ROL_2010-08-27_16k_Hr1-2.timecode

[00:00.000 --> 00:05.200]  This news brief brought to you by the International News Net.
[00:05.200 --> 00:09.680]  A federal judge in Georgia Tuesday upheld the murder conviction of death row inmate
[00:09.680 --> 00:15.520]  Troy Davis in a special evidentiary hearing ordered by the U.S. Supreme Court.
[00:15.520 --> 00:22.320]  Davis was sentenced to die for the 1989 shooting death of Savannah police officer Mark McPhail.
[00:22.320 --> 00:27.480]  But seven of the nine trial witnesses have recanted their testimony and no physical evidence
[00:27.480 --> 00:29.880]  links Davis to the crime scene.
[00:29.880 --> 00:34.960]  S.D. International has condemned the ruling.
[00:34.960 --> 00:40.560]  A new phenomenon dubbed character amnesia is sweeping across China causing Chinese to fear
[00:40.560 --> 00:43.040]  for the future of their ancient writing system.
[00:43.040 --> 00:47.680]  Young Japanese people also report the same problem which is caused by the constant use
[00:47.680 --> 00:51.920]  of computers and mobile phones with alphabet based input systems.
[00:51.920 --> 00:54.280]  There is even a Chinese word for it.
[00:54.280 --> 01:01.160]  Time to be onesie or take pen forget character.
[01:01.160 --> 01:06.940]  Government agents can put a GPS device on the bottom of your car and keep track of everywhere
[01:06.940 --> 01:07.940]  you go.
[01:07.940 --> 01:11.880]  This doesn't violate your Fourth Amendment rights because you don't have any reasonable
[01:11.880 --> 01:17.280]  expectation of privacy in your own driveway and no reasonable expectation the government
[01:17.280 --> 01:19.360]  isn't tracking your movement.
[01:19.360 --> 01:23.880]  That rule now applies in California and eight other western states.
[01:23.880 --> 01:28.720]  The U.S. Court of Appeals recently decided the government can monitor you in this way
[01:28.720 --> 01:31.520]  with no need for a search warrant.
[01:31.520 --> 01:41.800]  General David Petraeus top commander in Afghanistan said Wednesday reconciliation with the Taliban
[01:41.800 --> 01:47.360]  will ultimately be a goal for Afghanistan once U.S. and Afghan forces create conditions
[01:47.360 --> 01:48.360]  that allow it.
[01:48.360 --> 01:53.280]  Petraeus said low level fighters are the first to return to society's fold since they are
[01:53.280 --> 01:58.800]  local individuals almost chameleon like sometimes in their allegiances because that's how they
[01:58.800 --> 02:05.000]  stayed alive over 30 years of war.
[02:05.000 --> 02:10.000]  A Muslim cab driver was stabbed in New York Tuesday by a passenger after admitting he
[02:10.000 --> 02:11.520]  was Muslim.
[02:11.520 --> 02:16.440]  The passenger, a film student, recently returned from shooting a documentary in Afghanistan
[02:16.440 --> 02:19.400]  where he was embedded with U.S. troops.
[02:19.400 --> 02:25.240]  Before slashing Ahmed Sharif's throat, the passenger proclaimed, quote, this is the checkpoint
[02:25.240 --> 02:27.280]  and I have to bring you down.
[02:27.280 --> 02:33.360]  The hate-driven attack is part of an Islamophobic fervor sweeping the U.S. ranging from hate
[02:33.360 --> 02:36.920]  speech and discrimination to acts of violence.
[02:36.920 --> 02:42.720]  America's zealotry over Islam comes as a recent Pew poll found one in five Americans believe
[02:42.720 --> 02:44.840]  Barack Obama is Muslim.
[02:44.840 --> 02:49.240]  From his hospital, Bed Sharif said, quote, I feel very sad I have been here more than
[02:49.240 --> 02:50.240]  25 years.
[02:50.240 --> 02:52.880]  All of my four kids were born here.
[02:52.880 --> 02:56.000]  I never felt this hopeless and insecure before.
[02:56.000 --> 03:00.600]  This news brief brought to you by the International News Net.
[03:00.600 --> 03:12.240]  You are listening to the Rule of Law Radio Network at ruleoflawradio.com.
[03:12.240 --> 03:40.040]  Live Free Speech Talk Radio at its best.
[03:40.040 --> 03:59.120]  This is a production of the U.S. Department of State.
[03:59.120 --> 04:24.120]  The U.S. Department of State is proud to announce that the U.S. Department of State has been
[04:24.120 --> 04:40.760]  able to
[04:40.760 --> 04:43.260]  Bad boys, bad boys,
[04:43.260 --> 04:44.300]  whatcha gonna do?
[04:44.300 --> 04:46.760]  Oh, whatcha gonna do when they come for ya?
[04:46.760 --> 04:48.760]  Bad boys, bad boys,
[04:48.760 --> 04:50.060]  uh, whatcha gonna do?
[04:50.060 --> 04:52.260]  Oh, whatcha gonna do when they come for you?
[04:52.260 --> 04:55.280]  Nobody here gives you no break,
[04:55.280 --> 04:57.480]  police don't give you no break,
[04:57.480 --> 05:00.200]  that out soldier man don't give you no break.
[05:00.200 --> 05:01.820]  Now keeping your eyes right now,
[05:01.820 --> 05:03.080]  give you no break.
[05:03.080 --> 05:04.880]  Yes, bad boys, bad boys.
[05:04.880 --> 05:06.380]  Oh, whatcha gonna do?
[05:06.380 --> 05:08.880]  Uh, whatcha gonna do when they come for you?
[05:08.880 --> 05:10.460]  Bad boys, bad boys,
[05:10.460 --> 05:11.680]  Oh, what'cha gonna do?
[05:12.020 --> 05:14.360]  Oh, what'cha gonna do when they come for you?
[05:14.760 --> 05:16.080]  Bad boys, bad boys
[05:16.240 --> 05:17.400]  What'cha gonna do?
[05:17.560 --> 05:18.640]  Oh, what'cha gonna do
[05:18.860 --> 05:20.060]  When they come for you?
[05:20.220 --> 05:21.500]  Bad boys, bad boys
[05:21.700 --> 05:22.880]  Oh, what'cha gonna do?
[05:23.100 --> 05:23.980]  Oh, what'cha gonna do
[05:23.980 --> 05:26.980]  You might stand up for you
[05:46.980 --> 05:49.980]  Why did you have to ask the moon?
[05:49.980 --> 05:53.980]  Don't you know you're a human being?
[05:53.980 --> 05:55.980]  Born of a mother with a lover, father, father
[05:55.980 --> 05:57.980]  Reflection is a reflection
[05:57.980 --> 06:00.980]  I know sometimes
[06:00.980 --> 06:02.980]  You wanna let go
[06:02.980 --> 06:03.980]  Hey, hey, hey
[06:03.980 --> 06:06.980]  I know sometimes
[06:06.980 --> 06:07.980]  You wanna let go
[06:07.980 --> 06:10.980]  Okay, we are here
[06:10.980 --> 06:12.980]  It is The Rule of Law
[06:12.980 --> 06:13.980]  I'm Deborah Stevens
[06:13.980 --> 06:17.980]  It's Friday, August 27th
[06:17.980 --> 06:20.980]  We've got Randy Kelton, Eddie Craig
[06:20.980 --> 06:24.980]  And tonight our guest is Michael Mears
[06:24.980 --> 06:28.980]  Michael, thank you for joining us tonight
[06:28.980 --> 06:30.980]  Welcome Deborah
[06:30.980 --> 06:41.980]  Alright, so tonight we want to talk a little bit about your Mike Mears method of dealing with debt collectors and creditors and the credit bureaus
[06:41.980 --> 06:48.980]  So if you could please, just for folks who haven't heard your interviews before or who are not familiar with your method
[06:48.980 --> 06:56.980]  Can you just give us an overview of what this is all about, what your methods are dealing with the third party debt collectors and creditors
[06:56.980 --> 07:02.980]  And what you have learned and what your experience is, what brought you into all of this
[07:02.980 --> 07:11.980]  Well, yeah, it's been a while since I've been on the show here and only because I'm extremely busy even today
[07:11.980 --> 07:19.980]  I think I've been on the phone at least six hours with this stuff and you know, trying to get a little bite to eat even before coming on the show here
[07:19.980 --> 07:23.980]  I had somebody walk up to me while I was preparing some dinner
[07:23.980 --> 07:26.980]  This goes on every day
[07:26.980 --> 07:34.980]  A lot of people out there just don't know the law, don't know their rights under the law, don't know how to invoke the law
[07:34.980 --> 07:39.980]  And this started for me probably around 2003, 2004
[07:39.980 --> 07:47.980]  I think it was 2004 I had my first case in federal court under Fair Credit Reporting Act and the Debt Collections Practices Act
[07:47.980 --> 07:56.980]  And I've been in federal court six times with six separate cases that I was the pro se litigant, no lawyer, me
[07:56.980 --> 08:01.980]  Been up against some interesting lawyers though, I think they learned some lessons
[08:01.980 --> 08:08.980]  Just because I don't have that little bar number out of my name after my name doesn't mean I don't know what I'm doing
[08:08.980 --> 08:19.980]  I don't have to worry about being sanctioned or having my license suspended for six months or a year and not being able to do my job
[08:19.980 --> 08:22.980]  I don't have that problem
[08:22.980 --> 08:30.980]  Anyhow, got into this over Mexican taxes many years ago, Mexican taxes
[08:30.980 --> 08:35.980]  Worked for a company in Mexico, I'm an engineer by trade
[08:35.980 --> 08:42.980]  And when I left the company, six months after I left, they came after me and said you lost $3,500 in Mexican taxes
[08:42.980 --> 08:44.980]  I said okay
[08:44.980 --> 08:54.980]  Well my contract with you said that upon leaving you would deduct anything I owed from my final paychecks
[08:54.980 --> 09:01.980]  And my paychecks were more than enough to cover $3,500
[09:01.980 --> 09:09.980]  I told them how is it that you were supposed to do this, you messed up
[09:09.980 --> 09:13.980]  And I'm using nice words here because I know we're on the radio
[09:13.980 --> 09:19.980]  You messed up and I get to pay, is that how it works? I don't think so
[09:19.980 --> 09:27.980]  You didn't do what you were supposed to do and now you're coming after me because you didn't do what you were supposed to do
[09:27.980 --> 09:33.980]  Well, they got a little reckless and they turned it over to a commercial debt collector
[09:33.980 --> 09:42.980]  Within a month or so of dealing with those guys, back and forth with letters, they had racked up six violations under the Debt Collection Practices Act
[09:42.980 --> 09:46.980]  About $6,000
[09:46.980 --> 09:56.980]  And I told them I'd entertain their settlement agreement before I'd sue them in federal court over this for violating all my rights under the law
[09:56.980 --> 10:02.980]  And they went away and then they turned it over to a local debt collector attorney
[10:02.980 --> 10:10.980]  Long story short, I got about $8,000 of violations against him, took him into federal court, second meeting they settled, offered me money to go away
[10:10.980 --> 10:14.980]  Federal court is very, very organized
[10:14.980 --> 10:22.980]  Prose litigants are given a very wide berth in this stuff and enforcing your rights under these laws
[10:22.980 --> 10:31.980]  And the biggest problem people have is understanding is yes, you can go read these laws, the Fair Credit Reporting Act and the Debt Collection Practices Act
[10:31.980 --> 10:37.980]  But reading them and invoking that law into a complaint, two different things
[10:37.980 --> 10:40.980]  You have to know how to do that
[10:40.980 --> 10:44.980]  I know how to do that very well
[10:44.980 --> 10:50.980]  Okay, we have tons and tons of people across the country who are doing that
[10:50.980 --> 10:56.980]  I wouldn't be surprised if there was a hit out on me by now from one of the big lenders
[10:56.980 --> 11:00.980]  But I'm armed so I'm not too worried about it
[11:00.980 --> 11:06.980]  But anyhow, this whole process is very, very interesting
[11:06.980 --> 11:12.980]  You learn how to do it, you just have to have some common sense when you do it, be able to read and understand English
[11:12.980 --> 11:22.980]  Drag him into federal court, you go through a bunch of paper pushing, I'd say between 95 and 99% of it is paper pushing
[11:22.980 --> 11:30.980]  You don't go in front of a judge very often and generally it's for a conference, Rule 16 conference they call
[11:30.980 --> 11:36.980]  But before the judge, I've had some people that were in there recently call me up, hey Mike, I wasn't even in there two minutes
[11:36.980 --> 11:39.980]  I said yeah, tell me something I already know
[11:39.980 --> 11:44.980]  So they determine at that point what they're going to do with the case
[11:44.980 --> 11:49.980]  They move it to 26F which is discovery
[11:49.980 --> 11:53.980]  Discovery clears the mud very, very quickly
[11:53.980 --> 11:58.980]  You can ask them some very pointed questions, they will fight you to answer those questions
[11:58.980 --> 12:02.980]  But you have this little thing on your side called the motion to compel
[12:02.980 --> 12:05.980]  You can go to the judge and tell the judge to order them to answer
[12:05.980 --> 12:10.980]  And God forbid they don't pay attention to the judge, federal judge
[12:10.980 --> 12:15.980]  When they tell them to answer, a little thing called contempt
[12:15.980 --> 12:23.980]  And I don't think I'd want the US Marshal showing up at my door to enforce the contempt order
[12:23.980 --> 12:29.980]  Okay, so that's who the judges, the federal judges have working for them
[12:29.980 --> 12:33.980]  Gets very, very interesting, I've had all kinds of questions
[12:33.980 --> 12:38.980]  As I said today alone, I've been on the phone six hours barely had the time to get something to eat
[12:38.980 --> 12:41.980]  Another guy's calling me back after this radio show
[12:41.980 --> 12:44.980]  This goes on and on and on
[12:44.980 --> 12:47.980]  People are tired of being pushed around
[12:47.980 --> 12:50.980]  If I'm going down, I'm going down swinging
[12:50.980 --> 12:55.980]  And that's what a lot of people's attitudes are right now
[12:55.980 --> 12:59.980]  If you're going to come after me, you're going to get a judgment, you're going to garnish my pay
[12:59.980 --> 13:02.980]  You're going to put a lien against my house, I'm going to fight you
[13:02.980 --> 13:04.980]  And all you have to do is know how to do it
[13:04.980 --> 13:06.980]  It's pretty simple, it's a pretty simple process
[13:06.980 --> 13:10.980]  You learn this one time, it stays with you for the rest of your life
[13:10.980 --> 13:14.980]  How to invoke that Fair Credit and Debt Collection Practices Act
[13:14.980 --> 13:22.980]  Because you see these laws are geared at those groups, creditors, debt collectors
[13:22.980 --> 13:27.980]  As to what they're supposed to do when you challenge them
[13:27.980 --> 13:30.980]  Has nothing to do with what the consumer has to do
[13:30.980 --> 13:34.980]  It's what they have to do when you challenge them
[13:34.980 --> 13:37.980]  And that's the hardest thing you'll have making most of these attorneys understand
[13:37.980 --> 13:44.980]  Oh, you had this debt, you had this account, we got a default judgment on you, so what?
[13:44.980 --> 13:47.980]  And they will bring that up in every case
[13:47.980 --> 13:53.980]  They come and use that as a ploy to distract the judge, the court, to muddy the waters
[13:53.980 --> 13:55.980]  Well, we got this default judgment on them
[13:55.980 --> 13:58.980]  You owe this money, default it on the account
[13:58.980 --> 14:02.980]  It's not what this is about
[14:02.980 --> 14:06.980]  It's about what they're supposed to do when challenged
[14:06.980 --> 14:12.980]  And the laws they break when they can't prove it or don't do it
[14:12.980 --> 14:15.980]  Violated my civil rights
[14:15.980 --> 14:19.980]  These are civil rights cases, violated my civil rights
[14:19.980 --> 14:22.980]  Plain simple example, a cop comes along, arrests you
[14:22.980 --> 14:26.980]  He's got to give you a warning that says you're under arrest
[14:26.980 --> 14:30.980]  Anything you say may be held against you in a court of law, ta-da-da-da-da
[14:30.980 --> 14:33.980]  And if they don't do that, folks, what happens?
[14:33.980 --> 14:38.980]  What happens to that arrest?
