th Amendment from taxing from any source derived.
[01:20:30.600 --> 01:20:34.600]  You'll find that there's really only one section of code in all 50 titles
[01:20:34.600 --> 01:20:39.600]  that deals with income tax withheld at source or collected at source.
[01:20:39.600 --> 01:20:42.600]  That would be Section 3402.
[01:20:42.600 --> 01:20:48.600]  Then from there, if you go to Section 3403, which is the very next section,
[01:20:48.600 --> 01:20:53.600]  that's the section that establishes liability for income tax collected at source.
[01:20:53.600 --> 01:20:59.600]  And that makes the withholding agent – or the employer, rather – the withholding agent,
[01:20:59.600 --> 01:21:05.600]  and it also makes the employer liable, not the employee.
[01:21:05.600 --> 01:21:09.600]  Now, okay, you brought this up before, and here was my question.
[01:21:09.600 --> 01:21:19.600]  This only addresses withholding, and the employer is responsible for what he withholds.
[01:21:19.600 --> 01:21:22.600]  Yeah, but there's another little wrinkle in that fabric,
[01:21:22.600 --> 01:21:29.600]  and the wrinkle is that in order for anyone to withhold income tax payments by any employee,
[01:21:29.600 --> 01:21:34.600]  they must have a withholding certificate issued by the Internal Revenue Service
[01:21:34.600 --> 01:21:39.600]  or they are holding that money out illegally.
[01:21:39.600 --> 01:21:45.600]  If they are not a certified withholding agent, the money they're taking out is illegally withheld,
[01:21:45.600 --> 01:21:49.600]  even if you sign a W-4.
[01:21:49.600 --> 01:21:53.600]  I think what we're looking at here is that there's really no law
[01:21:53.600 --> 01:21:57.600]  that makes the average employee liable for income tax.
[01:21:57.600 --> 01:22:05.600]  Well, there's a law that makes a federal employee liable for income tax.
[01:22:05.600 --> 01:22:08.600]  That's true, and that's what makes it a constitutional decision.
[01:22:08.600 --> 01:22:10.600]  But this doesn't apply to that individual.
[01:22:10.600 --> 01:22:22.600]  This applies to the employer who withholds information – I mean, withholds taxes from that individual's pay.
[01:22:22.600 --> 01:22:27.600]  So he holds this in trust.
[01:22:27.600 --> 01:22:32.600]  So this doesn't really go to who owns tax and who doesn't.
[01:22:32.600 --> 01:22:34.600]  Wait a minute, hold on, hold on.
[01:22:34.600 --> 01:22:37.600]  It says liability for tax.
[01:22:37.600 --> 01:22:39.600]  Wait a minute, one second, one second.
[01:22:39.600 --> 01:22:43.600]  Bob, can you move into another room and close the door or something?
[01:22:43.600 --> 01:22:45.600]  Because we're getting into an in-depth discussion.
[01:22:45.600 --> 01:22:47.600]  There's really too much background noise on your end.
[01:22:47.600 --> 01:22:50.600]  Yeah, so I'm giving my kids hand signals to be quiet.
[01:22:50.600 --> 01:22:53.600]  Okay, can you go into a room and shut the door maybe?
[01:22:53.600 --> 01:22:56.600]  Well, yeah, I can go into another room.
[01:22:56.600 --> 01:22:59.600]  It's got swinging doors on it.
[01:22:59.600 --> 01:23:04.600]  I hope that hand signal didn't involve a wrap-up beside the head.
[01:23:04.600 --> 01:23:08.600]  No, I just shut on the back of my hand.
[01:23:08.600 --> 01:23:10.600]  That did it.
[01:23:10.600 --> 01:23:16.600]  My father used to give me hand signals, but they always hurt.
[01:23:16.600 --> 01:23:18.600]  That's a funny way to put it.
[01:23:18.600 --> 01:23:23.600]  And to prove the point that it is the federal employees that are liable for income tax,
[01:23:23.600 --> 01:23:26.600]  and that's what makes the tax constitutional, quote, unquote,
[01:23:26.600 --> 01:23:32.600]  the way the judges always say income tax is constitutional is Title IV, Section 111,
[01:23:32.600 --> 01:23:40.600]  which the United States consents to taxation of pay in that section of code.
[01:23:40.600 --> 01:23:46.600]  But I can't find a section of code that makes the private American citizen liable for income tax.
[01:23:46.600 --> 01:23:50.600]  And most people are taxed on their jobs.
[01:23:50.600 --> 01:23:54.600]  Well, here's the thing.
[01:23:54.600 --> 01:24:05.600]  Tom Cryer has adjudicated this issue very well, and he works with Becraft, Larry Becraft,
[01:24:05.600 --> 01:24:10.600]  and Larry Becraft has been making this argument.
[01:24:10.600 --> 01:24:14.600]  Here's a problem.
[01:24:14.600 --> 01:24:20.600]  A few years ago, Larry Becraft got sanctioned $5,000 for bringing a client before the court
[01:24:20.600 --> 01:24:24.600]  on this argument that he wasn't a taxpayer.
[01:24:24.600 --> 01:24:31.600]  And the court told him, your previous client you brought before us, we put in jail.
[01:24:31.600 --> 01:24:38.600]  Now you bring another client with the same argument, and you give us a 400-page brief.
[01:24:38.600 --> 01:24:44.600]  We have been ruling this way for the last 70 years,
[01:24:44.600 --> 01:24:49.600]  and your 400-brief is not going to change that ruling.
[01:24:49.600 --> 01:24:55.600]  So the courts have said, we don't care what law you put in front of us.
[01:24:55.600 --> 01:24:57.600]  This is the way we've been ruling.
[01:24:57.600 --> 01:24:59.600]  This is the way we're going to keep ruling.
[01:24:59.600 --> 01:25:03.600]  So now what do you do?
[01:25:03.600 --> 01:25:09.600]  I suggest we go back to the point of the sword.
[01:25:09.600 --> 01:25:13.600]  All right.
[01:25:13.600 --> 01:25:16.600]  Yeah, not exactly, but close.
[01:25:16.600 --> 01:25:18.600]  We go to the point of the sword.
[01:25:18.600 --> 01:25:24.600]  We go to the first prick of injury, the first little pinprick,
[01:25:24.600 --> 01:25:28.600]  the first time an agent interacts with us.
[01:25:28.600 --> 01:25:38.600]  And we maintain that we do not, that the law does not apply to us, file against the agent.
[01:25:38.600 --> 01:25:45.600]  Don't wait until this has gone along for a long time and you've waived a whole lot of your rights.
[01:25:45.600 --> 01:25:49.600]  Go after that agent.