[14:38.980 --> 14:39.980]  It gets thrown out
[14:39.980 --> 14:42.980]  You violated my civil rights, you didn't follow the law
[14:42.980 --> 14:45.980]  This is the same thing, folks
[14:45.980 --> 14:48.980]  You challenge them, there's things they're supposed to do
[14:48.980 --> 14:52.980]  They don't do it, you can prove it, it's very simple
[14:52.980 --> 14:55.980]  They violated your civil rights and it becomes a civil rights issue
[14:55.980 --> 14:57.980]  So it's been very, very successful
[14:57.980 --> 15:01.980]  I have my own personal cases and you can see in PACER
[15:01.980 --> 15:05.980]  and the U.S. government website where they have those federal cases
[15:05.980 --> 15:09.980]  This is all public knowledge
[15:09.980 --> 15:12.980]  Go to PACER, you sign up there, you can see the court cases
[15:12.980 --> 15:16.980]  Every civil criminal bankruptcy is right there in PACER
[15:16.980 --> 15:19.980]  It's that simple
[15:19.980 --> 15:24.980]  I've been up against lawyers, previous cases that they think I'm joking around
[15:24.980 --> 15:27.980]  They think this is a joke
[15:27.980 --> 15:32.980]  And I've sat across from these lawyers
[15:32.980 --> 15:37.980]  They'll say to me, well, you know, you can't do this, you can't do that
[15:37.980 --> 15:40.980]  And I have a very simple answer to that kind of attitude from an attorney
[15:40.980 --> 15:44.980]  My answer is, you may be right, Mr. Lawyer
[15:44.980 --> 15:48.980]  Why don't we let the judge and jury decide?
[15:48.980 --> 15:52.980]  Oh, and if you don't think I know what I'm doing?
[15:52.980 --> 15:57.980]  You get access to PACER, sir, and you get the big silver dollar eye looks like
[15:57.980 --> 16:02.980]  Wow, you know about PACER? Yeah, I know about PACER
[16:02.980 --> 16:05.980]  You think I'm kidding around, you think I'm fooling?
[16:05.980 --> 16:12.980]  Why don't you go query me on PACER and then let me know if you and your client want to go there
[16:12.980 --> 16:14.980]  They go there and they see the cases
[16:14.980 --> 16:18.980]  This guy's been to federal court a few times already and he hasn't lost one case
[16:18.980 --> 16:21.980]  Yeah, you think I'm fooling around
[16:21.980 --> 16:24.980]  I'm ready
[16:24.980 --> 16:28.980]  So anyhow, I haven't been in federal court for quite a while
[16:28.980 --> 16:31.980]  I have AAA credit, nobody bothers me
[16:31.980 --> 16:34.980]  I don't abuse the system
[16:34.980 --> 16:37.980]  I hear the music coming up, that means we're going on break
[16:37.980 --> 16:39.980]  Debra, I'll let you take over
[16:39.980 --> 16:42.980]  Okay, this is Mike Mears, our very special guest
[16:42.980 --> 16:47.980]  Talking about how he has dealt with debt collectors and creditors and the credit agencies
[16:47.980 --> 16:52.980]  We'll hear more from Mike on the other side, this is the rule of law
[16:52.980 --> 16:56.980]  Callers, I see you on the board, we're going to get to your calls after the interview or later in the interview
[16:56.980 --> 16:59.980]  We'll be right back
[16:59.980 --> 17:08.980]  Capital Coin and Bullions is your local source for rare coins, precious metals, and coin supplies in the Austin metro area
[17:08.980 --> 17:10.980]  We also ship worldwide
[17:10.980 --> 17:16.980]  We are a family-owned and operated business that offers competitive prices on your coin and metals purchases
[17:16.980 --> 17:23.980]  We buy, sell, trade, and consign rare coins, gold and silver coin collections, precious metals, and scrap gold
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[17:27.980 --> 17:30.980]  We offer daily specials on coins and bullions
[17:30.980 --> 17:34.980]  We're located at 5448 Barnett Road, Suite 3
[17:34.980 --> 17:39.980]  And we're open Monday through Friday, 10 a.m. to 6 p.m. Saturdays, 10 a.m. to 5 p.m.
[17:39.980 --> 17:48.980]  You are welcome to stop in our shop during regular business hours or call 512-646-6440 with any questions
[17:48.980 --> 17:53.980]  Ask for Chad and say you heard about us on Rule of Law Radio or 90.1 FM
[17:53.980 --> 18:19.980]  That's Capital Coin and Bullion, 512-646-6440
[18:19.980 --> 18:26.980]  Thank you Justice
[18:26.980 --> 18:29.980]  The world is spinning like it's out of control
[18:29.980 --> 18:33.980]  On the edge of a hole inside a deep dark dome
[18:33.980 --> 18:40.980]  I'm always on the lookout for something to soothe my soul
[18:40.980 --> 18:45.980]  So I sit back and I watch the evidence unfold
[18:45.980 --> 18:52.980]  And I see justice is the goal
[18:52.980 --> 18:59.980]  Yeah, justice is the goal
[18:59.980 --> 19:02.980]  Sometimes we fell a little too far at sea
[19:02.980 --> 19:05.980]  And then we got to get back on course to the sea
[19:05.980 --> 19:08.980]  We go under heavy advisory
[19:08.980 --> 19:12.980]  From the man that came all the way from Galilee
[19:12.980 --> 19:15.980]  I'm looking for a safe and warm place to be
[19:15.980 --> 19:18.980]  Where I don't have to work so hard to be free
[19:18.980 --> 19:20.980]  Some guys, I try to be free
[19:20.980 --> 19:25.980]  We're here with our special guest, Mike Mirris
[19:25.980 --> 19:29.980]  Okay, so Pacer, people look up on Pacer
[19:29.980 --> 19:31.980]  You can look up Mike Mirris on Pacer
[19:31.980 --> 19:35.980]  And actually if you go to ruleoflawradio.com
[19:35.980 --> 19:39.980]  You'll see the banner for the Mike Mirris method
[19:39.980 --> 19:43.980]  There's a blue banner about halfway down the page
[19:43.980 --> 19:45.980]  It's a little above halfway down the page
[19:45.980 --> 19:49.980]  And you'll see how you can click on that banner
[19:49.980 --> 19:51.980]  And order the Mike Mirris method
[19:51.980 --> 19:52.980]  And it'll go to special page
[19:52.980 --> 19:54.980]  And it actually has the case numbers of the cases
[19:54.980 --> 19:56.980]  That he has won in federal court
[19:56.980 --> 19:58.980]  They've actually been dismissed, right?
[19:58.980 --> 20:00.980]  You ended up dismissing your own case
[20:00.980 --> 20:04.980]  Because the other parties agreed to settle out of court
[20:04.980 --> 20:05.980]  Is that correct?
[20:05.980 --> 20:06.980]  That's correct
[20:06.980 --> 20:10.980]  But generally what happens is as you get into this
[20:10.980 --> 20:12.980]  Sometimes it'll happen during discovery
[20:12.980 --> 20:14.980]  Sometimes it'll happen before discovery
[20:14.980 --> 20:16.980]  Where they'll want to make a settlement agreement with you
[20:16.980 --> 20:18.980]  And you sit down and you hash it out
[20:18.980 --> 20:20.980]  It's a business meeting
[20:20.980 --> 20:24.980]  And, you know, part of the agreement is
[20:24.980 --> 20:28.980]  I will dismiss the case with prejudice
[20:28.980 --> 20:33.980]  Upon, you know, agreeing to all this in writing, of course
[20:33.980 --> 20:36.980]  Remember, we're dealing with attorneys here, ladies and gentlemen
[20:36.980 --> 20:38.980]  You want everything in writing
[20:38.980 --> 20:42.980]  They hate it when I bring a stenographer to a conference
[20:42.980 --> 20:43.980]  Oh, my God
[20:43.980 --> 20:46.980]  Now they've got to tell the truth, huh?
[20:46.980 --> 20:47.980]  Amazing
[20:47.980 --> 20:50.980]  Well, I've been through this many times
[20:50.980 --> 20:54.980]  Personal advantage to it
[20:54.980 --> 20:56.980]  So, yeah
[20:56.980 --> 20:59.980]  So you get the settlement agreement in writing
[20:59.980 --> 21:01.980]  It lists all this stuff in here
[21:01.980 --> 21:02.980]  And part of it will be
[21:02.980 --> 21:04.980]  It's right in the settlement agreement
[21:04.980 --> 21:06.980]  The plaintiff will dismiss with prejudice
[21:06.980 --> 21:10.980]  And for the most part you'll see those dismissals in there
[21:10.980 --> 21:11.980]  And the dismissal will basically
[21:11.980 --> 21:13.980]  It'll be from me
[21:13.980 --> 21:15.980]  It'll say the plaintiff and the defendant
[21:15.980 --> 21:18.980]  Having reached an amicable settlement agreement
[21:18.980 --> 21:19.980]  In this situation
[21:19.980 --> 21:23.980]  The plaintiff dismisses the case with prejudice
[21:23.980 --> 21:24.980]  There you go
[21:24.980 --> 21:28.980]  So some of them require a confidentiality clause
[21:28.980 --> 21:30.980]  I don't bring that up
[21:30.980 --> 21:34.980]  But obviously they don't want all this stuff advertised
[21:34.980 --> 21:37.980]  You know, the settlement agreement
[21:37.980 --> 21:40.980]  Which, you know, includes money
[21:40.980 --> 21:41.980]  And things they're going to do
[21:41.980 --> 21:44.980]  They don't want all that advertised on the Internet
[21:44.980 --> 21:48.980]  And the TV and newspapers, you know
[21:48.980 --> 21:50.980]  You remember my first case, Debra
[21:50.980 --> 21:51.980]  The one you always talked about
[21:51.980 --> 21:52.980]  I told you the lawyer
[21:52.980 --> 21:54.980]  It was about four foot two
[21:54.980 --> 21:57.980]  And they finally settled with me at the second meeting
[21:57.980 --> 21:58.980]  And the agreement was
[21:58.980 --> 22:01.980]  We're going to have a confidentiality agreement
[22:01.980 --> 22:02.980]  And settlement agreement
[22:02.980 --> 22:04.980]  Because we don't want to see
[22:04.980 --> 22:08.980]  This is the lawyer's words to me
[22:08.980 --> 22:13.980]  We don't want to see in tomorrow's newspaper
[22:13.980 --> 22:19.980]  Beach bum pro se litigant beats attorney
[22:19.980 --> 22:21.980]  Well, okay
[22:21.980 --> 22:22.980]  I agree with that
[22:22.980 --> 22:23.980]  No problem
[22:23.980 --> 22:26.980]  I don't need the publicity
[22:26.980 --> 22:27.980]  So, you know
[22:27.980 --> 22:29.980]  Yeah, so some of them have confidentiality agreements
[22:29.980 --> 22:32.980]  And some of them do and don't
[22:32.980 --> 22:34.980]  And, you know, even the ones that don't
[22:34.980 --> 22:35.980]  I, you know
[22:35.980 --> 22:37.980]  I don't go blasting all over the Internet
[22:37.980 --> 22:38.980]  The results of that
[22:38.980 --> 22:39.980]  You know, people who call me up
[22:39.980 --> 22:41.980]  You know, I have the agreements
[22:41.980 --> 22:43.980]  I have the canceled checks
[22:43.980 --> 22:45.980]  Actually, they're not canceled checks
[22:45.980 --> 22:47.980]  They're the checks that they send me
[22:47.980 --> 22:49.980]  To pay me to go away
[22:49.980 --> 22:51.980]  And I blank out the money number
[22:51.980 --> 22:55.980]  You know, but you'll read the thousand after it
[22:55.980 --> 22:56.980]  As to how much was involved
[22:56.980 --> 22:58.980]  But here's their check
[22:58.980 --> 23:00.980]  You know, why would they send me a check
[23:00.980 --> 23:02.980]  If they didn't settle
[23:02.980 --> 23:03.980]  You know
[23:03.980 --> 23:06.980]  So I have no problem with my credibility
[23:06.980 --> 23:07.980]  On how I've done this
[23:07.980 --> 23:10.980]  And then I've got so many other close friends
[23:10.980 --> 23:14.980]  That I've made over the years
[23:14.980 --> 23:16.980]  That have done this
[23:16.980 --> 23:21.980]  A friend of mine down in Florida
[23:21.980 --> 23:22.980]  Who's on his seventh case
[23:22.980 --> 23:24.980]  He's one ahead of me
[23:24.980 --> 23:27.980]  He won't accept a settlement agreement
[23:27.980 --> 23:28.980]  From these guys
[23:28.980 --> 23:29.980]  He doesn't want nothing to do
[23:29.980 --> 23:33.980]  With a settlement agreement
[23:33.980 --> 23:34.980]  And he calls me
[23:34.980 --> 23:35.980]  I guess we've known each other
[23:35.980 --> 23:37.980]  At least between five and seven years
[23:37.980 --> 23:38.980]  We're very, very close
[23:38.980 --> 23:39.980]  He calls me
[23:39.980 --> 23:41.980]  We've never met in person
[23:41.980 --> 23:42.980]  Thoughts on the phone
[23:42.980 --> 23:43.980]  And cell phone
[23:43.980 --> 23:44.980]  And Internet emails
[23:44.980 --> 23:46.980]  And all that
[23:46.980 --> 23:51.980]  He calls me his brother in arms
[23:51.980 --> 23:52.980]  He says, Mike
[23:52.980 --> 23:55.980]  This is the only place you and I disagree on all this stuff
[23:55.980 --> 23:56.980]  And we chuckle about it
[23:56.980 --> 23:58.980]  He won't accept a settlement agreement
[23:58.980 --> 24:00.980]  I always want one
[24:00.980 --> 24:01.980]  So I want to get this over
[24:01.980 --> 24:03.980]  And done it out of my life, folks
[24:03.980 --> 24:04.980]  I don't want to be doing this
[24:04.980 --> 24:05.980]  Every six months or a year
[24:05.980 --> 24:06.980]  Going into court
[24:06.980 --> 24:08.980]  All that stuff
[24:08.980 --> 24:09.980]  Anyhow
[24:09.980 --> 24:10.980]  And the reason that he
[24:10.980 --> 24:11.980]  I think you told me this one time
[24:11.980 --> 24:14.980]  The reason that he doesn't want a settlement agreement
[24:14.980 --> 24:17.980]  Is because he wants them to screw up again
[24:17.980 --> 24:19.980]  So that he can sue them again
[24:19.980 --> 24:23.980]  That's true
[24:23.980 --> 24:24.980]  He says, Mike
[24:24.980 --> 24:25.980]  I can use the money
[24:25.980 --> 24:27.980]  He says, I don't want them to come after me
[24:27.980 --> 24:28.980]  If you're going to close the problem
[24:28.980 --> 24:29.980]  I can use the money
[24:29.980 --> 24:30.980]  So he doesn't care about
[24:30.980 --> 24:32.980]  Cleaning up his credit record that much
[24:32.980 --> 24:33.980]  He just
[24:33.980 --> 24:37.980]  He's making a business out of this apparently
[24:37.980 --> 24:39.980]  Well, for himself he is, yeah
[24:39.980 --> 24:40.980]  Yeah
[24:40.980 --> 24:41.980]  I mean
[24:41.980 --> 24:42.980]  Okay
[24:42.980 --> 24:44.980]  I can't control his attitude
[24:44.980 --> 24:45.980]  He's got an attitude
[24:45.980 --> 24:46.980]  And his attitude is
[24:46.980 --> 24:47.980]  Bring it on, boys
[24:47.980 --> 24:49.980]  You're messing with the right guy
[24:49.980 --> 24:51.980]  Not the first time I've done this
[24:51.980 --> 24:52.980]  You know
[24:52.980 --> 24:54.980]  And we chuckle about it
[24:54.980 --> 24:55.980]  You know
[24:55.980 --> 24:58.980]  Of course we bounce stuff off of each other
[24:58.980 --> 25:01.980]  And I have several other people
[25:01.980 --> 25:02.980]  That I've known for many, many years
[25:02.980 --> 25:05.980]  That have been in federal court several times with this
[25:05.980 --> 25:06.980]  And generally what I do
[25:06.980 --> 25:09.980]  Of course I don't bring out their names or identity here
[25:09.980 --> 25:12.980]  That would be inappropriate on my part
[25:12.980 --> 25:15.980]  But once people hook up with me
[25:15.980 --> 25:20.980]  And I know who they are
[25:20.980 --> 25:21.980]  You know
[25:21.980 --> 25:22.980]  I will share some of those names with them
[25:22.980 --> 25:24.980]  Because I do have permission to do that
[25:24.980 --> 25:25.980]  Okay
[25:25.980 --> 25:26.980]  From people I've known
[25:26.980 --> 25:29.980]  And they're always pleased
[25:29.980 --> 25:31.980]  And you see
[25:31.980 --> 25:32.980]  People don't know how to study
[25:32.980 --> 25:33.980]  They don't know how to research
[25:33.980 --> 25:34.980]  People wonder
[25:34.980 --> 25:35.980]  How do I get a hold of Miros?