[01:25:49.600 --> 01:25:52.600]  Make the agent prove up his authority.
[01:25:52.600 --> 01:26:01.600]  Federal Crop Insurance v. Merrill, if you rely on an acclaimed authority, you do so at your peril.
[01:26:01.600 --> 01:26:03.600]  So let's not rely on acclaimed authority.
[01:26:03.600 --> 01:26:07.600]  Let's make the agent prove up every single step.
[01:26:07.600 --> 01:26:14.600]  If he fails to do so, we file criminally against the agent.
[01:26:14.600 --> 01:26:17.600]  I don't think most people will do that, though.
[01:26:17.600 --> 01:26:19.600]  I know.
[01:26:19.600 --> 01:26:21.600]  We don't need most people to do that.
[01:26:21.600 --> 01:26:24.600]  We need one in a thousand.
[01:26:24.600 --> 01:26:27.600]  What I'm talking about, and I understand the importance of that,
[01:26:27.600 --> 01:26:31.600]  but what I'm talking about is just getting the people, the educated masses,
[01:26:31.600 --> 01:26:35.600]  they're trained enough to turn in their forms April 15th,
[01:26:35.600 --> 01:26:39.600]  that they can just be shown that they're doing this voluntarily.
[01:26:39.600 --> 01:26:43.600]  There is no specific law that makes them liable, only their employer,
[01:26:43.600 --> 01:26:46.600]  which means it's a negotiable item, really.
[01:26:46.600 --> 01:26:48.600]  Oh, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait.
[01:26:48.600 --> 01:26:54.600]  What you have cited here does not make the employer liable for taxes.
[01:26:54.600 --> 01:26:57.600]  No, no, it does, but only the employer.
[01:26:57.600 --> 01:26:58.600]  No, no, no.
[01:26:58.600 --> 01:27:05.600]  Make the employer liable for any money withheld, that he has a responsibility to turn it over.
[01:27:05.600 --> 01:27:09.600]  But the problem is, is who gave them the authority to withhold to begin with?
[01:27:09.600 --> 01:27:13.600]  Section 3402 makes them a withholding agent.
[01:27:13.600 --> 01:27:18.600]  Well, it doesn't, not until they file and get that certificate they are not a withholding agent.
[01:27:18.600 --> 01:27:20.600]  They think they are, but they're not.
[01:27:20.600 --> 01:27:23.600]  They have to do that to follow the law.
[01:27:23.600 --> 01:27:24.600]  Correct.
[01:27:24.600 --> 01:27:28.600]  Okay, even if they are a withholding agent,
[01:27:28.600 --> 01:27:33.600]  they are still not responsible for paying the tax you are.
[01:27:33.600 --> 01:27:36.600]  No, they're not supposed to turn it over.
[01:27:36.600 --> 01:27:38.600]  They're the ones that collect it, so they have to pay it.
[01:27:38.600 --> 01:27:41.600]  But who do they collect it from, not themselves?
[01:27:41.600 --> 01:27:45.600]  They take it out of your way going because you didn't negotiate that.
[01:27:45.600 --> 01:27:48.600]  It was all voluntarily.
[01:27:48.600 --> 01:27:52.600]  Filling out the withholding form is voluntary.
[01:27:52.600 --> 01:27:54.600]  Well, that part I agree with.
[01:27:54.600 --> 01:27:55.600]  Right.
[01:27:55.600 --> 01:27:59.600]  But once you've done that, you give them the consent.
[01:27:59.600 --> 01:28:00.600]  Okay.
[01:28:00.600 --> 01:28:07.600]  So my question would be, how are we going to educate the ordinary individual
[01:28:07.600 --> 01:28:14.600]  in a way that will overcome their state of denial?
[01:28:14.600 --> 01:28:18.600]  Well, those people have computer access now,
[01:28:18.600 --> 01:28:24.600]  and if they just go to get people to prove it to themselves using the Congress's own website
[01:28:24.600 --> 01:28:29.600]  to their search engine, because search engines are pretty bulletproof now.
[01:28:29.600 --> 01:28:34.600]  They'll tell you how many times an item or an object occurs in the database,
[01:28:34.600 --> 01:28:38.600]  and they're not going to be wrong unless they blow a fuse or get a bug or something.
[01:28:38.600 --> 01:28:40.600]  But that doesn't happen.
[01:28:40.600 --> 01:28:52.600]  I think you're operating from an unstated presupposition that if people know somehow
[01:28:52.600 --> 01:28:58.600]  that they're not directly responsible for this tax, that they will stop paying the tax.
[01:28:58.600 --> 01:29:01.600]  No, I'm not making that assumption at all.
[01:29:01.600 --> 01:29:06.600]  What I'm trying to do is get an educated person in that jury room.
[01:29:06.600 --> 01:29:12.600]  When it's time for a person to be called on an income tax trial,
[01:29:12.600 --> 01:29:19.600]  that person who gets called is going to know what questions to ask or what things to look for.
[01:29:19.600 --> 01:29:25.600]  And through a basic knowledge, if we stop convicting people,
[01:29:25.600 --> 01:29:28.600]  I think that's how they got rid of the whiskey rebellion, right?
[01:29:28.600 --> 01:29:32.600]  People just stopped convicting people for alcohol, crimes.
[01:29:32.600 --> 01:29:37.600]  That's exactly what Jefferson said was the purpose of the jury.
[01:29:37.600 --> 01:29:41.600]  Here's the problem you've got is the way that the prosecution
[01:29:41.600 --> 01:29:44.600]  and the judge are allowed to jury tamper these days,
[01:29:44.600 --> 01:29:48.600]  they pretty much rig the jury before it ever gets to the jury room
[01:29:48.600 --> 01:29:53.600]  by asking the questions and eliminating those that have knowledge of the facts that you're talking about.
[01:29:53.600 --> 01:29:58.600]  They do their dead-level best to prevent them from ever gaining access to that jury room.
[01:29:58.600 --> 01:29:59.600]  Exactly.
[01:29:59.600 --> 01:30:05.600]  But that's because we've gone through a hundred years of socialistic training in the public school.
[01:30:05.600 --> 01:30:07.600]  That doesn't matter why.
[01:30:07.600 --> 01:30:08.600]  That is the case.
[01:30:08.600 --> 01:30:09.600]  That's true.
[01:30:09.600 --> 01:30:11.600]  But we're going to have to fight that.
[01:30:11.600 --> 01:30:17.600]  In order for us to fight that, we have to educate everybody.
[01:30:17.600 --> 01:30:19.600]  Yeah, that's right.
[01:30:19.600 --> 01:30:25.600]  Well, I'm going to suggest that that technique, unless you are a...
[01:30:25.600 --> 01:30:28.600]  Well, they pointed around some doors and gets Obama elected.
[01:30:28.600 --> 01:30:36.600]  Are you, unless you're extremely wealthy and extremely benevolent,
[01:30:36.600 --> 01:30:40.600]  the benevolent, I don't know how I get this right in a minute,
[01:30:40.600 --> 01:30:52.600]  are willing to give up all of that money in order to put together an education program that you're not getting anywhere.
[01:30:52.600 --> 01:30:56.600]  And even if you were, the government's got more money than you do.
[01:30:56.600 --> 01:31:00.600]  And even if they don't, they'll make you go away.
[01:31:00.600 --> 01:31:02.600]  We're not going to win it that way.
[01:31:02.600 --> 01:31:07.600]  We're just not going to win it that way.
[01:31:07.600 --> 01:31:11.600]  Great change is never made by the masses.
[01:31:11.600 --> 01:31:13.600]  That's a fallacy.
[01:31:13.600 --> 01:31:22.600]  Great change is always made by a few individuals who stimulate, motivate the masses.
[01:31:22.600 --> 01:31:24.600]  Well, Randy, that's true to a point.
[01:31:24.600 --> 01:31:29.600]  Look what the printing press did in the 16th century or 15th, wherever it was.
[01:31:29.600 --> 01:31:31.600]  But we've got a new kind of printing press here.
[01:31:31.600 --> 01:31:33.600]  It's called electronic medium.
[01:31:33.600 --> 01:31:37.600]  This is brand spanking news compared to the history of Matt Cutty.
[01:31:37.600 --> 01:31:38.600]  I understand.
[01:31:38.600 --> 01:31:39.600]  And it's having a profound effect.
[01:31:39.600 --> 01:31:43.600]  We've just started digitizing things for the last three decades.
[01:31:43.600 --> 01:31:44.600]  Yes.
[01:31:44.600 --> 01:31:46.600]  And it's a good way to put information out there.
[01:31:46.600 --> 01:31:52.600]  Put together some 10-minute YouTube presentations on this.
[01:31:52.600 --> 01:31:53.600]  Yeah.
[01:31:53.600 --> 01:31:54.600]  That would be the way to do it.
[01:31:54.600 --> 01:31:55.600]  That would be a good way to do it.
[01:31:55.600 --> 01:31:57.600]  And put them out there.
[01:31:57.600 --> 01:32:03.600]  I just met with a documentary filmmaker out of California, and this is what he was proposing,
[01:32:03.600 --> 01:32:10.600]  that the Internet is the greatest tool for affecting political change that the planet's ever seen.
[01:32:10.600 --> 01:32:14.600]  And the powers that be have a problem because they can't control it.
[01:32:14.600 --> 01:32:18.600]  Anyone can make up a 10-minute YouTube and put it out there.
[01:32:18.600 --> 01:32:21.600]  So we absolutely need to do that.
[01:32:21.600 --> 01:32:29.600]  And what I'm suggesting is not that we just trust in educating all the masses.
[01:32:29.600 --> 01:32:40.600]  Let's develop for the masses as effective a tool for affecting this change that we can.
[01:32:40.600 --> 01:32:51.600]  And I'm suggesting that going after the agencies, the agent, the IRS agent himself for his improprieties,
[01:32:51.600 --> 01:32:53.600]  he's the weakest link.
[01:32:53.600 --> 01:32:59.600]  He just got one fired in Florida for doing what they're told to do.
[01:32:59.600 --> 01:33:04.600]  Went after him, complained to the Inspector General for the IRS.
[01:33:04.600 --> 01:33:07.600]  Boom, she's history.
[01:33:07.600 --> 01:33:12.600]  They're cannon fodder as far as the higher-ups were concerned.
[01:33:12.600 --> 01:33:15.600]  So let's start using them for cannon fodder.
[01:33:15.600 --> 01:33:19.600]  So the higher-ups tell them, you need to cheat on this and cheat on that.
[01:33:19.600 --> 01:33:24.600]  They say to them, whoa, you go out there and do that.
[01:33:24.600 --> 01:33:27.600]  Is it because they're not knowledgeable of what the law is?
[01:33:27.600 --> 01:33:29.600]  They're knowledgeable.
[01:33:29.600 --> 01:33:36.600]  They just think they're immune from any consequences of what they do.
[01:33:36.600 --> 01:33:39.600]  So let's let them know they're not immune.
[01:33:39.600 --> 01:33:41.600]  In what respect are you talking about?
[01:33:41.600 --> 01:33:46.600]  What violations are they committing specifically, like filing liens and levies?
[01:33:46.600 --> 01:33:50.600]  Yeah, when they make a claim against you.
[01:33:50.600 --> 01:33:54.600]  Ask for the assessment.
[01:33:54.600 --> 01:34:00.600]  And if there is no assessment, the agents without subject matter jurisdiction and committing fraud,
[01:34:00.600 --> 01:34:05.600]  file fraud against the agent.
[01:34:05.600 --> 01:34:10.600]  And then instead of them dragging you into court, you drag them into court.
[01:34:10.600 --> 01:34:13.600]  Would the fraud be because there's no judgment?
[01:34:13.600 --> 01:34:15.600]  There's no assessment.
[01:34:15.600 --> 01:34:16.600]  No assessment?
[01:34:16.600 --> 01:34:20.600]  You don't owe any attacks until a tax is assessed.
[01:34:20.600 --> 01:34:21.600]  That's in the code.
[01:34:21.600 --> 01:34:25.600]  They say, well, he didn't assess attacks, so his actions were fraud.
[01:34:25.600 --> 01:34:29.600]  Now let him come before the court with you attacking him,
[01:34:29.600 --> 01:34:34.600]  showing that he didn't commit fraud against you.
[01:34:34.600 --> 01:34:38.600]  Before you do that, do you have to go through the administrative remedies?
[01:34:38.600 --> 01:34:39.600]  No.
[01:34:39.600 --> 01:34:40.600]  You didn't try everything first?
[01:34:40.600 --> 01:34:42.600]  No, no, this is criminal.
[01:34:42.600 --> 01:34:46.600]  There is no administrative remedy for an act of fraud.
[01:34:46.600 --> 01:34:47.600]  How do you get him to file charges?
[01:34:47.600 --> 01:34:48.600]  Wait a minute.
[01:34:48.600 --> 01:34:53.600]  If you walk up to a police officer and slap him across his mouth,
[01:34:53.600 --> 01:34:56.600]  is he going to go for an administrative remedy?
[01:34:56.600 --> 01:34:57.600]  No.
[01:34:57.600 --> 01:35:00.600]  He's going to go throw you in jail.
[01:35:00.600 --> 01:35:01.600]  Right.