[25:35.980 --> 25:39.980]  How do I get a hold of him?
[25:39.980 --> 25:40.980]  Well
[25:40.980 --> 25:41.980]  You go in a pacer
[25:41.980 --> 25:43.980]  And it's real simple
[25:43.980 --> 25:45.980]  You go to the end of the complaint
[25:45.980 --> 25:47.980]  It has all my contact information there
[25:47.980 --> 25:49.980]  It has to
[25:49.980 --> 25:50.980]  Your name
[25:50.980 --> 25:51.980]  Your address
[25:51.980 --> 25:52.980]  Your phone number
[25:52.980 --> 25:53.980]  And your email
[25:53.980 --> 25:55.980]  Go look
[25:55.980 --> 25:57.980]  Take the time to study and learn
[25:57.980 --> 25:59.980]  This is not difficult stuff to learn
[25:59.980 --> 26:01.980]  You don't have to be Einstein
[26:01.980 --> 26:03.980]  It's really simple
[26:03.980 --> 26:05.980]  Really simple
[26:05.980 --> 26:08.980]  99% of this is paper pushing
[26:08.980 --> 26:10.980]  It's not like the local courts
[26:10.980 --> 26:12.980]  You go into local courts
[26:12.980 --> 26:13.980]  People are in the hallway
[26:13.980 --> 26:14.980]  Ringing their hands
[26:14.980 --> 26:15.980]  There's lawyers arguing
[26:15.980 --> 26:17.980]  There's lawyers shouting at people
[26:17.980 --> 26:18.980]  Pay this thing
[26:18.980 --> 26:19.980]  Or I'm going to sue you
[26:19.980 --> 26:22.980]  And you never see that in federal court
[26:22.980 --> 26:24.980]  I have people come back
[26:24.980 --> 26:30.980]  I have one lady I'm working with in California
[26:30.980 --> 26:33.980]  She went in the federal courthouse
[26:33.980 --> 26:35.980]  And she's got two or three cases
[26:35.980 --> 26:38.980]  Under FCRA and DCPA right now
[26:38.980 --> 26:39.980]  In federal court
[26:39.980 --> 26:41.980]  And she's already gotten once
[26:41.980 --> 26:43.980]  She had one case where she's got
[26:43.980 --> 26:45.980]  I believe four defendants
[26:45.980 --> 26:47.980]  And three of them already settled with her
[26:47.980 --> 26:50.980]  The creditor is the last one holding out
[26:50.980 --> 26:52.980]  So what does that tell you?
[26:52.980 --> 26:54.980]  Okay
[26:54.980 --> 26:56.980]  She's already gotten monetary payments
[26:56.980 --> 26:57.980]  From these people
[26:57.980 --> 26:58.980]  They go away
[26:58.980 --> 27:00.980]  They would excuse them from the case
[27:00.980 --> 27:01.980]  Okay
[27:01.980 --> 27:05.980]  Dismiss them from the case is the correct word
[27:05.980 --> 27:07.980]  So this goes on and on
[27:07.980 --> 27:10.980]  But she sent me an email the other day
[27:10.980 --> 27:11.980]  And she says you know
[27:11.980 --> 27:13.980]  While I was at the federal court
[27:13.980 --> 27:14.980]  I was looking all around
[27:14.980 --> 27:19.980]  And I went up way up to the top
[27:19.980 --> 27:21.980]  Oh it's so beautiful
[27:21.980 --> 27:23.980]  I can look out the windows
[27:23.980 --> 27:25.980]  And I can see all around San Diego
[27:25.980 --> 27:27.980]  And all that where she's at
[27:27.980 --> 27:29.980]  And she says in there
[27:29.980 --> 27:30.980]  You know what Mike?
[27:30.980 --> 27:32.980]  She's after I seen this building
[27:32.980 --> 27:33.980]  Walking around here
[27:33.980 --> 27:34.980]  She says I'm thinking about
[27:34.980 --> 27:39.980]  Becoming a federal judge
[27:39.980 --> 27:40.980]  Right
[27:40.980 --> 27:42.980]  In other words it's not nearly as intimidating
[27:42.980 --> 27:44.980]  As some people might think
[27:44.980 --> 27:45.980]  Exactly
[27:45.980 --> 27:46.980]  Exactly
[27:46.980 --> 27:47.980]  Very seldom
[27:47.980 --> 27:48.980]  Don't be for the judge
[27:48.980 --> 27:49.980]  Very seldom
[27:49.980 --> 27:50.980]  In fact from experiment
[27:50.980 --> 27:52.980]  What little experience I've had
[27:52.980 --> 27:53.980]  Dealing with federal courts
[27:53.980 --> 27:55.980]  They don't want to go to court anyway
[27:55.980 --> 27:57.980]  No one wants to actually see the inside of the courtroom
[27:57.980 --> 27:58.980]  Not even the judge
[27:58.980 --> 28:03.980]  And so basically most everything is done through the mail
[28:03.980 --> 28:05.980]  So that makes things a little bit easier
[28:05.980 --> 28:06.980]  Exactly
[28:06.980 --> 28:07.980]  E-mails
[28:07.980 --> 28:08.980]  E-mails
[28:08.980 --> 28:09.980]  And cell phones
[28:09.980 --> 28:10.980]  That's how most of it's done
[28:10.980 --> 28:11.980]  I always kid people
[28:11.980 --> 28:13.980]  I tell them 99% of this stuff
[28:13.980 --> 28:14.980]  You can be sitting home in your underwear
[28:14.980 --> 28:17.980]  Drinking a cup of coffee at your computer and phone
[28:17.980 --> 28:18.980]  Doing this stuff
[28:18.980 --> 28:19.980]  Nobody cares
[28:19.980 --> 28:20.980]  Right
[28:20.980 --> 28:22.980]  How much more laid back to that can you get?
[28:22.980 --> 28:23.980]  Okay
[28:23.980 --> 28:24.980]  Exactly
[28:24.980 --> 28:25.980]  So you know
[28:25.980 --> 28:28.980]  And you brought up a very good point
[28:28.980 --> 28:30.980]  About pursuing this
[28:30.980 --> 28:32.980]  I very seldom see these
[28:32.980 --> 28:36.980]  I've never seen a case go out of discovery
[28:36.980 --> 28:38.980]  You're preparing for trial folks
[28:38.980 --> 28:40.980]  And generally in the federal courts
[28:40.980 --> 28:42.980]  Especially the way they are right now
[28:42.980 --> 28:46.980]  You can expect that trial to be next year sometime
[28:46.980 --> 28:49.980]  Six, eight, twelve months away
[28:49.980 --> 28:50.980]  Okay
[28:50.980 --> 28:52.980]  But in the meantime you're hitting them with discovery
[28:52.980 --> 28:54.980]  And this costs them a ton of money
[28:54.980 --> 28:56.980]  And you get them through admissions and denials
[28:56.980 --> 28:58.980]  Production of documents
[28:58.980 --> 29:00.980]  Find out who you're going to depose
[29:00.980 --> 29:02.980]  I have a gentleman right now who's approached me
[29:02.980 --> 29:04.980]  Half his case was dismissed
[29:04.980 --> 29:07.980]  The other half was accepted in federal court
[29:07.980 --> 29:09.980]  He's contacting me now to work with him
[29:09.980 --> 29:11.980]  To get him through the discovery phase
[29:11.980 --> 29:12.980]  And again I'm not an attorney
[29:12.980 --> 29:14.980]  And I'm not giving anybody legal advice
[29:14.980 --> 29:15.980]  Okay
[29:15.980 --> 29:17.980]  It's my own experience
[29:17.980 --> 29:18.980]  You know I coach people
[29:18.980 --> 29:19.980]  I help people
[29:19.980 --> 29:21.980]  Okay
[29:21.980 --> 29:23.980]  But the point is he's going into discovery
[29:23.980 --> 29:24.980]  And he hasn't got a clue
[29:24.980 --> 29:25.980]  He says Mike who do I depose?
[29:25.980 --> 29:28.980]  I says we don't know yet
[29:28.980 --> 29:30.980]  I don't know what you're going to depose
[29:30.980 --> 29:31.980]  It's like you don't know
[29:31.980 --> 29:34.980]  No
[29:34.980 --> 29:36.980]  And I hear our background music coming up
[29:36.980 --> 29:38.980]  So it means I've got to shut up for a few minutes
[29:38.980 --> 29:40.980]  So we're going to find out
[29:40.980 --> 29:43.980]  How do you find out who to depose?
[29:43.980 --> 29:45.980]  And after we talk about that
[29:45.980 --> 29:48.980]  I want to kind of just maybe briefly walk through your process
[29:48.980 --> 29:51.980]  And what exactly needs to be done here
[29:51.980 --> 29:54.980]  Concerning these third party debt collectors and the creditors
[29:54.980 --> 29:56.980]  We'll be right back on the other side of the break folks
[29:56.980 --> 30:00.980]  This is the rule of law
[30:00.980 --> 30:03.980]  Are you the plaintiff or defendant in a lawsuit?
[30:03.980 --> 30:06.980]  Win your case without an attorney with Juris Dictionary
[30:06.980 --> 30:10.980]  The affordable, easy to understand, 4 CD course
[30:10.980 --> 30:13.980]  That will show you how in 24 hours
[30:13.980 --> 30:14.980]  Step by step
[30:14.980 --> 30:16.980]  If you have a lawyer
[30:16.980 --> 30:18.980]  Know what your lawyer should be doing
[30:18.980 --> 30:20.980]  If you don't have a lawyer
[30:20.980 --> 30:22.980]  Know what you should do for yourself
[30:22.980 --> 30:25.980]  Thousands have won with our step by step course
[30:25.980 --> 30:27.980]  And now you can too
[30:27.980 --> 30:30.980]  Juris Dictionary was created by a licensed attorney
[30:30.980 --> 30:33.980]  With 22 years of case winning experience
[30:33.980 --> 30:35.980]  Even if you're not in a lawsuit
[30:35.980 --> 30:38.980]  You can learn what everyone should understand
[30:38.980 --> 30:40.980]  About the principles and practices
[30:40.980 --> 30:42.980]  That control our American courts
[30:42.980 --> 30:44.980]  You'll receive our audio classroom
[30:44.980 --> 30:45.980]  Video seminar
[30:45.980 --> 30:46.980]  Tutorials
[30:46.980 --> 30:48.980]  Forms for civil cases
[30:48.980 --> 30:50.980]  Pro se tactics
[30:50.980 --> 30:51.980]  And much more
[30:51.980 --> 30:54.980]  Please visit ruleoflawradio.com
[30:54.980 --> 30:55.980]  And click on the banner
[30:55.980 --> 31:00.980]  Or call toll free 866-LAW-EZ
[31:26.980 --> 31:30.980]  This is a race for the team
[31:30.980 --> 31:33.980]  Well, I need a prosecutor to come and help me
[31:33.980 --> 31:35.980]  Prosecute them wicked leaders
[31:35.980 --> 31:36.980]  You see
[31:36.980 --> 31:37.980]  They're all liars
[31:37.980 --> 31:38.980]  They tell me
[31:38.980 --> 31:39.980]  They're not liars
[31:39.980 --> 31:40.980]  They tell sick stories
[31:40.980 --> 31:41.980]  But I believe me
[31:41.980 --> 31:42.980]  Say what they tell me
[31:42.980 --> 31:45.980]  3% of Americans vote for Moshi
[31:45.980 --> 31:48.980]  So how the hell did he get the presidency?
[31:48.980 --> 31:51.980]  That's why I have a warrant for him
[31:51.980 --> 31:52.980]  Everybody listen carefully
[31:52.980 --> 31:54.980]  Listen to the words of the three shoes
[31:54.980 --> 31:55.980]  Passes
[31:55.980 --> 31:56.980]  Citizens arrest
[31:56.980 --> 31:58.980]  From Mr. Bush
[31:59.980 --> 32:01.980]  I'm a warrant
[32:01.980 --> 32:03.980]  For Dick Cheney
[32:04.980 --> 32:06.980]  Citizens arrest
[32:06.980 --> 32:08.980]  From Mr. Bush
[32:09.980 --> 32:10.980]  I'm a warrant
[32:10.980 --> 32:11.980]  And I'm
[32:11.980 --> 32:13.980]  For Dick Cheney
[32:13.980 --> 32:15.980]  Well, we no forget Mumsfield
[32:15.980 --> 32:16.980]  Warrant for him
[32:16.980 --> 32:17.980]  All Dick Cheney
[32:17.980 --> 32:19.980]  Warrants for him
[32:19.980 --> 32:21.980]  Talked about the citizens in the country
[32:21.980 --> 32:22.980]  Them getting so mad
[32:22.980 --> 32:23.980]  And them getting angry
[32:23.980 --> 32:24.980]  We have some warrant
[32:24.980 --> 32:26.980]  We need to solve
[32:26.980 --> 32:27.980]  Need a prosecutor
[32:27.980 --> 32:28.980]  To come and help me
[32:28.980 --> 32:30.980]  Prosecutors from any state
[32:30.980 --> 32:31.980]  Will come over
[32:31.980 --> 32:33.980]  And we show them too
[32:33.980 --> 32:34.980]  Hear them
[32:34.980 --> 32:35.980]  Tell you
[32:35.980 --> 32:36.980]  Three shoes
[32:36.980 --> 32:37.980]  Passes pretty true
[32:37.980 --> 32:38.980]  That is true
[32:38.980 --> 32:40.980]  There's Silverstein
[32:40.980 --> 32:43.980]  You get the citizens arrested
[32:43.980 --> 32:45.980]  Silverstein and Hamilton
[32:45.980 --> 32:46.980]  You know them
[32:46.980 --> 32:48.980]  And they're not clean
[32:48.980 --> 32:50.980]  Everybody bring them in
[32:50.980 --> 32:51.980]  So we could solve them
[32:51.980 --> 32:52.980]  With warranting
[32:52.980 --> 32:56.980]  Okay, folks, we are back.
[32:56.980 --> 32:58.980]  This is the rule of law.
[32:58.980 --> 33:02.980]  We're here with a very special guest, Michael Miras.
[33:02.980 --> 33:11.980]  Okay, Mike, so we're just addressing right now the situation of you go into this and one of your clients said he didn't know who to depose.
[33:11.980 --> 33:12.980]  You said you didn't know either.
[33:12.980 --> 33:18.980]  So apparently this is in the early stages of the discovery process, I would imagine.
[33:18.980 --> 33:19.980]  Is that correct?
[33:19.980 --> 33:30.980]  No, what happens is the judge will order the case to rule 26F, which is discovery and a business plan or a timeline will be set up as to when all this needs to be completed.
[33:30.980 --> 33:34.980]  A date for trial will be set.
[33:34.980 --> 33:41.980]  They might say, okay, interrogatories, you must have done in a month and a half or two months.
[33:41.980 --> 33:44.980]  It's what everybody agrees to.
[33:44.980 --> 33:46.980]  But the interrogatories is what starts this.
[33:46.980 --> 33:51.980]  And you can ask some pretty pointed questions if you know what to ask.
[33:51.980 --> 33:54.980]  And who do we know who we're going to depose?
[33:54.980 --> 33:58.980]  I don't know who we're going to depose because we haven't found out who's who yet.
[33:58.980 --> 34:01.980]  And, of course, that's where the interrogatories come in.
[34:01.980 --> 34:14.980]  We ask questions like who's the head of charge of your IT department that handles all this stuff that's in charge for the security and the prevention of errors within your company, Mr.
[34:14.980 --> 34:17.980]  Predator.
[34:17.980 --> 34:23.980]  So that could be a vice president, president, director.
[34:23.980 --> 34:24.980]  Somebody's in charge of that.
[34:24.980 --> 34:28.980]  We want to know who it is.
[34:28.980 --> 34:33.980]  Oh, and then you'll get the answers from, oh, no, that's irrelevant immaterial from the lawyers.
[34:33.980 --> 34:34.980]  Burdensome.
[34:34.980 --> 34:36.980]  I've heard them all, folks.