[01:35:01.600 --> 01:35:04.600]  That's one thing.
[01:35:04.600 --> 01:35:05.600]  Exactly.
[01:35:05.600 --> 01:35:08.600]  That's what we need to do to the agents.
[01:35:08.600 --> 01:35:12.600]  But how do we get a grand jury to actually indict?
[01:35:12.600 --> 01:35:13.600]  Are you kidding me?
[01:35:13.600 --> 01:35:16.600]  If you tell a grand jury there's an IRS agent abusing his authority,
[01:35:16.600 --> 01:35:19.600]  coming to trial, then he's getting caught in a jury.
[01:35:19.600 --> 01:35:25.600]  Where are they going to find a grand jury that's not biased already?
[01:35:25.600 --> 01:35:27.600]  Yeah, but, Randy, I think what he's saying is,
[01:35:27.600 --> 01:35:29.600]  how are we going to get in front of the grand jury?
[01:35:29.600 --> 01:35:33.600]  How do we get the charges in front of the grand jury without the DA protecting?
[01:35:33.600 --> 01:35:35.600]  Funny you should ask.
[01:35:35.600 --> 01:35:38.600]  I just happened to have that worked out.
[01:35:38.600 --> 01:35:43.600]  And I'm in the process of working the routine as we speak.
[01:35:43.600 --> 01:35:52.600]  I just sent a set of criminal complaints to the grand jury in Lufkin, Texas.
[01:35:52.600 --> 01:35:58.600]  I addressed a package to the foreman of the United States grand jury,
[01:35:58.600 --> 01:36:04.600]  the actual, a physical address was the physical address of the U.S. attorney.
[01:36:04.600 --> 01:36:09.600]  A Senate return receipt, registered return receipt.
[01:36:09.600 --> 01:36:12.600]  So this is going to go to that court.
[01:36:12.600 --> 01:36:14.600]  Somebody there is going to sign for it.
[01:36:14.600 --> 01:36:17.600]  Everyone's in their mail room.
[01:36:17.600 --> 01:36:21.600]  And since it has the U.S. attorney's address on it,
[01:36:21.600 --> 01:36:24.600]  they're going to give it to the U.S. attorney.
[01:36:24.600 --> 01:36:29.600]  And he's going to look at it and he's going to open it.
[01:36:29.600 --> 01:36:31.600]  And in there, there's going to be,
[01:36:31.600 --> 01:36:35.600]  there's a letter to the foreman of the grand jury asking him to initial this
[01:36:35.600 --> 01:36:39.600]  letter and send it back to me so that I will know he actually received it.
[01:36:39.600 --> 01:36:42.600]  And the reason I ask him to do this is I have reason to believe that
[01:36:42.600 --> 01:36:50.600]  U.S. attorneys often seek criminal complaints from public, from grand juries.
[01:36:50.600 --> 01:36:55.600]  And I don't want him to sign it because I have knowledge that
[01:36:55.600 --> 01:37:00.600]  U.S. attorneys have stamps made up with the foreman's signature on it
[01:37:00.600 --> 01:37:07.600]  and often stamp documents with the foreman's signature without the foreman's knowledge.
[01:37:07.600 --> 01:37:11.600]  So would you please initial this letter,
[01:37:11.600 --> 01:37:14.600]  put it in the stamps of address in closed envelope,
[01:37:14.600 --> 01:37:18.600]  and send it back to me so that I know that you actually received this?
[01:37:18.600 --> 01:37:24.600]  Well, the U.S. attorney is going to look at it and he's going to throw it in the trash.
[01:37:24.600 --> 01:37:29.600]  And I've waited, it's almost two weeks now,
[01:37:29.600 --> 01:37:35.600]  so I will send another set of complaints that will look just like the first one,
[01:37:35.600 --> 01:37:40.600]  address to the foreman of the grand jury, U.S. attorney's address.
[01:37:40.600 --> 01:37:45.600]  He's going to get that one and he's going to open it.
[01:37:45.600 --> 01:37:48.600]  But it's going to have a different set of complaints in it.
[01:37:48.600 --> 01:37:56.600]  These will be against the U.S. attorney accusing him of interfering with the public mail
[01:37:56.600 --> 01:38:01.600]  and secreting complaints from the grand jury.
[01:38:01.600 --> 01:38:06.600]  And U.S. attorney's going to look at that and say, he set me up.
[01:38:06.600 --> 01:38:08.600]  Yes, I did.
[01:38:08.600 --> 01:38:13.600]  There's also complaints going to go to the United States Postal Inspectors
[01:38:13.600 --> 01:38:19.600]  and let him explain to them what he's doing with the grand jury's mail.
[01:38:19.600 --> 01:38:22.600]  We start hammering U.S. attorneys.
[01:38:22.600 --> 01:38:27.600]  And so when we don't get a response on this, or even regardless of what they do,
[01:38:27.600 --> 01:38:35.600]  we send a set of complaints to the district judge who consecrated the federal grand jury.
[01:38:35.600 --> 01:38:40.600]  Address to the grand jury with the judge's name on it, judge's address on it.
[01:38:40.600 --> 01:38:44.600]  We start tying them all up with complaints against all of them.
[01:38:44.600 --> 01:38:49.600]  This gets real ugly real fast.
[01:38:49.600 --> 01:38:53.600]  If I can get people doing this around the country,
[01:38:53.600 --> 01:38:57.600]  we will start getting access to federal grand juries.
[01:38:57.600 --> 01:39:00.600]  And when we start getting access to federal grand juries,
[01:39:00.600 --> 01:39:04.600]  we won't have to worry about getting indictments.
[01:39:04.600 --> 01:39:13.600]  I did a seminar in Florida, I'm sorry, in Colorado, and suggested they do this.
[01:39:13.600 --> 01:39:21.600]  And asked them, who here wants to play Russian roulette?
[01:39:21.600 --> 01:39:24.600]  What, no takers?
[01:39:24.600 --> 01:39:26.600]  I said, okay, take care of what we do.
[01:39:26.600 --> 01:39:29.600]  We take a 9-millimeter, it's got a 15-round clip.
[01:39:29.600 --> 01:39:32.600]  We put 14 blanks in it.
[01:39:32.600 --> 01:39:36.600]  We put 14 blanks in one live round, we shuffle them all up,
[01:39:36.600 --> 01:39:40.600]  load up the clip, who wants to take that first shot?
[01:39:40.600 --> 01:39:42.600]  What, no takers?
[01:39:42.600 --> 01:39:49.600]  When you file a criminal complaint with a grand jury, it's like playing Russian roulette.
[01:39:49.600 --> 01:39:57.600]  My local district attorney says, man, those grand jurors, you never know what they're going to do.