[34:36.980 --> 34:38.980]  All the legalese.
[34:38.980 --> 34:41.980]  They don't want to talk.
[34:41.980 --> 34:46.980]  Then we'll ask them about, you know, who's giving you all this information from your client?
[34:46.980 --> 34:48.980]  What are their names, et cetera, et cetera?
[34:48.980 --> 34:50.980]  Now we're starting to get some names, aren't we?
[34:50.980 --> 34:54.980]  Now we're going to find out who we're going to depose.
[34:54.980 --> 34:56.980]  Uh-oh.
[34:56.980 --> 34:59.980]  And, of course, they'll come back, oh, we can't give you that information.
[34:59.980 --> 35:01.980]  Okay, no problem.
[35:01.980 --> 35:15.980]  And then one of the big questions is we ask them to explain their systems to prevent errors on their electronic data machines that provide this information to the bureaus.
[35:15.980 --> 35:17.980]  That's another question they don't want to answer.
[35:17.980 --> 35:19.980]  They don't want you to know their systems are broken.
[35:19.980 --> 35:27.980]  They haven't updated them in 100 years, and they really don't care because it would take them millions of dollars to do that.
[35:27.980 --> 35:39.980]  It's just easy to have to deal with know-nothing, beach-bun prosaic litigants like you who we can pay off after a few months to go away.
[35:39.980 --> 35:51.980]  But you have this little power in your hands when they refuse to answer pertinent questions called a motion to compel.
[35:51.980 --> 35:56.980]  And exactly what that means is you would go to the judge in the case.
[35:56.980 --> 35:59.980]  And before you do this, you have to be the nice guy.
[35:59.980 --> 36:02.980]  You're always nice, you know?
[36:02.980 --> 36:08.980]  The rule says you must try to convince the opposing party to answer these questions.
[36:08.980 --> 36:19.980]  So you send a little email off to the lawyer and say, Mr. Lawyer, you know, I really need answers, please, but if you refuse to give me answers, I'm going to file a motion to compel.
[36:19.980 --> 36:26.980]  We have a case right now where we have that, and the lawyer's asked for an additional 48 hours to talk to his client.
[36:26.980 --> 36:33.980]  Because you see, once you go to the judge and you show the judge why you need the answers to this, and the judge is pretty much going to agree with you.
[36:33.980 --> 36:36.980]  You need to know these things.
[36:36.980 --> 36:49.980]  The judge orders them to answer, and God help them if they refuse the direct order of a federal court judge to answer these questions.
[36:49.980 --> 36:55.980]  You know, that judge, I told you, that judge got those little guys here, those federal marshals.
[36:55.980 --> 37:00.980]  I don't think I want them showing up at my door for contempt because that's what will happen to them.
[37:00.980 --> 37:02.980]  The judge can do that.
[37:02.980 --> 37:12.980]  Absolutely. Have you seen a situation where they refuse to answer the questions under the order of the judge?
[37:12.980 --> 37:13.980]  Oh, no.
[37:13.980 --> 37:15.980]  They won't go there.
[37:15.980 --> 37:18.980]  They don't expect you to know this stuff.
[37:18.980 --> 37:22.980]  You know, you're just nothing but a no-nothing pro se litigate.
[37:22.980 --> 37:23.980]  What are you going to do to us?
[37:23.980 --> 37:25.980]  We're big lawyers.
[37:25.980 --> 37:26.980]  Okay.
[37:26.980 --> 37:27.980]  Okay.
[37:27.980 --> 37:31.980]  You think so.
[37:31.980 --> 37:32.980]  Don't have to deal with me anymore.
[37:32.980 --> 37:35.980]  I'm going to move it to the judge and let him do it.
[37:35.980 --> 37:37.980]  And you know what can happen?
[37:37.980 --> 37:41.980]  If they refuse the judge, guess what?
[37:41.980 --> 37:44.980]  The judge may grant a summary judgment for me.
[37:44.980 --> 37:45.980]  So go ahead and refuse them.
[37:45.980 --> 37:47.980]  I hope the hell you do.
[37:47.980 --> 37:49.980]  Use my English, okay?
[37:49.980 --> 37:51.980]  Although I don't think hell is a bad word.
[37:51.980 --> 37:57.980]  Anyway, I hope you refuse because I'm going to motion the judge for summary judgment.
[37:57.980 --> 37:59.980]  We'll finish this up right now.
[37:59.980 --> 38:04.980]  I'll get everything I'm coming after and go ahead and annoy the judge.
[38:04.980 --> 38:05.980]  All right?
[38:05.980 --> 38:07.980]  Let's do it.
[38:07.980 --> 38:09.980]  But you haven't seen them do that.
[38:09.980 --> 38:10.980]  No, no, no.
[38:10.980 --> 38:15.980]  Well, this one I've got right now that the lawyer was out a day or two.
[38:15.980 --> 38:19.980]  And I understand, you know, because we gave him 48 hours to respond.
[38:19.980 --> 38:20.980]  He says, look, I was out.
[38:20.980 --> 38:21.980]  I just got back today.
[38:21.980 --> 38:24.980]  Can I have another, you know, a couple of days and I'll get back to my client.
[38:24.980 --> 38:26.980]  I'll get back to you within 48 hours next week.
[38:26.980 --> 38:27.980]  Okay.
[38:27.980 --> 38:28.980]  Sure.
[38:28.980 --> 38:30.980]  We're always a nice guy.
[38:30.980 --> 38:35.980]  We want to be able to go to the judge and tell them we allowed them to do all this stuff.
[38:35.980 --> 38:38.980]  You know, we contact them, gave them 48 hours for a response.
[38:38.980 --> 38:39.980]  You get the answer.
[38:39.980 --> 38:41.980]  He asked for another 48 hours.
[38:41.980 --> 38:42.980]  We gave them that.
[38:42.980 --> 38:50.980]  If you're the judge sitting there saying, you're going to be saying, this person is trying to work with these guys and they're just mousing them around.
[38:50.980 --> 38:53.980]  So let's get the judge annoyed a little bit, okay?
[38:53.980 --> 38:55.980]  Why not?
[38:55.980 --> 38:58.980]  Good deal.
[38:58.980 --> 39:01.980]  But I have yet to see one of these cases go out of 26F.
[39:01.980 --> 39:05.980]  I have guys who are doing this that are chopping at the bit.
[39:05.980 --> 39:07.980]  They want to go to trial.
[39:07.980 --> 39:08.980]  They want to go to trial.
[39:08.980 --> 39:16.980]  They want to go before that jury of 12 people and the judge who don't have credit reports.
[39:16.980 --> 39:19.980]  That's why they don't want to go to trial.
[39:19.980 --> 39:21.980]  Find an unbiased jury, ladies and gentlemen.
[39:21.980 --> 39:22.980]  Good luck.
[39:22.980 --> 39:27.980]  Let me know anybody you run into that doesn't have a credit report.
[39:27.980 --> 39:31.980]  As soon as your kid gets a Social Security number, they've got a credit report.
[39:31.980 --> 39:37.980]  Might not be nothing in there, but they've got a credit report.
[39:37.980 --> 39:41.980]  So go find a jury of 12 people that don't have credit reports.
[39:41.980 --> 39:48.980]  Then they've got to worry about if one of those people on the jury ever had any of these problems, ever talked to a debt collector,
[39:48.980 --> 39:53.980]  ever talked to a credit card grantor, tried to negotiate or resolve something,
[39:53.980 --> 39:58.980]  or tried to talk to the credit bureaus and get something fixed there.
[39:58.980 --> 40:05.980]  All you need is one person who's had an issue and maybe that there might not be anybody on the jury that had an issue,
[40:05.980 --> 40:14.980]  but maybe they've had a friend, a relative, a brother, a sister, a son, a daughter that's been through this and has heard the horror stories.
[40:14.980 --> 40:21.980]  And all you need is once they get sequestered to make a decision, guilty or not guilty,
[40:21.980 --> 40:27.980]  is that one person to stand up or pop up in that jury room and say, hey, I've been through this stuff.
[40:27.980 --> 40:29.980]  I know what this guy went through.
[40:29.980 --> 40:32.980]  And they're son of a guns to do business with.
[40:32.980 --> 40:34.980]  You can't negotiate with them.
[40:34.980 --> 40:36.980]  It's everything is their way or the highway.
[40:36.980 --> 40:44.980]  I think we ought to give this guy everything he wants and maybe we want to move the court to give him treble damages.
[40:44.980 --> 40:48.980]  So the big issue is, folks, they know this.
[40:48.980 --> 40:51.980]  The lawyers know this, OK?
[40:51.980 --> 40:54.980]  You cannot get an unbiased jury.
[40:54.980 --> 40:59.980]  That's why they don't seem to want to go to trial.
[40:59.980 --> 41:04.980]  And then one other point I'll bring up here, which always fascinates me with this stuff,
[41:04.980 --> 41:11.980]  if you didn't know a darn thing about any of this stuff, didn't know the law, didn't know the rules,
[41:11.980 --> 41:20.980]  and you're on that jury, and here's one of the big banks, Chase, Citibank, in there,
[41:20.980 --> 41:24.980]  and you're fighting with them over this thing.
[41:24.980 --> 41:31.980]  I guess the first question I would ask if I didn't know any better or didn't know anything about the Fair Credit Reporting Act
[41:31.980 --> 41:37.980]  or the Debt Collection Practice Act, if I saw a case like this and here's this little consumer in here
[41:37.980 --> 41:41.980]  and they're fighting over this credit card and it's alleged debt and so on and so forth,
[41:41.980 --> 41:52.980]  my question to those big banks would be, did we not or did we just bail you guys out a few months ago?
[41:52.980 --> 41:59.980]  And this is how you spend our money?
[41:59.980 --> 42:02.980]  If I was sitting there, I'd be wondering that if I was a juror,
[42:02.980 --> 42:07.980]  if they're fighting with this little guy over a few thousand dollars, this is how they spend our money.
[42:07.980 --> 42:11.980]  No wonder we had to bail them out.
[42:11.980 --> 42:16.980]  They're not going to get much sympathy, my humble opinion, in that federal courtroom.
[42:16.980 --> 42:25.980]  Right, and the other issue too is that this is a totally different situation from going after public servants
[42:25.980 --> 42:31.980]  because in general the judges want to try to protect the public servants for some reason,
[42:31.980 --> 42:34.980]  I guess because they're getting paid off or whatever.
[42:34.980 --> 42:39.980]  But in this situation, this has nothing to do with government.
[42:39.980 --> 42:46.980]  So you're not going after a judge or a prosecutor or a policeman or some situation like that.
[42:46.980 --> 42:49.980]  You're going after debt collectors.
[42:49.980 --> 42:51.980]  Debt collectors and creditors.
[42:51.980 --> 42:56.980]  Yeah, they are not going to get much sympathy from the judge.
[42:56.980 --> 43:03.980]  It's not going to be a totally biased situation where the deck is completely stacked against you
[43:03.980 --> 43:06.980]  like when you try to go after public servants in court.
[43:06.980 --> 43:12.980]  All you're doing is enforcing the federal laws that are there to protect the consumer.
[43:12.980 --> 43:14.980]  That's all you're doing.
[43:14.980 --> 43:19.980]  You're forcing them to file a law and you can prove they didn't, bottom line.
[43:19.980 --> 43:24.980]  And that's all you've got to be able to do to win, all right?
[43:24.980 --> 43:27.980]  I'll answer your question about the judges.
[43:27.980 --> 43:35.980]  Most of these cases I've seen, this is my humble opinion, and I'll give it when we come back after the break.
[43:35.980 --> 43:41.980]  Okay, and then when we come back from the break I want to do a little synopsis of what your method entails
[43:41.980 --> 43:45.980]  and how do we trip them up with these civil rights laws?
[43:45.980 --> 43:48.980]  What are some things that we can look for and stuff like that?
[43:48.980 --> 43:49.980]  What's the difference?
[43:49.980 --> 43:54.980]  How do you deal with a debt collector versus a creditor and some things like that?
[43:54.980 --> 43:57.980]  Let's get into some nitty-gritty nuts and bolts on the other side.
[43:57.980 --> 44:00.980]  We'll be right back.
[44:00.980 --> 44:05.980]  Are you being harassed by debt collectors with phone calls, letters, or even lawsuits?
[44:05.980 --> 44:09.980]  Stop debt collectors now with the Michael Mears proven method.
[44:09.980 --> 44:14.980]  Michael Mears has won six cases in federal court against debt collectors, and now you can win two.
[44:14.980 --> 44:20.980]  You'll get step-by-step instructions in plain English on how to win in court using federal civil rights statutes.
[44:20.980 --> 44:24.980]  What to do when contacted by phone, mail, or court summons.
[44:24.980 --> 44:26.980]  How to answer letters and phone calls.
[44:26.980 --> 44:29.980]  How to get debt collectors out of your credit report.
[44:29.980 --> 44:33.980]  How to turn the financial tables on them and make them pay you to go away.
[44:33.980 --> 44:38.980]  The Michael Mears proven method is the solution for how to stop debt collectors.
[44:38.980 --> 44:41.980]  Personal consultation is available as well.
[44:41.980 --> 44:46.980]  For more information, please visit ruleoflawradio.com and click on the blue Michael Mears banner.
[44:46.980 --> 44:49.980]  Or email michaelmears at yahoo.com.
[44:49.980 --> 44:51.980]  That's ruleoflawradio.com.
[44:51.980 --> 45:13.980]  Or email michaelmears at yahoo.com to learn how to stop debt collectors now.
[45:13.980 --> 45:28.980]  All right, folks, we're back with our very special guest, Mike Mears.
[45:28.980 --> 45:34.980]  And if you want to order his course, you can do so on ruleoflawradio.com.
[45:34.980 --> 45:36.980]  Scroll down to about the middle of the page.
[45:36.980 --> 45:43.980]  You'll see two banners, one for jurisdiction area on the right and then the Michael Mears banner on the left.
[45:43.980 --> 45:47.980]  Okay, so, Mike, you were just about to tell us about this judge situation,
[45:47.980 --> 45:51.980]  and then we're going to do a synopsis of your course here and a little walkthrough.
[45:51.980 --> 45:57.980]  Well, you know what I think it is, and I might be mistaken, again, of my humble opinion.
[45:57.980 --> 45:59.980]  I mean, I don't know the judges personally.
[45:59.980 --> 46:05.980]  Most of the judges, all the judges I've worked with have been super, the federal judges.
[46:05.980 --> 46:06.980]  They've been super.
[46:06.980 --> 46:10.980]  I can't speak well enough of them.
[46:10.980 --> 46:15.980]  Very, very understanding, very concise.
[46:15.980 --> 46:18.980]  My experience with the federal judges have been great.
[46:18.980 --> 46:22.980]  Now, I'm not saying everybody's experience is that way, but mine has been great, okay?
[46:22.980 --> 46:36.980]  Anyhow, my personal opinion is I think the judges get a kick out of seeing a beach bum pro se litigant coming in there taking these big guys on.
[46:36.980 --> 46:42.980]  I think they're sitting there saying, well, this guy's got some nerve taking this big bank, this big credit card company on.
[46:42.980 --> 46:44.980]  I've got to give him credit for that.
[46:44.980 --> 46:49.980]  He's got some brass, you know, to do that.
[46:49.980 --> 46:54.980]  So I think the judge is interested to see the outcome of what's going to happen, all right?
[46:54.980 --> 46:55.980]  Personal humble opinion.
[46:55.980 --> 47:03.980]  I obviously don't know what's going on in the minds of the judges, but I think maybe they get a kick out of seeing some of this stuff.
[47:03.980 --> 47:05.980]  I think you're right.
[47:05.980 --> 47:06.980]  Yeah.
[47:06.980 --> 47:10.980]  Before you go to your little synopsis, let me just plug one other thing in here.
[47:10.980 --> 47:12.980]  Pacer.
[47:12.980 --> 47:16.980]  People say to me, well, this debt collector is chasing me.
[47:16.980 --> 47:18.980]  Okay, what's their name?
[47:18.980 --> 47:22.980]  Oh, ABC Debt Collector.
[47:22.980 --> 47:25.980]  If you go look them up on Pacer, what's Pacer, Mike?
[47:25.980 --> 47:26.980]  Oh, okay.
[47:26.980 --> 47:30.980]  Well, I've got to go through a half-hour scenario explaining how to do this and get on there.
[47:30.980 --> 47:33.980]  Of course, this is all laid out in the courses, folks.
[47:33.980 --> 47:34.980]  The links are there.