[01:39:57.600 --> 01:39:59.600]  We get one indictment.
[01:39:59.600 --> 01:40:03.600]  Whoever we get the indictment on, his career is ended.
[01:40:03.600 --> 01:40:05.600]  It's over.
[01:40:05.600 --> 01:40:11.600]  Every one of them is like playing Russian roulette, and they know it.
[01:40:11.600 --> 01:40:13.600]  This is how we'll get it back.
[01:40:13.600 --> 01:40:22.600]  But until you and I, individual, ordinary citizens, start doing our sovereign duty
[01:40:22.600 --> 01:40:26.600]  and hammering these guys, this is not going to change.
[01:40:26.600 --> 01:40:32.600]  When we start doing our duty and going after these guys, it will change.
[01:40:32.600 --> 01:40:38.600]  I have a stack of criminal complaints in with the federal grand jury
[01:40:38.600 --> 01:40:46.600]  against a clerk in Cherokee County who signed a warrant for me.
[01:40:46.600 --> 01:40:48.600]  And she signs all the warrants.
[01:40:48.600 --> 01:40:52.600]  This is the way she's trained to do it.
[01:40:52.600 --> 01:40:54.600]  Well, sorry, Bubba.
[01:40:54.600 --> 01:40:56.600]  It's against law.
[01:40:56.600 --> 01:41:00.600]  And I charged her with a whole stack of criminal accusations.
[01:41:00.600 --> 01:41:04.600]  I charged her with everything everybody did to me.
[01:41:04.600 --> 01:41:10.600]  And without doubt, all these charges will get thrown out.
[01:41:10.600 --> 01:41:16.600]  But you go down to Cherokee County and ask that clerk what she thinks about having charges
[01:41:16.600 --> 01:41:23.600]  of tampering with a witness 20 years in prison, obstruction of justice.
[01:41:23.600 --> 01:41:27.600]  I think it's 15 years in federal penitentiary.
[01:41:27.600 --> 01:41:34.600]  State charges of tampering with a witness, aggravated perjury, subordination of perjury,
[01:41:34.600 --> 01:41:40.600]  tampering with a government document, impersonating a public official,
[01:41:40.600 --> 01:41:43.600]  what is it, false, simulating a legal process.
[01:41:43.600 --> 01:41:48.600]  She's got all this stuff charged against her.
[01:41:48.600 --> 01:41:54.600]  If she gets one indictment, her career is over, and she goes to prison.
[01:41:54.600 --> 01:41:58.600]  Do you think she's taking this lightly?
[01:41:58.600 --> 01:42:03.600]  Just like that judge that issued that traffic warrant for me after I'd already gone to court
[01:42:03.600 --> 01:42:07.600]  and filed a motion to dismiss because they didn't have an information,
[01:42:07.600 --> 01:42:11.600]  which meant they had no jurisdiction, but she issued a warrant anyway.
[01:42:11.600 --> 01:42:16.600]  That's filing a simulated process.
[01:42:16.600 --> 01:42:19.600]  So it works if you can get it done.
[01:42:19.600 --> 01:42:27.600]  Well, even if you can't, it terrifies these people, especially the guys in the state.
[01:42:27.600 --> 01:42:36.600]  I'm going to the feds, and if you go after an IRS agent in the state,
[01:42:36.600 --> 01:42:40.600]  what's going to happen is the feds are going to remove it to the fed
[01:42:40.600 --> 01:42:43.600]  and rule they have no subject matter jurisdiction.
[01:42:43.600 --> 01:42:48.600]  So you refile in the state.
[01:42:48.600 --> 01:42:53.600]  Let them try to pull it a second time after they rule they have no jurisdiction.
[01:42:53.600 --> 01:43:00.600]  The standard practice of the feds will remove a case from the state to the fed
[01:43:00.600 --> 01:43:04.600]  and then claim they have no subject matter jurisdiction and dismiss it.
[01:43:04.600 --> 01:43:09.600]  Well, the people who are filing are not going back and refiling in the state.
[01:43:09.600 --> 01:43:11.600]  We just need to beat them up a little bit.
[01:43:11.600 --> 01:43:12.600]  This is how we're going to win it.
[01:43:12.600 --> 01:43:19.600]  We're not going to win it passively, hoping that we can do the right magic incantation
[01:43:19.600 --> 01:43:24.600]  and all of a sudden all these judges will just reach under their desk
[01:43:24.600 --> 01:43:27.600]  and pull out the real law book and start following it.
[01:43:27.600 --> 01:43:31.600]  It's not going to happen.
[01:43:31.600 --> 01:43:40.600]  We're going to have to draw blood, not literally, but draw professional blood.
[01:43:40.600 --> 01:43:43.600]  We're going to have to sting them a little bit.
[01:43:43.600 --> 01:43:49.600]  We're going to have to get down there and get a knuckle-stirvy.
[01:43:49.600 --> 01:43:52.600]  Are we going to pass this break?
[01:43:52.600 --> 01:43:53.600]  I guess we are.
[01:43:53.600 --> 01:43:55.600]  Yeah, I already sent you a sketch up.
[01:43:55.600 --> 01:43:57.600]  Okay, I wasn't sure if it was this one or the other one.
[01:43:57.600 --> 01:43:59.600]  I'm kind of losing track.
[01:43:59.600 --> 01:44:03.600]  You got anything else, Bob?
[01:44:03.600 --> 01:44:06.600]  Bob?
[01:44:06.600 --> 01:44:08.600]  Do we have Bob?
[01:44:08.600 --> 01:44:10.600]  I think I put him to sleep.
[01:44:10.600 --> 01:44:13.600]  I have that effect on people.
[01:44:13.600 --> 01:44:17.600]  Okay, let's go to John from Kentucky.
[01:44:17.600 --> 01:44:19.600]  All right, John from Kentucky.
[01:44:19.600 --> 01:44:20.600]  John, thanks for calling in.
[01:44:20.600 --> 01:44:23.600]  What's on your mind tonight?
[01:44:23.600 --> 01:44:29.600]  You know, I'm glad that you talk about the Faroe Grand Jury.
[01:44:29.600 --> 01:44:34.600]  I was sort of waiting for your info to get back to me from my email.
[01:44:34.600 --> 01:44:42.600]  But anyway, the 9-11 that you talk about today and also that on Tuesday night,
[01:44:42.600 --> 01:44:52.600]  I personally, I hope that we can come clean, but I personally do not believe that it's that easy.
[01:44:52.600 --> 01:44:54.600]  I'm going to tell you several different reasons.
[01:44:54.600 --> 01:45:04.600]  Number one, you know what I mean, we little guys are going against the major power, the money tycoon.
[01:45:04.600 --> 01:45:10.600]  And the money tycoon basically controls the government, all the government offices,
[01:45:10.600 --> 01:45:14.600]  including the White House, I'm afraid of, okay?
[01:45:14.600 --> 01:45:18.600]  Second problem is this, that I have watched on YouTube.
[01:45:18.600 --> 01:45:20.600]  I don't know if that's true or not true.
[01:45:20.600 --> 01:45:28.600]  On the 9-11, they are talking about 60 Israeli spies in the area.
[01:45:28.600 --> 01:45:29.600]  And then again, you have...
[01:45:29.600 --> 01:45:30.600]  Mossad.
[01:45:30.600 --> 01:45:31.600]  Hmm?
[01:45:31.600 --> 01:45:32.600]  Mossad.
[01:45:32.600 --> 01:45:36.600]  Yes, so those are the Israeli spies.
[01:45:36.600 --> 01:45:45.600]  And on top of that, you have people who are calling the Jewish leader telling them they're not going downtown.
[01:45:45.600 --> 01:45:47.600]  Take a look on our country.
[01:45:47.600 --> 01:45:55.600]  Right now, we have so many Jews in a high-power senator, congressman, and so forth, and city, you know, governor, and leaders.
[01:45:55.600 --> 01:45:58.600]  And plus, they control the money.
[01:45:58.600 --> 01:46:00.600]  And on top of that, we all need to...
[01:46:00.600 --> 01:46:01.600]  Wait a minute.
[01:46:01.600 --> 01:46:06.600]  We're not going to go to that Semitic myth that the Jews control everything.
[01:46:06.600 --> 01:46:07.600]  No, no, no, no.
[01:46:07.600 --> 01:46:14.600]  The reason for that because they already wrote about the book that is talking about the New World Harbor.
[01:46:14.600 --> 01:46:17.600]  I'm not talking about going against anybody, okay?
[01:46:17.600 --> 01:46:21.600]  I mean, you know, that might be only a small group or something like that.
[01:46:21.600 --> 01:46:29.600]  But what I'm talking about is the major money control would not allow these things to come clean.
[01:46:29.600 --> 01:46:36.600]  So therefore, you know, they're going to continue to go through saying that the fire is going to burn down Building 7.
[01:46:36.600 --> 01:46:40.600]  They're going to keep mentioning about that, you know, like, since what?
[01:46:40.600 --> 01:46:45.600]  Since the 10 o'clock, there's no more planes flying and so forth, why did Building 7 come down, okay?
[01:46:45.600 --> 01:46:47.600]  They set the fire and so forth.
[01:46:47.600 --> 01:46:49.600]  And same thing on the Pentagon.
[01:46:49.600 --> 01:46:58.600]  And, you know, they're talking about the entire engine is going to burn up, the passenger traveling without luggage and so forth,
[01:46:58.600 --> 01:47:02.600]  and titanium engines completely burned.
[01:47:02.600 --> 01:47:14.600]  So what I'm trying to say is that all these money power control people would not allow us little guys going to come to the true picture.
[01:47:14.600 --> 01:47:15.600]  Well, you know...
[01:47:15.600 --> 01:47:17.600]  We already have, John.
[01:47:17.600 --> 01:47:20.600]  There's a possibility that you're right.
[01:47:20.600 --> 01:47:23.600]  But what is the alternative?
[01:47:23.600 --> 01:47:32.600]  If you're right and this is all a waste of time, why don't we just go home and suffer in peace?
[01:47:32.600 --> 01:47:36.600]  The problem is this right now, the international community, you know,
[01:47:36.600 --> 01:47:43.600]  I think that the Spanish universities already have done the investigation that this is an inside job.
[01:47:43.600 --> 01:47:50.600]  Anybody who studies basic science already knows that building cannot collapse by itself.
[01:47:50.600 --> 01:47:54.600]  For example, if you're going to look at the Twin Towers, before the building came down,
[01:47:54.600 --> 01:47:58.600]  there's an explosion blew out all the debris.
[01:47:58.600 --> 01:48:01.600]  What caused the explosion?
[01:48:01.600 --> 01:48:07.600]  We interviewed the head of maintenance that was in the basement of the building
[01:48:07.600 --> 01:48:13.600]  when the explosion started going off in the basement of the building 20 minutes before the planes hit the tower.
[01:48:13.600 --> 01:48:15.600]  Yeah, we're well aware of this information.
[01:48:15.600 --> 01:48:20.600]  Yeah, but then again, the question is that what caused the explosion?
[01:48:20.600 --> 01:48:23.600]  And people are talking about the jet fuel, jet fuel is nothing but kerosene.
[01:48:23.600 --> 01:48:27.600]  Once you pour the kerosene on the floor, there's no more explosion.
[01:48:27.600 --> 01:48:34.600]  We all know that explosion has to mix air-fuel mixture for the gasoline engine to function.
[01:48:34.600 --> 01:48:43.600]  Yes, and what they're claiming is that air and fuel and kerosene or diesel is one of the things
[01:48:43.600 --> 01:48:47.600]  that can come up to 2,100 degrees Fahrenheit.
[01:48:47.600 --> 01:48:53.600]  The problem is the only way diesel or fuel can come up to 2,100 degrees Fahrenheit
[01:48:53.600 --> 01:48:59.600]  is if it is injected under pressure with air under pressure to bring it up to that temperature.
[01:48:59.600 --> 01:49:03.600]  An open air burn will go to about 800 degrees and that's it.
[01:49:03.600 --> 01:49:06.600]  So yeah, we know all of this.
[01:49:06.600 --> 01:49:11.600]  If I read up correctly on the jet fuel kerosene, the maximum temperature is only 900.
[01:49:11.600 --> 01:49:14.600]  No, it's actually 2,100 degrees.
[01:49:14.600 --> 01:49:16.600]  Okay, wait a minute, wait a minute.
[01:49:16.600 --> 01:49:17.600]  You can't get it in open air.
[01:49:17.600 --> 01:49:19.600]  Hold on, let me interject something here.
[01:49:19.600 --> 01:49:22.600]  I've been studying this for years and years and years.
[01:49:22.600 --> 01:49:26.600]  You've got people like Kevin Ryan, who worked for Underwriters Laboratories,
[01:49:26.600 --> 01:49:32.600]  who debunked the whole thing because that was the entity that certified the steel beams.
[01:49:32.600 --> 01:49:36.600]  There is so much evidence we could spend weeks on this.
[01:49:36.600 --> 01:49:39.600]  Okay, we've been over all this before.
[01:49:39.600 --> 01:49:44.600]  We need to focus on the solutions here now, which is why I started doing this to begin with.
[01:49:44.600 --> 01:49:51.600]  And one of the solutions I want to point people in the direction concerning is NYC CAN.