[47:34.980 --> 47:35.980]  Everything is there.
[47:35.980 --> 47:37.980]  You go in, you hit Control, you hit on the link.
[47:37.980 --> 47:44.980]  It'll take you right to where you can sign up for this stuff.
[47:44.980 --> 47:47.980]  Go look that debt collector up at Pacer.
[47:47.980 --> 47:51.980]  You might be surprised.
[47:51.980 --> 47:57.980]  I had a gentleman the other day, he lives in Las Vegas, and he's got this one chase of
[47:57.980 --> 47:58.980]  them.
[47:58.980 --> 48:02.980]  I went and looked them up, and they've been sued so far twice in Nevada.
[48:02.980 --> 48:07.980]  But then I did the nationwide lookup, every federal court in the United States, every
[48:07.980 --> 48:08.980]  district.
[48:08.980 --> 48:13.980]  They've only been sued 1,458 times, ladies and gentlemen.
[48:13.980 --> 48:16.980]  One debt collector for breaking the rules.
[48:16.980 --> 48:20.980]  I'm surprised that didn't put him out of business.
[48:20.980 --> 48:22.980]  Well, why should it?
[48:22.980 --> 48:28.980]  They'll just make it up on the other 100,000 clients they have that don't know this stuff.
[48:28.980 --> 48:32.980]  They'll just add the interest, raise their interest, raise their lay charges, and make
[48:32.980 --> 48:33.980]  the money back up.
[48:33.980 --> 48:34.980]  All right, come on.
[48:34.980 --> 48:35.980]  Use your head.
[48:35.980 --> 48:36.980]  They have that many clients.
[48:36.980 --> 48:37.980]  That's amazing.
[48:37.980 --> 48:45.980]  Well, you know, a company that just went out of business, and I'll use their name, a big
[48:45.980 --> 48:48.980]  debt collector, Wamproft and Abramson.
[48:48.980 --> 48:50.980]  They went bankrupt.
[48:50.980 --> 48:55.980]  Oh, I don't know, about a year or so ago.
[48:55.980 --> 48:58.980]  First or second largest debt collector in the United States.
[48:58.980 --> 48:59.980]  Wow.
[48:59.980 --> 49:05.980]  Go look up Wamproft and Abramson on Pacer.
[49:05.980 --> 49:13.980]  Because when you see over the 3,000 times they have been sued in federal court, be prepared
[49:13.980 --> 49:20.980]  to spend the next two years of your life looking at every one of those cases.
[49:20.980 --> 49:22.980]  I don't make this stuff up.
[49:22.980 --> 49:24.980]  It's there.
[49:24.980 --> 49:28.980]  And see, when I see stuff like that, folks, that just convinces me I'm doing the right
[49:28.980 --> 49:29.980]  thing.
[49:29.980 --> 49:32.980]  I'm not the only nut job out here.
[49:32.980 --> 49:33.980]  Okay?
[49:33.980 --> 49:41.980]  There was 2,999 other people that said, no, I'm not going to let you push me around.
[49:41.980 --> 49:43.980]  Okay?
[49:43.980 --> 49:49.980]  God forbid you should go look up one of the big banks or one of these big credit card
[49:49.980 --> 49:51.980]  companies.
[49:51.980 --> 49:55.980]  It will open your mind.
[49:55.980 --> 49:58.980]  Other people have done this.
[49:58.980 --> 50:03.980]  It's just we don't have enough of them doing it yet so we can get the laws changed and
[50:03.980 --> 50:08.980]  get the fines and violations increased to make it more costly for them.
[50:08.980 --> 50:15.980]  But folks, it don't make no difference because when you go after one of those big banks,
[50:15.980 --> 50:21.980]  one of those big credit card companies that big banks own, they ain't worried.
[50:21.980 --> 50:22.980]  Sue us all you want.
[50:22.980 --> 50:23.980]  We'll pay you off.
[50:23.980 --> 50:24.980]  Go away.
[50:24.980 --> 50:28.980]  Because if we run out of money, we'll just bail their butts out again, won't we?
[50:28.980 --> 50:29.980]  We'll just go to the U.S.
[50:29.980 --> 50:32.980]  government, tell them we're in trouble, give us more money to stay in business.
[50:32.980 --> 50:37.980]  Won't they do that now that they know how easy it is?
[50:37.980 --> 50:40.980]  It's a crime shame, isn't it?
[50:40.980 --> 50:41.980]  Well, it's the truth.
[50:41.980 --> 50:43.980]  The truth is always the son of a gun.
[50:43.980 --> 50:48.980]  You know, again, I'm refraining from using the wrong word, but the truth is the truth.
[50:48.980 --> 50:49.980]  Isn't that the truth?
[50:49.980 --> 50:54.980]  Isn't that what we did last year, bailed all these banks out because they, AIG, the
[50:54.980 --> 50:58.980]  insurance company, because they insured all these bad loans, we bailed them out.
[50:58.980 --> 51:00.980]  It's the name of the game.
[51:00.980 --> 51:07.980]  I'm not a big fan of Michael Moore, but he just did a movie, and I suggest everybody
[51:07.980 --> 51:14.980]  go see it because I got a heck of a kick out of it, called Capitalism, an American
[51:14.980 --> 51:19.980]  love affair, or a love affair, capitalism.
[51:19.980 --> 51:24.980]  And it was funny, and heck, he's talking about all this money we gave the big banks,
[51:24.980 --> 51:26.980]  and he points every one of them out.
[51:26.980 --> 51:31.980]  He went down to Wall Street in New York, and he took, and if you go to YouTube, you can
[51:31.980 --> 51:34.980]  see some of the excerpts from the movie.
[51:34.980 --> 51:36.980]  Capitalism.
[51:36.980 --> 51:37.980]  Yeah.
[51:37.980 --> 51:39.980]  Well, he mislabeled it.
[51:39.980 --> 51:42.980]  It's actually, what's happening in this situation is actually fascism.
[51:42.980 --> 51:43.980]  It's not capitalism.
[51:43.980 --> 51:46.980]  Bailing out banks is not capitalism.
[51:46.980 --> 51:48.980]  That is a merger of public and state.
[51:48.980 --> 51:53.980]  I agree with you, and I don't normally agree with a lot of the stuff he does, but this
[51:53.980 --> 51:56.980]  was pretty interesting because I could relate to all of it.
[51:56.980 --> 51:58.980]  But I got a real kick out of him.
[51:58.980 --> 52:03.980]  When he went down to Wall Street, he took the police crime scene tape, the yellow tape,
[52:03.980 --> 52:08.980]  and wrapped it all around JP Morgan Chase's building and stood out there with a megaphone
[52:08.980 --> 52:11.980]  hollering at the building, come out, come out, you're all criminals.
[52:11.980 --> 52:14.980]  Come out and walk away from the building.
[52:14.980 --> 52:15.980]  I was laughing.
[52:15.980 --> 52:18.980]  And then he showed up with an armored car with the empty bags.
[52:18.980 --> 52:20.980]  How about giving us our money back?
[52:20.980 --> 52:21.980]  Yeah, really.
[52:21.980 --> 52:24.980]  I promise you, I'll take it right back to Fort Knox.
[52:24.980 --> 52:26.980]  I promise you, I only got this one bag.
[52:26.980 --> 52:30.980]  I know it won't fill all the billions we've given you, but I got more bags in the armored
[52:30.980 --> 52:31.980]  car.
[52:31.980 --> 52:32.980]  Yeah, right.
[52:32.980 --> 52:34.980]  I'm just sitting here chuckling, okay?
[52:34.980 --> 52:41.980]  Then you see a scene where a guy owned a farm for 40 years in his family, and he's getting
[52:41.980 --> 52:46.980]  foreclosed on because he got suckered into one of these flexible loans where they can
[52:46.980 --> 52:48.980]  increase the interest.
[52:48.980 --> 52:53.980]  And when it first started out, it was $1,700 a month, and he says, I could afford it.
[52:53.980 --> 52:56.980]  He said, within two years, they raised that up to $2,700 a month.
[52:56.980 --> 53:02.980]  He said, I couldn't make the payments, and now I'm losing my home, my farm that's been
[53:02.980 --> 53:05.980]  in the family for 40 years.
[53:05.980 --> 53:09.980]  And oh, by the way, the bank told him if he'd leave it in broom clean condition, they'd
[53:09.980 --> 53:13.980]  pay him for cleaning his house out as he's moving out on the last day.
[53:13.980 --> 53:14.980]  Isn't that nice?
[53:14.980 --> 53:16.980]  They gave him a check for $1,000.
[53:16.980 --> 53:18.980]  You've got to go see that.
[53:18.980 --> 53:24.980]  Folks, I just know the stuff that's going on, and people need to stand up and fight for
[53:24.980 --> 53:29.980]  their rights under the law, and that's what this stuff tells you to do, okay?
[53:29.980 --> 53:30.980]  Absolutely.
[53:30.980 --> 53:34.980]  And I have people that come to me and say, I'm not sure if I can do this, and you know,
[53:34.980 --> 53:41.980]  and okay, well, I understand that, but let me ask you this $100,000 question.
[53:41.980 --> 53:48.980]  If you don't do anything, what's going to happen?
[53:48.980 --> 53:50.980]  So then people, the lights kind of come on and say, you know what?
[53:50.980 --> 53:51.980]  I'm going to try.
[53:51.980 --> 53:52.980]  That's right.
[53:52.980 --> 53:53.980]  You're going to try.
[53:53.980 --> 53:57.980]  And once you learn how to do this, stop these guys.
[53:57.980 --> 54:01.980]  I get people in all kinds of different situations, people that are being pulled into lower court.
[54:01.980 --> 54:03.980]  I don't do much in the lower court.
[54:03.980 --> 54:09.980]  We've got some things that work there to slow that process down and buy you some time.
[54:09.980 --> 54:10.980]  I've got people that come to me.
[54:10.980 --> 54:11.980]  I've got a judgment.
[54:11.980 --> 54:12.980]  Can I do anything?
[54:12.980 --> 54:13.980]  Yup.
[54:13.980 --> 54:15.980]  They can follow the rules, okay?
[54:15.980 --> 54:19.980]  When they don't follow the rules, take them into federal court, sue them, and when they
[54:19.980 --> 54:24.980]  want to know what you want to go away as, oh, yeah, you know, I want my costs, a little
[54:24.980 --> 54:26.980]  cash to go away for my time and effort.
[54:26.980 --> 54:29.980]  Oh, by the way, get that darn judgment out of the lower court.
[54:29.980 --> 54:31.980]  If not, we're going to go to trial.
[54:31.980 --> 54:37.980]  We'll let the judge and jury decide, and when I win my $100,000 lawsuit and your client,
[54:37.980 --> 54:43.980]  Mr. Attorney, pays me and that check clears my bank, I'll gladly go down to the local
[54:43.980 --> 54:45.980]  court and pay that judgment off you got down there.
[54:45.980 --> 54:51.980]  As soon as your client's check clears my bank, no problem.
[54:51.980 --> 54:52.980]  It's real simple.
[54:52.980 --> 54:54.980]  It's a money game, folks.
[54:54.980 --> 54:55.980]  It's a money game.
[54:55.980 --> 54:57.980]  I can assure you of that.
[54:57.980 --> 55:00.980]  It costs them a ton of money to go to trial.
[55:00.980 --> 55:04.980]  I have a friend of mine, or actually he's a client of mine who's in Texas who has a
[55:04.980 --> 55:10.980]  very close friend who's an attorney, and he presented the scenario to this attorney,
[55:10.980 --> 55:14.980]  if you had to represent one of these big banks to go to trial and everything, what would
[55:14.980 --> 55:16.980]  you charge?
[55:16.980 --> 55:21.980]  And the lawyer said, oh, I would require a $50,000 retainer.
[55:21.980 --> 55:24.980]  So, folks, let me get the numbers right here.
[55:24.980 --> 55:29.980]  You take them into federal court with your violations of Fair Credit and or Debt
[55:29.980 --> 55:34.980]  Collection Practices Act, which, I don't know, could be $10,000, $15,000, $20,000.
[55:34.980 --> 55:35.980]  Who knows?
[55:35.980 --> 55:36.980]  Okay?
[55:36.980 --> 55:41.980]  And then your damages to your credit report, damages to your credit score, damages to your
[55:41.980 --> 55:45.980]  reputation because you say in my credit report I don't pay my bills.
[55:45.980 --> 55:48.980]  So you put a $100,000 lawsuit together.
[55:48.980 --> 55:49.980]  So let's see.
[55:49.980 --> 55:53.980]  That's $100,000 and the lawyer's got to get paid $50,000 to defend.
[55:53.980 --> 55:56.980]  That's $150,000.
[55:56.980 --> 55:59.980]  And they're trying to collect the $10,000 credit card.
[55:59.980 --> 56:04.980]  Does anybody see anything wrong with these numbers?
[56:04.980 --> 56:08.980]  Or is my thinking all screwed up here?
[56:08.980 --> 56:11.980]  Yes, so basically you're just pushing them into the corner financially.
[56:11.980 --> 56:16.980]  It's economically unfeasible for them to want to pursue it, besides the fact that
[56:16.980 --> 56:18.980]  they're breaking the law anyway.
[56:18.980 --> 56:19.980]  That's right.
[56:19.980 --> 56:24.980]  And if you have any doubt of that, you know, let's go take it to the jury and ask them
[56:24.980 --> 56:25.980]  what they think.
[56:25.980 --> 56:26.980]  That's my attitude.
[56:26.980 --> 56:27.980]  You want to find out?
[56:27.980 --> 56:28.980]  We can find out.
[56:28.980 --> 56:31.980]  I've had the lawyers, I've been nose to nose with them.
[56:31.980 --> 56:32.980]  You can't do this.
[56:32.980 --> 56:33.980]  You can't do that.
[56:33.980 --> 56:37.980]  You can only get $1,000 for debt collection for access act violation.
[56:37.980 --> 56:38.980]  You know what, Mr. Attorney?
[56:38.980 --> 56:39.980]  You might be right.
[56:39.980 --> 56:42.980]  Let's let the judge and jury decide.
[56:42.980 --> 56:44.980]  That's simple.
[56:44.980 --> 56:48.980]  You want to go there and find out because you may not get as much mercy from that jury
[56:48.980 --> 56:53.980]  as you think, but we can find out if you want to go there.
[56:53.980 --> 56:55.980]  I'm prepared to go.
[56:55.980 --> 56:58.980]  I'm prepared to show the jury how you broke the law, and then I'm prepared to let them
[56:58.980 --> 57:02.980]  make a decision.
[57:02.980 --> 57:05.980]  And I don't think it's going to be in the favor of a debt collector who very seldom
[57:05.980 --> 57:08.980]  wants to go into that courtroom.
[57:08.980 --> 57:10.980]  Okay?
[57:10.980 --> 57:14.980]  You know, we can get into what debt collectors, when they buy these things, what they pay
[57:14.980 --> 57:19.980]  for them, fraud upon a consumer, and see if we can find that all out in discovery.
[57:19.980 --> 57:23.980]  I love that they debt collector in discovery.
[57:23.980 --> 57:27.980]  We bought this debt from ABC Bank.
[57:27.980 --> 57:29.980]  Really?
[57:29.980 --> 57:31.980]  Yes, and we're collecting it.
[57:31.980 --> 57:35.980]  Well, one of the questions I'd ask them in discovery is produce the contract to show
[57:35.980 --> 57:41.980]  that you actually purchased this debt or alleged debt from this creditor, and then also what
[57:41.980 --> 57:43.980]  you paid for it.
[57:43.980 --> 57:47.980]  Yeah, and I would like to know how they managed to purchase the debt after it's already been
[57:47.980 --> 57:52.980]  charged off on the capital gains tax of the original bank.
[57:52.980 --> 57:59.980]  Well, see, in discovery, that's a very good question, isn't it?
[57:59.980 --> 58:01.980]  And you know what to do if they won't answer it.
[58:01.980 --> 58:03.980]  You know just exactly what to do.
[58:03.980 --> 58:05.980]  Good old motion to capel.
[58:05.980 --> 58:07.980]  Another commercial coming up.
[58:07.980 --> 58:09.980]  Okay, yeah, we're at the top of the hour.
[58:09.980 --> 58:11.980]  We do have a caller, Mark from Wisconsin, on the line.
[58:11.980 --> 58:15.980]  He's one of our affiliates, and he's talked to you before on the air.
[58:15.980 --> 58:18.980]  So when we get back on the other side, I'd like to take a question from Mark, and then
[58:18.980 --> 58:23.980]  I'd like to just briefly walk through some of the issues that you discussed in your course
[58:23.980 --> 58:27.980]  concerning how to deal, you know, what the differences are between dealing with the debt
[58:27.980 --> 58:31.980]  collectors and the creditors and what the laws say, you know, the Fair Debt Collections
[58:31.980 --> 58:34.980]  Practices Act and the Credit Reporting Act and these things.
[58:34.980 --> 58:36.980]  Get into some nuts and bolts.
[58:36.980 --> 58:40.980]  All right, we'll be right back on the other side after the INN World Report.
[58:40.980 --> 58:45.980]  We'll be right back.
[59:10.980 --> 59:12.980]  Brave New Books?
[59:12.980 --> 59:16.980]  Yes, Brave New Books has all the books and DVDs you're looking for by authors like
[59:16.980 --> 59:19.980]  Alex Jones, Ron Paul, and G. Edward Griffin.
[59:19.980 --> 59:23.980]  They even stock inner food, Berkey products, and Calvin Soaps.
[59:23.980 --> 59:25.980]  There's no way a place like that exists.
[59:25.980 --> 59:27.980]  Go check it out for yourself.
[59:27.980 --> 59:31.980]  It's downtown at 1904 Guadalupe Street, just south of UT.
[59:31.980 --> 59:34.980]  By UT, there's never anywhere to park down there.
[59:34.980 --> 59:40.980]  Actually, they now offer a free hour of parking for paying customers at the 500 MLK parking facility
[59:40.980 --> 59:42.980]  just behind the bookstore.
[59:42.980 --> 59:45.980]  It does exist, but when are they open?
[59:45.980 --> 59:50.980]  Monday through Saturday, 11 a.m. to 9 p.m. and 1 to 6 p.m. on Sundays.
[59:50.980 --> 59:59.980]  So give them a call at 512-480-2503 or check out their events page at bravenewbookstore.com.
[59:59.980 --> 01:00:04.980]  This news brief brought to you by the International News Net.
[01:00:04.980 --> 01:00:09.980]  Gareth Williams, the British spy whose body was found stuffed into a sports bag Wednesday,
[01:00:09.980 --> 01:00:14.980]  had been employed as a communications worker at the UK government's listening post in Cheltenham
[01:00:14.980 --> 01:00:18.980]  and most recently at MI6, Britain's overseas spy service.
[01:00:18.980 --> 01:00:22.980]  The last spy to have been killed in Britain was Russian Alexander Litvinenko,
[01:00:22.980 --> 01:00:28.980]  who died of radioactive poisoning in 2006.
[01:00:28.980 --> 01:00:35.980]  Afghan President Hamid Karzai says U.S. plans to start pulling troops out of Afghanistan next year
[01:00:35.980 --> 01:00:40.980]  are boosting the Taliban's spirits, giving them morale value.
[01:00:40.980 --> 01:00:43.980]  Karzai has also told the head of U.S. Central Command
[01:00:43.980 --> 01:00:50.980]  terrorism won't be defeated without rooting out terrorist sanctuaries across the border in Pakistan.
[01:00:50.980 --> 01:00:55.980]  U.S. Supreme Court Justice Sonia Sotomayor predicted Thursday
[01:00:55.980 --> 01:01:00.980]  that the country's high court will be asked to weigh issues of national security versus free speech
[01:01:00.980 --> 01:01:04.980]  because of the leaked classified documents posted on WikiLeaks.
[01:01:04.980 --> 01:01:08.980]  The documents, which included names of Afghans working with U.S. forces,
[01:01:08.980 --> 01:01:11.980]  have been blasted by the Pentagon for putting lives at risk.
[01:01:11.980 --> 01:01:16.980]  WikiLeaks insists the website provides a public service for whistleblowers.
[01:01:16.980 --> 01:01:20.980]  This news brief brought to you by the International News Net.
[01:01:20.980 --> 01:01:26.980]  former U.S. President Jimmy Carter has secured the release of a U.S. citizen detained in North Korea.
[01:01:26.980 --> 01:01:30.980]  Aijalan Gomes was sentenced to eight years' hard labor in April
[01:01:30.980 --> 01:01:34.980]  after being found guilty of illegally entering the country from China.
[01:01:34.980 --> 01:01:39.980]  Carter, who spent two days in Pyongyang, has now left with Gomes.
[01:01:39.980 --> 01:01:44.980]  Carter's visit came at a time of heightened tension between North Korea and the outside world
[01:01:44.980 --> 01:01:47.980]  in the wake of sinking a South Korean warship.
[01:01:47.980 --> 01:01:52.980]  After visiting North Korea, Carter is following in the footsteps of former President Bill Clinton,
[01:01:52.980 --> 01:01:57.980]  who last year secured the release of two U.S. journalists detained for crossing the border.
[01:01:57.980 --> 01:02:05.980]  North Korea's state media said Korean officials told Carter Pyongyang was willing to reenter talks on its nuclear program.
[01:02:05.980 --> 01:02:09.980]  Talks have been stalled for several months now.
[01:02:09.980 --> 01:02:15.980]  Scientists Thursday reported results from the first detailed study of a giant plume of oily water
[01:02:15.980 --> 01:02:23.980]  that had blown out BP well in the Gulf of Mexico, 22 miles long, more than a mile wide, and 650 feet tall.
[01:02:23.980 --> 01:02:29.980]  The new data is the first peer-reviewed study about oil lurking 3,000 feet below the surface.
[01:02:29.980 --> 01:02:35.980]  The study refutes the government's recent estimate that 75 percent of the oil from the BP well
[01:02:35.980 --> 01:02:38.980]  had been skimmed, burned, or broken up by chemical dispersants.
[01:02:38.980 --> 01:02:44.980]  Lead researcher Rich Kamili said many people speculated subsurface oil droplets
[01:02:44.980 --> 01:02:46.980]  were being easily biodegraded.
[01:02:46.980 --> 01:03:15.980]  Well, we didn't find that. We found it was still there.
[01:03:15.980 --> 01:03:26.980]  It's all according to the will of the Almighty.
[01:03:26.980 --> 01:03:33.980]  I read his book and it says he cares not for the unsightly.
[01:03:33.980 --> 01:03:42.980]  These warmongers come by that term rightly.
[01:03:42.980 --> 01:03:46.980]  I won't pay for the war with my body.
[01:03:46.980 --> 01:03:49.980]  Ain't gonna pay for the car with my money.
[01:03:49.980 --> 01:03:52.980]  I won't pay for the fun with my body.
[01:03:52.980 --> 01:03:56.980]  Their plans wicked and their logic shoddy.
[01:03:56.980 --> 01:03:59.980]  Ain't gonna pay for the oil with my body.
[01:03:59.980 --> 01:04:02.980]  I won't pay for the boys with my money.
[01:04:02.980 --> 01:04:05.980]  Okay, we are back.
[01:04:05.980 --> 01:04:10.980]  And we are just about to get into the nuts and bolts, the nuts and bolts of how all this works,
[01:04:10.980 --> 01:04:16.980]  how Mike's system works, how to deal with the debt collectors versus how to deal with the creditors,
[01:04:16.980 --> 01:04:20.980]  and just do a little brief walkover of his course.
[01:04:20.980 --> 01:04:23.980]  But first we are going to take this call from Mark in Wisconsin.
[01:04:23.980 --> 01:04:25.980]  I'm sure Mark has questions for Mike.
[01:04:25.980 --> 01:04:26.980]  Mark, thanks for calling in.
[01:04:26.980 --> 01:04:29.980]  What's your question for Mike tonight?
[01:04:29.980 --> 01:04:30.980]  Hi, Deborah. Hi, Mike.
[01:04:30.980 --> 01:04:32.980]  Hi, Mark.
[01:04:32.980 --> 01:04:37.980]  Hey, I just signed a settlement agreement yesterday, Mike, so thanks for that.
[01:04:37.980 --> 01:04:39.980]  Good for you, Mark.
[01:04:39.980 --> 01:04:43.980]  Why does that not surprise me?
[01:04:43.980 --> 01:04:48.980]  Mark and I have talked before, ladies and gentlemen, and Mark listens in on these phone calls,
[01:04:48.980 --> 01:04:52.980]  and that's how we met, I don't know, what, about six, eight months ago, Mark?
[01:04:52.980 --> 01:04:53.980]  Right, right.
[01:04:53.980 --> 01:04:56.980]  Mark, you have Mike's course, right?
[01:04:56.980 --> 01:04:57.980]  Yes, I do.
[01:04:57.980 --> 01:05:03.980]  And thanks to Mark, where this show is actually on the FM Airwaves in Madison, Wisconsin.
[01:05:03.980 --> 01:05:05.980]  I want to thank you for that, Mark.
[01:05:05.980 --> 01:05:07.980]  You're welcome.
[01:05:07.980 --> 01:05:09.980]  So you signed a settlement agreement.
[01:05:09.980 --> 01:05:12.980]  So how intimidating was all this stuff, Mark?
[01:05:12.980 --> 01:05:16.980]  Mike, I didn't even see a judge.
[01:05:16.980 --> 01:05:21.980]  Surprise, surprise.
[01:05:21.980 --> 01:05:25.980]  Mark, did they make you sign a nondisclosure agreement?
[01:05:25.980 --> 01:05:28.980]  I did sign a nondisclosure agreement.
[01:05:28.980 --> 01:05:32.980]  And my brother-in-law, he's a big-time attorney in Chicago, and he told me,
[01:05:32.980 --> 01:05:40.980]  Mike, I don't know if you're aware of this, you should assign $50 to the nondisclosure agreement
[01:05:40.980 --> 01:05:44.980]  to lessen any tax liabilities that might be involved.
[01:05:44.980 --> 01:05:45.980]  Okay.
[01:05:45.980 --> 01:05:54.980]  Mike does advise people that the defendant pay any tax liabilities to in a settlement agreement.
[01:05:54.980 --> 01:05:55.980]  I know that.
[01:05:55.980 --> 01:05:59.980]  Yeah, I usually tell them they're responsible for the W-9.
[01:05:59.980 --> 01:06:00.980]  Okay.
[01:06:00.980 --> 01:06:01.980]  Right.
[01:06:01.980 --> 01:06:08.980]  Well, keep in mind that I get people out there that just want this over and done with.
[01:06:08.980 --> 01:06:10.980]  Okay.
[01:06:10.980 --> 01:06:12.980]  And they get a hypothetical number.
[01:06:12.980 --> 01:06:14.980]  Let's say they get $1,000.
[01:06:14.980 --> 01:06:17.980]  Okay.
[01:06:17.980 --> 01:06:19.980]  Mike, they're going to send me the W-9.
[01:06:19.980 --> 01:06:23.980]  And they won't come into the agreement unless I accept the W-9 and all that.
[01:06:23.980 --> 01:06:27.980]  I says, well, you can always tell them, you know, we can go to trial.
[01:06:27.980 --> 01:06:28.980]  Mike, I don't want to go there.
[01:06:28.980 --> 01:06:32.980]  I says, well, then you've got to decide for yourself what's best for you.
[01:06:32.980 --> 01:06:33.980]  Okay.
[01:06:33.980 --> 01:06:34.980]  Mike, take me to trial.
[01:06:34.980 --> 01:06:40.980]  So, you know, I mean, you've got to, you know, most people would fight it like you're saying here.
[01:06:40.980 --> 01:06:44.980]  And then some people, all right, just take the W-9, get the darn thing over with.
[01:06:44.980 --> 01:06:46.980]  I want this over and done with.
[01:06:46.980 --> 01:06:48.980]  And I understand that attitude.
[01:06:48.980 --> 01:06:53.980]  Now, Mike, if, okay, when you're saying that during the course of these negotiations,
[01:06:53.980 --> 01:06:58.980]  if the debt collector or the bank is wanting you to sign a W-9, let me just get this straight.
[01:06:58.980 --> 01:07:02.980]  This is for the purpose so that they can send you a 1099
[01:07:02.980 --> 01:07:09.980]  so that all the debt that is being removed, they want to hold you responsible for that as income
[01:07:09.980 --> 01:07:11.980]  and then you'd have to pay income taxes on it.
[01:07:11.980 --> 01:07:12.980]  Is that correct?
[01:07:12.980 --> 01:07:13.980]  No.
[01:07:13.980 --> 01:07:15.980]  The monies they're giving you to go away.
[01:07:15.980 --> 01:07:16.980]  Oh, okay.
[01:07:16.980 --> 01:07:19.980]  The settlement that they're giving you to go away, but not the debt.
[01:07:19.980 --> 01:07:20.980]  No.
[01:07:20.980 --> 01:07:21.980]  That's their problem.
[01:07:21.980 --> 01:07:22.980]  Okay.
[01:07:22.980 --> 01:07:25.980]  Well, the original, because this was the other issue I was going to bring up.
[01:07:25.980 --> 01:07:30.980]  The original creditor already wrote it off anyway, so technically there is no debt.
[01:07:30.980 --> 01:07:34.980]  And as a matter of fact, they never sell the debt anyway.
[01:07:34.980 --> 01:07:38.980]  What they sell is the information related to the debt, your Social Security number,
[01:07:38.980 --> 01:07:40.980]  your address, your phone number, all these things.
[01:07:40.980 --> 01:07:46.980]  And so the whole third-party debt collector industry is a fraud on its face.
[01:07:46.980 --> 01:07:54.980]  It's just extortion is what it is and blackmail because you don't really owe these debt collectors anything.
[01:07:54.980 --> 01:07:56.980]  There is no debt anymore.
[01:07:56.980 --> 01:08:01.980]  Well, you know, the number that I'm pretty confident of is 2 to 3 cents on a dollar
[01:08:01.980 --> 01:08:04.980]  is what they pay for these alleged debts.
[01:08:04.980 --> 01:08:10.980]  So if you have a $10,000 credit card, they might have bought it for 200 bucks, maybe less.
[01:08:10.980 --> 01:08:18.980]  They get boxed together just like the mortgage notes get boxed and they're sold as a $100,000 lot
[01:08:18.980 --> 01:08:20.980]  or a $500,000 lot.
[01:08:20.980 --> 01:08:23.980]  The debt collector comes in and buys it for whatever number,
[01:08:23.980 --> 01:08:26.980]  and it's generally 2 or 3% on the dollar.
[01:08:26.980 --> 01:08:28.980]  And God only knows what they paid.
[01:08:28.980 --> 01:08:30.980]  They might have paid 20 bucks for the thing.
[01:08:30.980 --> 01:08:31.980]  Who knows?
[01:08:31.980 --> 01:08:32.980]  Okay.
[01:08:32.980 --> 01:08:34.980]  But you're absolutely correct.
[01:08:34.980 --> 01:08:36.980]  That's the way they operate.
[01:08:36.980 --> 01:08:43.980]  But really unless the creditor sold the debt while it was still a debt,
[01:08:43.980 --> 01:08:46.980]  then they're really not selling the debt.
[01:08:46.980 --> 01:08:53.980]  I mean, if they charge the debt off on their capital gains tax, then there is no more debt to sell.
[01:08:53.980 --> 01:08:54.980]  It's been written off.
[01:08:54.980 --> 01:08:59.980]  So what they're really just selling is information related to the previous debt
[01:08:59.980 --> 01:09:05.980]  in which case these debt collectors have no legal cause to try to collect on them anyway.
[01:09:05.980 --> 01:09:07.980]  That's right.
[01:09:07.980 --> 01:09:12.980]  There's more than just that way they collect on the debt, too, because they get insurance also.
[01:09:12.980 --> 01:09:18.980]  And then they also get paid from some of the third-party debt collectors 2 or 3 cents on the debt, too.
[01:09:18.980 --> 01:09:23.980]  So they're making money three ways the Sunday, and it's all illegal.
[01:09:23.980 --> 01:09:24.980]  Exactly.
[01:09:24.980 --> 01:09:25.980]  You're absolutely right.
[01:09:25.980 --> 01:09:27.980]  Some of these loans are insured.
[01:09:27.980 --> 01:09:29.980]  You don't have to believe this, ladies and gentlemen.
[01:09:29.980 --> 01:09:33.980]  But I think it became very obvious when we bailed out AIG.
[01:09:33.980 --> 01:09:40.980]  AIG, when we bailed them out all over the news, they were insurer of mortgages.
[01:09:40.980 --> 01:09:43.980]  And they had all these bad mortgages that failed.
[01:09:43.980 --> 01:09:45.980]  And they knew they were going to fail.