[01:49:51.600 --> 01:49:56.600]  Okay, that's NYC CAN, C-A-N.
[01:49:56.600 --> 01:50:04.600]  And that is an organization that has been getting petitions for a ballot initiative
[01:50:04.600 --> 01:50:09.600]  for an independent investigation with subpoena power.
[01:50:09.600 --> 01:50:18.600]  And they have submitted this petition to the city clerk in New York City,
[01:50:18.600 --> 01:50:30.600]  over 52,000 signatures, and they only needed something like, I believe, 26, I believe.
[01:50:30.600 --> 01:50:35.600]  I'm sorry, I may have the 30,000. They needed 30,000 signatures.
[01:50:35.600 --> 01:50:42.600]  And the city clerk over a month of review has basically thrown so many off the petition
[01:50:42.600 --> 01:50:44.600]  that they don't reach the 30.
[01:50:44.600 --> 01:50:49.600]  And so now they're having to go back and go over every signature
[01:50:49.600 --> 01:50:54.600]  in order to push it through to city council for the vote.
[01:50:54.600 --> 01:50:58.600]  And after that, city council could veto it in New York City,
[01:50:58.600 --> 01:51:02.600]  and then they're going to need an additional 15,000 to override the veto.
[01:51:02.600 --> 01:51:07.600]  So we need to send our support to these people so that they can subpoena people,
[01:51:07.600 --> 01:51:12.600]  like Professor Stephen Jones, who has proven not only thermate residue,
[01:51:12.600 --> 01:51:20.600]  but also actual thermate chips in the dust and in the molten metal under all three buildings.
[01:51:20.600 --> 01:51:22.600]  I mean, the evidence goes on and on.
[01:51:22.600 --> 01:51:26.600]  So there is a lot that has happened.
[01:51:26.600 --> 01:51:29.600]  I mean, we don't even need to argue about the evidence that much anymore
[01:51:29.600 --> 01:51:31.600]  because there's so much overwhelming evidence.
[01:51:31.600 --> 01:51:38.600]  Now we're at the point of actually adjudicating this in the public realm and with subpoena power.
[01:51:38.600 --> 01:51:45.600]  I understand the problem is that you look, are going to come against the major power,
[01:51:45.600 --> 01:51:52.600]  and they're going to play the same game that would not allow you to have discovery,
[01:51:52.600 --> 01:51:57.600]  would not allow these personnel to come and testify,
[01:51:57.600 --> 01:52:00.600]  and all kinds of hurdles they're going to place in front of us.
[01:52:00.600 --> 01:52:03.600]  Well, obviously, John, and they planned this from the beginning.
[01:52:03.600 --> 01:52:05.600]  I mean, look, here's the deal.
[01:52:05.600 --> 01:52:06.600]  This is the way I see it.
[01:52:06.600 --> 01:52:07.600]  This is the way I've seen it for years.
[01:52:07.600 --> 01:52:10.600]  We're going to fight for our lives here, okay?
[01:52:10.600 --> 01:52:12.600]  We are literally in a fight for our lives.
[01:52:12.600 --> 01:52:17.600]  They want to force-inoculate us all with the poison vaccinations.
[01:52:17.600 --> 01:52:18.600]  They want to round us all up.
[01:52:18.600 --> 01:52:19.600]  They want to kill us all.
[01:52:19.600 --> 01:52:22.600]  They're into eugenics and population control.
[01:52:22.600 --> 01:52:28.600]  And, you know, they may kill us anyway, but I ain't going to just roll over, okay?
[01:52:28.600 --> 01:52:32.600]  And, of course, there's going to be opposition, and they don't want us to talk,
[01:52:32.600 --> 01:52:35.600]  and that's why we're doing this right now.
[01:52:35.600 --> 01:52:37.600]  I ain't going to rely on the mainstream media.
[01:52:37.600 --> 01:52:40.600]  I ain't going to even rely on the corrupt courts.
[01:52:40.600 --> 01:52:43.600]  All right, we've got to do whatever we can to get the word out ourselves
[01:52:43.600 --> 01:52:48.600]  and support people like NYC-CAN that are doing the ballot initiatives.
[01:52:48.600 --> 01:52:52.600]  We've got to take petitions and criminal complaints to grand juries.
[01:52:52.600 --> 01:52:56.600]  We've got to do everything we can, every way we can.
[01:52:56.600 --> 01:53:00.600]  As Officer Jack McClam says, death by a thousand cuts.
[01:53:00.600 --> 01:53:04.600]  We've got to hit them every which way we can,
[01:53:04.600 --> 01:53:07.600]  because we're literally in a fight for our lives here.
[01:53:07.600 --> 01:53:09.600]  And so I can't, we can't stop.
[01:53:09.600 --> 01:53:11.600]  I mean, that's just the way it is.
[01:53:11.600 --> 01:53:12.600]  And we are hurting them.
[01:53:12.600 --> 01:53:14.600]  We are hurting them.
[01:53:14.600 --> 01:53:19.600]  I support you 200 percent that the reason is this, because knowing this tyrant,
[01:53:19.600 --> 01:53:23.600]  they are not aware what they are up to,
[01:53:23.600 --> 01:53:30.600]  and yet they're still murdering thousands of innocent lives.
[01:53:30.600 --> 01:53:36.600]  So that's the reason why you just read that the judge totally denied,
[01:53:36.600 --> 01:53:42.600]  that as an example, if you're going to fight against the judicial system,
[01:53:42.600 --> 01:53:44.600]  it's going to be a major hurdle.
[01:53:44.600 --> 01:53:47.600]  It's going to be uphill battles.
[01:53:47.600 --> 01:53:50.600]  Well, it's either that or go to the gulags, so.
[01:53:50.600 --> 01:53:51.600]  Yeah.
[01:53:51.600 --> 01:53:54.600]  You know, I mean, we have to fight somehow, you know.
[01:53:54.600 --> 01:53:58.600]  Just like, you know, the other gentleman is talking about it on YouTube on text.
[01:53:58.600 --> 01:54:00.600]  In fact, Andrews already put out the movie.
[01:54:00.600 --> 01:54:03.600]  And then again, they don't allow him to put on the theater, you know.
[01:54:03.600 --> 01:54:09.600]  So same thing, you know.
[01:54:09.600 --> 01:54:14.600]  All right, I guess I get to go on and then again let you answer the next caller.
[01:54:14.600 --> 01:54:16.600]  So I don't want to waste your time.
[01:54:16.600 --> 01:54:17.600]  We're not wasting our time.
[01:54:17.600 --> 01:54:19.600]  Thank you.