[01:09:45.980 --> 01:09:52.980]  They bet on that, knowing that they were risking mortgages and that if they failed,
[01:09:52.980 --> 01:09:55.980]  AIG would have to come in and pay them off.
[01:09:55.980 --> 01:09:57.980]  And then what did we do?
[01:09:57.980 --> 01:09:58.980]  Okay.
[01:09:58.980 --> 01:10:02.980]  Did we bail them out?
[01:10:02.980 --> 01:10:03.980]  It's not a lie.
[01:10:03.980 --> 01:10:04.980]  It's the truth.
[01:10:04.980 --> 01:10:07.980]  Well, the name of the game is bailout.
[01:10:07.980 --> 01:10:11.980]  And that is the title of one of the chapters in G. Edward Griffin's book,
[01:10:11.980 --> 01:10:16.980]  The Creature from Jekyll Island, where he explains from a historical perspective
[01:10:16.980 --> 01:10:20.980]  the history of the Federal Reserve and how the system really works.
[01:10:20.980 --> 01:10:24.980]  And this has been the setup from the beginning.
[01:10:24.980 --> 01:10:26.980]  The name of the game is bailout.
[01:10:26.980 --> 01:10:30.980]  It's happened over and over again since 1913.
[01:10:30.980 --> 01:10:37.980]  This is how they rob people of their property and their money is through the bailout.
[01:10:37.980 --> 01:10:40.980]  Well, for instance, like the servicer on my home,
[01:10:40.980 --> 01:10:43.980]  I never borrowed any money from my servicer, one of the big banks.
[01:10:43.980 --> 01:10:48.980]  And this is the second mortgage they've taken for me that they're the servicer on.
[01:10:48.980 --> 01:10:50.980]  And I never borrowed a dime from them.
[01:10:50.980 --> 01:10:52.980]  But if I don't make my payments and they foreclose,
[01:10:52.980 --> 01:10:55.980]  they get my house and they didn't loan me a darn thing.
[01:10:55.980 --> 01:10:56.980]  Exactly.
[01:10:56.980 --> 01:10:58.980]  And we're going to talk about that a little bit later in the show.
[01:10:58.980 --> 01:11:02.980]  We've got Diane on the line as well who's going to be making some comments in a moment.
[01:11:02.980 --> 01:11:05.980]  So, Mark, would you recommend this course to people?
[01:11:05.980 --> 01:11:08.980]  It sounds like you had good results.
[01:11:08.980 --> 01:11:09.980]  Well, absolutely.
[01:11:09.980 --> 01:11:13.980]  And not only that, Mike helps you along the way.
[01:11:13.980 --> 01:11:15.980]  If you have any questions, you just give him a call.
[01:11:15.980 --> 01:11:17.980]  And that's really the important part.
[01:11:17.980 --> 01:11:22.980]  So you should never fear having to go to trial because he's already got the paperwork
[01:11:22.980 --> 01:11:27.980]  you probably need to get admissions and all that sort of thing.
[01:11:27.980 --> 01:11:29.980]  Fantastic.
[01:11:29.980 --> 01:11:30.980]  Yeah.
[01:11:30.980 --> 01:11:34.980]  And, you know, so I can clear that up because I don't want any misunderstanding.
[01:11:34.980 --> 01:11:40.980]  My courses, and we'll expand on that a little bit, how you get from A to Z,
[01:11:40.980 --> 01:11:43.980]  we'll get you up into federal court filing the complaint.
[01:11:43.980 --> 01:11:44.980]  It's got everything in there.
[01:11:44.980 --> 01:11:46.980]  It's got the forms, right, Mark?
[01:11:46.980 --> 01:11:48.980]  The forms are in there.
[01:11:48.980 --> 01:11:49.980]  The civil cover sheet is in there.
[01:11:49.980 --> 01:11:51.980]  The summonses are in there.
[01:11:51.980 --> 01:11:53.980]  Are they not all in that course, Mark?
[01:11:53.980 --> 01:11:55.980]  Yeah, they're all there.
[01:11:55.980 --> 01:11:57.980]  Okay?
[01:11:57.980 --> 01:12:01.980]  And if you can read it in plain English, there's not a lot of legalese in it.
[01:12:01.980 --> 01:12:04.980]  Okay?
[01:12:04.980 --> 01:12:07.980]  Everything is there to get you into federal court and what you need to do.
[01:12:07.980 --> 01:12:12.980]  However, at the very end, I tell you, and my e-mail addresses are in there
[01:12:12.980 --> 01:12:13.980]  and everything.
[01:12:13.980 --> 01:12:14.980]  There's two of them.
[01:12:14.980 --> 01:12:16.980]  You can contact me at either one.
[01:12:16.980 --> 01:12:19.980]  And, you know, you send me e-mails.
[01:12:19.980 --> 01:12:21.980]  You know, we need to talk.
[01:12:21.980 --> 01:12:24.980]  We'll set up a conversation and whatever.
[01:12:24.980 --> 01:12:27.980]  But I tell people at that point, once you get in that federal court,
[01:12:27.980 --> 01:12:32.980]  because you see a lot of times they will settle with you before you even have
[01:12:32.980 --> 01:12:34.980]  to get them to respond to the complaint.
[01:12:34.980 --> 01:12:37.980]  They've got 21 days to respond to the complaint.
[01:12:37.980 --> 01:12:40.980]  They may be on the phone with you to settle because they just don't want to
[01:12:40.980 --> 01:12:41.980]  go there.
[01:12:41.980 --> 01:12:45.980]  But if this thing moves in and goes to 26F and you've never been in the
[01:12:45.980 --> 01:12:50.980]  discovery process or in federal court, all this stuff, you're not going to
[01:12:50.980 --> 01:12:51.980]  know what to do.
[01:12:51.980 --> 01:12:56.980]  And that's where I tell people you need to bring me on on a consulting basis,
[01:12:56.980 --> 01:12:57.980]  a very reasonable fee.
[01:12:57.980 --> 01:13:01.980]  I give people a lot more on an hourly rate than any lawyer will.
[01:13:01.980 --> 01:13:02.980]  Okay?
[01:13:02.980 --> 01:13:05.980]  I don't have a stopwatch over here watching my time.
[01:13:05.980 --> 01:13:06.980]  Okay?
[01:13:06.980 --> 01:13:09.980]  But the point is, here's the killer.
[01:13:09.980 --> 01:13:14.980]  Once you learn how to do this one time and you've got everything you need to
[01:13:14.980 --> 01:13:18.980]  know, including the interrogatories, the production of documents,
[01:13:18.980 --> 01:13:24.980]  the questions you ask at a deposition, once you have that, nobody can take
[01:13:24.980 --> 01:13:26.980]  that away from you.
[01:13:26.980 --> 01:13:29.980]  So if you've got to go through this a second time, you're going to pretty much
[01:13:29.980 --> 01:13:30.980]  know what to do.
[01:13:30.980 --> 01:13:35.980]  Yeah, you may call me if you get a simple question or something like that.
[01:13:35.980 --> 01:13:38.980]  But I just fall out of the picture, essentially.
[01:13:38.980 --> 01:13:41.980]  You might get a tough situation where you might have to bring me in.
[01:13:41.980 --> 01:13:43.980]  But you do this once or twice.
[01:13:43.980 --> 01:13:46.980]  It's the same thing in every case.
[01:13:46.980 --> 01:13:51.980]  Nothing changes except the names of the dependents, the amount of violations
[01:13:51.980 --> 01:13:53.980]  involved, et cetera, et cetera.
[01:13:53.980 --> 01:13:54.980]  Okay?
[01:13:54.980 --> 01:13:56.980]  It's the same thing every time.
[01:13:56.980 --> 01:13:59.980]  And I'm a firm believer in practice makes perfect.
[01:13:59.980 --> 01:14:02.980]  It's the same thing every time.
[01:14:02.980 --> 01:14:05.980]  It's that simple.
[01:14:05.980 --> 01:14:07.980]  I had a question for you, Mike.
[01:14:07.980 --> 01:14:08.980]  Yeah.
[01:14:08.980 --> 01:14:18.980]  I sent a letter of investigation out to a creditor, an original creditor,
[01:14:18.980 --> 01:14:23.980]  say six months ago, and they chose to break the law.
[01:14:23.980 --> 01:14:29.980]  They only disputed it in one of the major credit reporting agencies.
[01:14:29.980 --> 01:14:32.980]  So I've stacked up about $12,000 in violations.
[01:14:32.980 --> 01:14:34.980]  And it's my truck.
[01:14:34.980 --> 01:14:36.980]  And I had a couple questions.
[01:14:36.980 --> 01:14:45.980]  I wondered, when you go into litigation, are all payments stopped?
[01:14:45.980 --> 01:14:47.980]  You know, that is a good question.
[01:14:47.980 --> 01:14:50.980]  And I'm going to answer it this way.
[01:14:50.980 --> 01:14:52.980]  No, nothing stops.
[01:14:52.980 --> 01:14:53.980]  Okay?
[01:14:53.980 --> 01:14:56.980]  If you're in a situation where you're supposed to be making payments,
[01:14:56.980 --> 01:14:59.980]  they'll keep racking that up on your credit report.
[01:14:59.980 --> 01:15:04.980]  But if their lawyer is smart, he goes back to them and says, wait,
[01:15:04.980 --> 01:15:08.980]  don't keep aggravating this guy any more than he already is.
[01:15:08.980 --> 01:15:10.980]  Okay?
[01:15:10.980 --> 01:15:14.980]  So there's a good chance that that could kind of cease at that point,
[01:15:14.980 --> 01:15:17.980]  especially when the lawyer comes to you and they want to start negotiating,
[01:15:17.980 --> 01:15:21.980]  you know, like this lady that called me today,
[01:15:21.980 --> 01:15:27.980]  they haven't even done a Rule 16 in front of the judge yet where they've had a
[01:15:27.980 --> 01:15:31.980]  conference, and they're contacting her to, they want to talk to her,
[01:15:31.980 --> 01:15:33.980]  see if they can settle this thing.
[01:15:33.980 --> 01:15:36.980]  First thing you say to them, hey, first thing you've got to do is tell the
[01:15:36.980 --> 01:15:40.980]  client to stop just chasing me, to stop demanding payments.
[01:15:40.980 --> 01:15:42.980]  Then we'll talk.
[01:15:42.980 --> 01:15:47.980]  See, you're in the position to do that now.
[01:15:47.980 --> 01:15:49.980]  So that's one of the things you bring to the table.
[01:15:49.980 --> 01:15:53.980]  I mean, if they're walking you and, you know, and so on and so forth,
[01:15:53.980 --> 01:15:56.980]  it's a pretty interesting situation.
[01:15:56.980 --> 01:16:01.980]  And I, you know, I know this one guy that I work with,
[01:16:01.980 --> 01:16:03.980]  and I really don't work with him, but I know him.
[01:16:03.980 --> 01:16:06.980]  He's a member of this group that I belong to,
[01:16:06.980 --> 01:16:10.980]  and I've had a few of my people who've been working with me go through him
[01:16:10.980 --> 01:16:13.980]  that actually gets the lien holder removed from your title,
[01:16:13.980 --> 01:16:17.980]  and it's an administrative process.
[01:16:17.980 --> 01:16:18.980]  Right, right.
[01:16:18.980 --> 01:16:19.980]  Yeah.
[01:16:19.980 --> 01:16:21.980]  I notice you put a denial on all your complaints.
[01:16:21.980 --> 01:16:24.980]  Is that a necessary part of your process every time?
[01:16:24.980 --> 01:16:25.980]  No, it is not.
[01:16:25.980 --> 01:16:26.980]  No, no.
[01:16:26.980 --> 01:16:27.980]  No, it is not.
[01:16:27.980 --> 01:16:32.980]  You don't even have to bring that up, okay?
[01:16:32.980 --> 01:16:34.980]  You know, we've modified the complaints quite a bit.
[01:16:34.980 --> 01:16:37.980]  Some of mine have been in there to even perfect them more,
[01:16:37.980 --> 01:16:41.980]  and we don't even get in there to deny that it's our account.
[01:16:41.980 --> 01:16:42.980]  You have a proof.
[01:16:42.980 --> 01:16:43.980]  It's not necessary.
[01:16:43.980 --> 01:16:46.980]  It's what they're supposed to do.
[01:16:46.980 --> 01:16:47.980]  Okay, listen, we've got to go to break.
[01:16:47.980 --> 01:16:50.980]  Any more questions, Mark?
[01:16:50.980 --> 01:16:51.980]  No, thanks a lot.
[01:16:51.980 --> 01:16:52.980]  Okay, thanks, Mark.
[01:16:52.980 --> 01:16:54.980]  All right, man, so I'll see you later.
[01:16:54.980 --> 01:16:55.980]  Okay, when we get back on the other side,
[01:16:55.980 --> 01:17:01.980]  we're going to get into the nuts and bolts.
[01:17:01.980 --> 01:17:05.980]  Capital Coin and Bullion is your local source for rare coins,
[01:17:05.980 --> 01:17:09.980]  precious metals, and coin supplies in the Austin metro area.
[01:17:09.980 --> 01:17:11.980]  We also ship worldwide.
[01:17:11.980 --> 01:17:14.980]  We are a family-owned and operated business that offers competitive prices
[01:17:14.980 --> 01:17:16.980]  on your coin and metals purchases.
[01:17:16.980 --> 01:17:21.980]  We buy, sell, trade, and consign rare coins, gold and silver coin collections,
[01:17:21.980 --> 01:17:23.980]  precious metals, and scrap gold.
[01:17:23.980 --> 01:17:27.980]  We will purchase and sell gold and jewelry items as well.
[01:17:27.980 --> 01:17:29.980]  We offer daily specials on coins and bullions.
[01:17:29.980 --> 01:17:33.980]  We're located at 5448 Burnett Road, Suite 3,
[01:17:33.980 --> 01:17:39.980]  and we're open Monday through Friday, 10 a.m. to 6 p.m., Saturdays, 10 a.m. to 5 p.m.
[01:17:39.980 --> 01:17:42.980]  You are welcome to stop in our shop during regular business hours
[01:17:42.980 --> 01:17:48.980]  or call 512-646-6440 with any questions.
[01:17:48.980 --> 01:17:53.980]  As for Chad and Say You Heard About Us on Rule of Law Radio or 90.1 FM,
[01:17:53.980 --> 01:18:00.980]  that's Capital Coin and Bullion, 512-646-6440.
[01:18:00.980 --> 01:18:21.980]  I'm Chad and Say You Heard About Us on Rule of Law Radio or 90.1 FM,
[01:18:21.980 --> 01:18:49.980]  and we're open Monday through Friday, 10 a.m. to 6 p.m. to 5 p.m. to 6 p.m. to 5 p.m.
[01:18:49.980 --> 01:18:52.980]  Folks, we're back. This is the Rule of Law.
[01:18:52.980 --> 01:18:54.980]  We're with our special guest, Mike Maris.
[01:18:54.980 --> 01:18:56.980]  Okay, we see a couple callers on the board.
[01:18:56.980 --> 01:18:58.980]  Callers, just sit tight.
[01:18:58.980 --> 01:19:01.980]  We are going to get into some nuts and bolts here.
[01:19:01.980 --> 01:19:05.980]  Okay, so, Mike, there's three entities involved here.
[01:19:05.980 --> 01:19:08.980]  You've got your debt collector, you've got the original creditor,
[01:19:08.980 --> 01:19:11.980]  and then there's the credit reporting bureaus.
[01:19:11.980 --> 01:19:14.980]  Basically, your course is a three-part course.
[01:19:14.980 --> 01:19:16.980]  The first step is dealing with the debt collectors,
[01:19:16.980 --> 01:19:19.980]  and then part two is how to deal with the creditors,
[01:19:19.980 --> 01:19:23.980]  and then part three, how to deal with the credit reporting bureaus
[01:19:23.980 --> 01:19:25.980]  or the credit reporting agencies.
[01:19:25.980 --> 01:19:30.980]  And so I just wanted you to just briefly walk through the strategy here
[01:19:30.980 --> 01:19:32.980]  so people will know what to expect.
[01:19:32.980 --> 01:19:35.980]  And, you know, you don't have to lay everything out from the course
[01:19:35.980 --> 01:19:37.980]  because we certainly want people to purchase the course.
[01:19:37.980 --> 01:19:39.980]  And, folks, please do get the course.
[01:19:39.980 --> 01:19:42.980]  It is dead-bang, 100%.