[01:54:19.600 --> 01:54:21.600]  Yeah, no one said it's going to be easy.
[01:54:21.600 --> 01:54:25.600]  I mean, it is an uphill battle, and there's so much corruption.
[01:54:25.600 --> 01:54:28.600]  It's been going on so long.
[01:54:28.600 --> 01:54:36.600]  And also another problem is that none of the television, even Fox CNN or MSNBC,
[01:54:36.600 --> 01:54:37.600]  none of them are going to cover it.
[01:54:37.600 --> 01:54:40.600]  None of them are telling the true story.
[01:54:40.600 --> 01:54:42.600]  And they never will.
[01:54:42.600 --> 01:54:46.600]  Okay, and that's why we have this media here.
[01:54:46.600 --> 01:54:52.600]  And that's why people are stepping up and hosting transmitters for the radio.
[01:54:52.600 --> 01:54:55.600]  And I'll tell you, the talk radio is a very powerful thing.
[01:54:55.600 --> 01:54:58.600]  That's how we got into this whole thing to begin with,
[01:54:58.600 --> 01:55:01.600]  from my husband hitting the seek scan button on the radio
[01:55:01.600 --> 01:55:07.600]  and came across the local Patriot talk radio station.
[01:55:07.600 --> 01:55:11.600]  So we can – we do have some power here.
[01:55:11.600 --> 01:55:13.600]  Huh?
[01:55:13.600 --> 01:55:15.600]  I said we do have some power here.
[01:55:15.600 --> 01:55:16.600]  Okay.
[01:55:16.600 --> 01:55:21.600]  My question is I don't know if there's anything that we can bring in some international pressure on them.
[01:55:21.600 --> 01:55:29.600]  So that will, you know, might help, you know.
[01:55:29.600 --> 01:55:33.600]  I don't think we need international pressure.
[01:55:33.600 --> 01:55:34.600]  Okay.
[01:55:34.600 --> 01:55:35.600]  We can do this.
[01:55:35.600 --> 01:55:40.600]  The problem is that the international pressure is against us.
[01:55:40.600 --> 01:55:41.600]  Yes.
[01:55:41.600 --> 01:55:46.600]  This is all coming down from the U.N. and the world banksters.
[01:55:46.600 --> 01:55:47.600]  Okay.
[01:55:47.600 --> 01:55:53.600]  I don't want to bring in international pressure unless it's at a grassroots level
[01:55:53.600 --> 01:56:01.600]  like international local organizations in other countries maybe that want to help NYC CAN,
[01:56:01.600 --> 01:56:04.600]  which is N-Y-C-C-A-N.org.
[01:56:04.600 --> 01:56:05.600]  Okay.
[01:56:05.600 --> 01:56:10.600]  Because people all over the world know that 9-11 was an inside job.
[01:56:10.600 --> 01:56:15.600]  But I don't want other governments of other countries or the U.N.
[01:56:15.600 --> 01:56:19.600]  or some global entity trying to do anything about this.
[01:56:19.600 --> 01:56:26.600]  If people in other countries at the local grassroots level want to help us regain our sovereignty
[01:56:26.600 --> 01:56:31.600]  because it's ultimately going to help them regain their sovereignty, that's one thing.
[01:56:31.600 --> 01:56:36.600]  But I think that that is a major pitfall to try to bring in international pressure.
[01:56:36.600 --> 01:56:37.600]  I'm for nationalism.
[01:56:37.600 --> 01:56:38.600]  Okay.
[01:56:38.600 --> 01:56:39.600]  I'm for sovereignty.
[01:56:39.600 --> 01:56:42.600]  I don't want the U.N. but they exist.
[01:56:42.600 --> 01:56:46.600]  I want this nation to back out of the U.N.
[01:56:46.600 --> 01:56:47.600]  Okay.
[01:56:47.600 --> 01:56:51.600]  I don't want an interventionist foreign policy, the whole nine yards.
[01:56:51.600 --> 01:56:55.600]  I don't agree with the globalism at all.
[01:56:55.600 --> 01:56:59.600]  You know, I'm totally against everything that Obama does.
[01:56:59.600 --> 01:57:05.600]  Just read up on what Ron Paul has been doing, his whole career.
[01:57:05.600 --> 01:57:07.600]  That's what we should be doing.
[01:57:07.600 --> 01:57:08.600]  Ron Paul?
[01:57:08.600 --> 01:57:13.600]  Do you know his son is running for a senator in Kentucky?
[01:57:13.600 --> 01:57:14.600]  Well, good for him.
[01:57:14.600 --> 01:57:18.600]  Ron Paul, his son, is running a senator in the state of Kentucky.
[01:57:18.600 --> 01:57:19.600]  Wonderful.
[01:57:19.600 --> 01:57:21.600]  I hope he gets it.
[01:57:21.600 --> 01:57:33.600]  So if you guys want to see that, the website is called ronpaul2010.com.
[01:57:33.600 --> 01:57:34.600]  Excellent.
[01:57:34.600 --> 01:57:35.600]  Okay, good.
[01:57:35.600 --> 01:57:36.600]  We'll look that up.
[01:57:36.600 --> 01:57:37.600]  All right.
[01:57:37.600 --> 01:57:38.600]  Okay.
[01:57:38.600 --> 01:57:39.600]  Thank you, John.
[01:57:39.600 --> 01:57:40.600]  Thank you.
[01:57:40.600 --> 01:57:43.600]  Bye.
[01:57:43.600 --> 01:57:44.600]  Okay.
[01:57:44.600 --> 01:57:48.600]  Yeah, and also AE911truth.
[01:57:48.600 --> 01:57:52.600]  That's AE911truth.org.
[01:57:52.600 --> 01:57:54.600]  They need your support, NYCCAN.
[01:57:54.600 --> 01:57:58.600]  That's NYCCAN.org.
[01:57:58.600 --> 01:58:05.600]  We've got over 700 architects and engineers licensed, most of them with PhDs,
[01:58:05.600 --> 01:58:08.600]  that are standing up against the tyranny.
[01:58:08.600 --> 01:58:10.600]  We've got to do something.
[01:58:10.600 --> 01:58:12.600]  We've got to do something.
[01:58:12.600 --> 01:58:13.600]  That's okay.
[01:58:13.600 --> 01:58:14.600]  We're going to break.
[01:58:14.600 --> 01:58:15.600]  And Brian, you're up next.
[01:58:15.600 --> 01:58:16.600]  We'll be right back.
[01:58:16.600 --> 01:58:43.600]  We'll be right back.
[01:58:43.600 --> 01:59:11.600]  Thank you very much.
[01:59:11.600 --> 01:59:30.600]  Thank you very much.
[01:59:41.600 --> 01:59:53.600]  Thank you.