[01:19:42.980 --> 01:19:45.980]  You will be able to deal with these situations.
[01:19:45.980 --> 01:19:49.980]  And your purchase is support rule of law radio network.
[01:19:49.980 --> 01:19:54.980]  So, okay, you've got the Fair Debt Collections Practices Act,
[01:19:54.980 --> 01:19:56.980]  and then you've got the Fair Credit Reporting Act.
[01:19:56.980 --> 01:20:00.980]  So let's talk about how these two, how you use these two laws
[01:20:00.980 --> 01:20:03.980]  to deal with these three entities,
[01:20:03.980 --> 01:20:05.980]  and there's other laws that you use as well.
[01:20:05.980 --> 01:20:08.980]  So if you could just give us a basic overview.
[01:20:08.980 --> 01:20:12.980]  Well, it's really getting them set up
[01:20:12.980 --> 01:20:15.980]  and, you know, forcing them to do things under the law
[01:20:15.980 --> 01:20:18.980]  that they don't comply with and they don't do.
[01:20:18.980 --> 01:20:21.980]  And, for instance, a debt collector sends you a letter,
[01:20:21.980 --> 01:20:23.980]  and they'll start out sending you a letter,
[01:20:23.980 --> 01:20:29.980]  even a debt collection attorney will say,
[01:20:29.980 --> 01:20:33.980]  okay, you know, we're representing ABC Bank
[01:20:33.980 --> 01:20:36.980]  or we're representing ABC Debt Collector,
[01:20:36.980 --> 01:20:39.980]  or we are the debt collector.
[01:20:39.980 --> 01:20:42.980]  And in comes this letter and it says,
[01:20:42.980 --> 01:20:44.980]  you owe this money, you failed to pay,
[01:20:44.980 --> 01:20:46.980]  we're going to sue you if you don't pay it,
[01:20:46.980 --> 01:20:49.980]  call this office right away to make arrangements to pay this,
[01:20:49.980 --> 01:20:52.980]  or call this office within the next three days
[01:20:52.980 --> 01:20:56.980]  to make arrangements to pay this or make a settlement agreement.
[01:20:56.980 --> 01:20:58.980]  And then at the bottom it will say,
[01:20:58.980 --> 01:21:00.980]  somewhere's in there or maybe in the body of the letter,
[01:21:00.980 --> 01:21:02.980]  this is the debt collected debt,
[01:21:02.980 --> 01:21:05.980]  and any permission obtained will be used for that purpose.
[01:21:05.980 --> 01:21:08.980]  Well, if you go to the Debt Collection Practices Act
[01:21:08.980 --> 01:21:11.980]  and you read the law, you'll find that statement in the law.
[01:21:11.980 --> 01:21:14.980]  However, there's quite a long paragraph that goes with it,
[01:21:14.980 --> 01:21:19.980]  and it says things like, if you dispute this,
[01:21:19.980 --> 01:21:23.980]  you contact us within 30 days and we'll provide you with proof
[01:21:23.980 --> 01:21:29.980]  and so on and so forth, and it's all part of that,
[01:21:29.980 --> 01:21:32.980]  what we call the mini Miranda warning, okay?
[01:21:32.980 --> 01:21:34.980]  This is an attempt to collect the debt.
[01:21:34.980 --> 01:21:38.980]  Oh, by the way, you've got 30 days to question us and so on and so forth,
[01:21:38.980 --> 01:21:43.980]  and it talks about the least sophisticated consumer in there.
[01:21:43.980 --> 01:21:51.980]  Well, what people don't know is that when they make a statement like that,
[01:21:51.980 --> 01:21:53.980]  call this office right away,
[01:21:53.980 --> 01:21:58.980]  contact this office immediately to make arrangements to pay for this,
[01:21:58.980 --> 01:22:03.980]  they violate your civil rights by overshadowing the mini Miranda.
[01:22:03.980 --> 01:22:06.980]  Like when the cops arrest you, you have a right to remain silent.
[01:22:06.980 --> 01:22:08.980]  Any information will be used for that purpose.
[01:22:08.980 --> 01:22:11.980]  If they don't give you all that, you violated my civil rights.
[01:22:11.980 --> 01:22:16.980]  Well, when they say contact this office right away,
[01:22:16.980 --> 01:22:22.980]  they're violating your civil rights because they're overshadowing the law
[01:22:22.980 --> 01:22:24.980]  that says you have 30 days to dispute this.
[01:22:24.980 --> 01:22:27.980]  If I've got 30 days to dispute this thing,
[01:22:27.980 --> 01:22:29.980]  why do I have to contact you right away?
[01:22:29.980 --> 01:22:33.980]  But it falls back to the least sophisticated consumer.
[01:22:33.980 --> 01:22:36.980]  Most people see that and say, oh, I've got to call these guys right away.
[01:22:36.980 --> 01:22:37.980]  No, you don't.
[01:22:37.980 --> 01:22:38.980]  You've got 30 days.
[01:22:38.980 --> 01:22:40.980]  You also have a right to ask them to prove what they're asking you for.
[01:22:40.980 --> 01:22:45.980]  So is that a cause of action in the lawsuit, the overshadowing?
[01:22:45.980 --> 01:22:49.980]  Absolutely, overshadowing, absolutely, and here's the best part.
[01:22:49.980 --> 01:22:55.980]  And I believe it was up there in the state where Mark just called from,
[01:22:55.980 --> 01:22:56.980]  from Wisconsin.
[01:22:56.980 --> 01:23:01.980]  In fact, I know it is, the Tech Wiki case, federal case law,
[01:23:01.980 --> 01:23:03.980]  took them in several years ago.
[01:23:03.980 --> 01:23:08.980]  I'm going to say it was around 2000, 2001 time frame and around there.
[01:23:08.980 --> 01:23:10.980]  And the federal court says, no, you can't do that.
[01:23:10.980 --> 01:23:12.980]  You overshadowed the consumer's rights.
[01:23:12.980 --> 01:23:15.980]  This is the court saying, oh, rights again?
[01:23:15.980 --> 01:23:16.980]  We have rights.
[01:23:16.980 --> 01:23:18.980]  Oh, my God, really?
[01:23:18.980 --> 01:23:25.980]  And the court concurred with that and found that they overshadowed this woman's
[01:23:25.980 --> 01:23:28.980]  rights and subsequently, you know what happened.
[01:23:28.980 --> 01:23:29.980]  Okay?
[01:23:29.980 --> 01:23:31.980]  So there's case law in this stuff.
[01:23:31.980 --> 01:23:33.980]  So that's one way.
[01:23:33.980 --> 01:23:36.980]  Another way is you have to understand the law.
[01:23:36.980 --> 01:23:37.980]  Okay?
[01:23:37.980 --> 01:23:38.980]  They sent you that letter.
[01:23:38.980 --> 01:23:41.980]  I have beautiful letters in here by people who have sent them to me.
[01:23:41.980 --> 01:23:45.980]  I bet people just sent these letters out for my course.
[01:23:45.980 --> 01:23:49.980]  The validation letter, which is just a very simple dumb one-page letter.
[01:23:49.980 --> 01:23:52.980]  See, I get people who think they're lawyers.
[01:23:52.980 --> 01:23:53.980]  Okay?
[01:23:53.980 --> 01:23:57.980]  And they know about Admiralty Law, UCC Law.
[01:23:57.980 --> 01:24:02.980]  They start quoting all this and they send a 10-page dispute, all this kind of
[01:24:02.980 --> 01:24:03.980]  good stuff.
[01:24:03.980 --> 01:24:05.980]  Why do you do those things?
[01:24:05.980 --> 01:24:06.980]  It just blows my mind.
[01:24:06.980 --> 01:24:12.980]  Why do you want to admit to anything that they're accusing you of?
[01:24:12.980 --> 01:24:16.980]  People will go in there, I had this account number so-and-so and so-and-so and I
[01:24:16.980 --> 01:24:19.980]  couldn't pay because I lost my job.
[01:24:19.980 --> 01:24:20.980]  That's why I got it.
[01:24:20.980 --> 01:24:22.980]  Why would you tell them all that?
[01:24:22.980 --> 01:24:24.980]  First of all, they don't care.
[01:24:24.980 --> 01:24:28.980]  But when you come up with a number and an account number and all that, the first
[01:24:28.980 --> 01:24:33.980]  question that comes to my mind is if this is your account, you're asking me to
[01:24:33.980 --> 01:24:38.980]  prove it, how come you know this isn't your account and you're asking me to
[01:24:38.980 --> 01:24:39.980]  prove it?
[01:24:39.980 --> 01:24:43.980]  How come you know the account number?
[01:24:43.980 --> 01:24:46.980]  Why would you do a stupid thing like that?
[01:24:46.980 --> 01:24:49.980]  We have in this country a thing called due process.
[01:24:49.980 --> 01:24:52.980]  You accused me of something, you better be able to prove it.
[01:24:52.980 --> 01:24:54.980]  It's that simple.
[01:24:54.980 --> 01:24:57.980]  So you send a dumb validation letter.
[01:24:57.980 --> 01:25:01.980]  Now, the validation letters go to the debt collectors, correct?
[01:25:01.980 --> 01:25:04.980]  It goes to the debt collector or even the debt collector attorney who's trying
[01:25:04.980 --> 01:25:10.980]  to sue you in the local courts because all those guys are debt collectors.
[01:25:10.980 --> 01:25:17.980]  So you send that to them and there's a couple of things they can do.
[01:25:17.980 --> 01:25:21.980]  Number one, they don't have to answer you at all.
[01:25:21.980 --> 01:25:23.980]  One more time.
[01:25:23.980 --> 01:25:26.980]  Go read the law, it'll tell you this in the Debt Collection Practices Act.
[01:25:26.980 --> 01:25:29.980]  They do not have to answer you at all.
[01:25:29.980 --> 01:25:35.980]  However, if they don't answer you or provide proof that this alleged account,
[01:25:35.980 --> 01:25:38.980]  they must cease collection.
[01:25:38.980 --> 01:25:40.980]  The law is very clear.
[01:25:40.980 --> 01:25:42.980]  What it says, exact words.
[01:25:42.980 --> 01:25:44.980]  They don't prove to you you owe something.
[01:25:44.980 --> 01:25:46.980]  They must cease collection.
[01:25:46.980 --> 01:25:50.980]  Well, what if they don't?
[01:25:50.980 --> 01:25:52.980]  Violation.
[01:25:52.980 --> 01:25:54.980]  Debt Collection Practices Act right there.
[01:25:54.980 --> 01:25:56.980]  Okay?
[01:25:56.980 --> 01:25:59.980]  So there's one of the laws you rack up on.
[01:25:59.980 --> 01:26:04.980]  And so if they keep trying to collect, okay, so in the validation letter,
[01:26:04.980 --> 01:26:09.980]  you are telling, you're also telling them that they may only contact you by
[01:26:09.980 --> 01:26:11.980]  U.S. mail, no more phone calls.
[01:26:11.980 --> 01:26:12.980]  That's right.
[01:26:12.980 --> 01:26:19.980]  And so if they keep calling, then that's a $1,000 violation every time they
[01:26:19.980 --> 01:26:23.980]  call, and you were telling me something else according to the TCPA,
[01:26:23.980 --> 01:26:26.980]  some telephone act.
[01:26:26.980 --> 01:26:28.980]  Is that the Telephone Collections Practices Act?
[01:26:28.980 --> 01:26:29.980]  Is that what that means?
[01:26:29.980 --> 01:26:34.980]  Telephonic, the Telephonic Consumer Protections Act.
[01:26:34.980 --> 01:26:39.980]  Okay, the Telephonic Consumer Practices Act,
[01:26:39.980 --> 01:26:43.980]  if they use up minutes on your cell phone, and like,
[01:26:43.980 --> 01:26:47.980]  if you have an unlimited minutes plan, then you don't get to use this.
[01:26:47.980 --> 01:26:51.980]  But say if you have a fixed specific amount of minutes,
[01:26:51.980 --> 01:26:55.980]  and you answer the phone, and it deducts minutes from your plan,
[01:26:55.980 --> 01:26:58.980]  then you get to sue under that as well.
[01:26:58.980 --> 01:27:02.980]  And what's the violation code, the scheme on that?
[01:27:02.980 --> 01:27:03.980]  How much do you get to pay for that?
[01:27:03.980 --> 01:27:06.980]  Well, it's pretty neat.
[01:27:06.980 --> 01:27:10.980]  What I'm doing now is we're starting to incorporate this into the fair credit
[01:27:10.980 --> 01:27:12.980]  debt collection complaints as well.
[01:27:12.980 --> 01:27:21.980]  This is a federal law, and it's a $1,500 up to, between $500 and $1,500 penalty.
[01:27:21.980 --> 01:27:23.980]  There's no adjudication needed.
[01:27:23.980 --> 01:27:25.980]  All you've got to be able to do is prove they called you,
[01:27:25.980 --> 01:27:29.980]  and normally people can produce statements from their cell phone company that
[01:27:29.980 --> 01:27:32.980]  says, yeah, here's the number that called me, here's the date, here's the time,
[01:27:32.980 --> 01:27:35.980]  and they use these amount of minutes.
[01:27:35.980 --> 01:27:36.980]  Black and white.
[01:27:36.980 --> 01:27:39.980]  Black and white is pretty powerful in courts, okay?
[01:27:39.980 --> 01:27:41.980]  You could show a court something in black and white,
[01:27:41.980 --> 01:27:44.980]  they're going to concur that it's probably pretty correct, okay?
[01:27:44.980 --> 01:27:47.980]  So the point is every time they do that,
[01:27:47.980 --> 01:27:53.980]  it could be a $1,500 penalty times every call they call you on,
[01:27:53.980 --> 01:27:54.980]  or every time they call you.
[01:27:54.980 --> 01:27:57.980]  If you've already told them to not call you anymore.
[01:27:57.980 --> 01:27:58.980]  No.
[01:27:58.980 --> 01:27:59.980]  It doesn't make any difference.
[01:27:59.980 --> 01:28:00.980]  Oh.
[01:28:00.980 --> 01:28:03.980]  You could do that to anybody.
[01:28:03.980 --> 01:28:07.980]  If you have these marketing calls coming in,
[01:28:07.980 --> 01:28:09.980]  you can go after the marketing company.
[01:28:09.980 --> 01:28:12.980]  It just doesn't have to be a debt collector or creditor.
[01:28:12.980 --> 01:28:13.980]  It could be anybody.
[01:28:13.980 --> 01:28:19.980]  If I called you all the time, okay, you could come after me.
[01:28:19.980 --> 01:28:20.980]  But here's my argument.
[01:28:20.980 --> 01:28:22.980]  They'll say, well, it's got to be prerecorded,
[01:28:22.980 --> 01:28:25.980]  or it's got to be an autodialer, that kind of stuff.
[01:28:25.980 --> 01:28:27.980]  Okay.
[01:28:27.980 --> 01:28:28.980]  I got the information here.
[01:28:28.980 --> 01:28:33.980]  You cost me minutes even with your autodialer.
[01:28:33.980 --> 01:28:34.980]  Put it in the complaint.
[01:28:34.980 --> 01:28:37.980]  Let's let the judge and jury decide, okay?
[01:28:37.980 --> 01:28:41.980]  My answer.
[01:28:41.980 --> 01:28:42.980]  Okay.
[01:28:42.980 --> 01:28:43.980]  It's a penalty.
[01:28:43.980 --> 01:28:44.980]  Penalty.
[01:28:44.980 --> 01:28:45.980]  That's awesome.
[01:28:45.980 --> 01:28:48.980]  And I believe what you were telling me before
[01:28:48.980 --> 01:28:51.980]  with the Fair Debt Collections Practices Act,
[01:28:51.980 --> 01:28:56.980]  it's a $1,000 fine for every time they do it.
[01:28:56.980 --> 01:29:00.980]  However, you can only sue them at maximum for $1,000.
[01:29:00.980 --> 01:29:01.980]  Yes.
[01:29:01.980 --> 01:29:07.980]  The Debt Collection Practices Act law is $1,000 per case,
[01:29:07.980 --> 01:29:09.980]  which is why we need to get the law changed.
[01:29:09.980 --> 01:29:12.980]  We need to be able to get that up to about $100,000,
[01:29:12.980 --> 01:29:15.980]  and you'll see more of these debt collectors going out of business.
[01:29:15.980 --> 01:29:19.980]  However, with the Fair Credit Reporting Act, there's no limit.
[01:29:19.980 --> 01:29:20.980]  There is no limit.
[01:29:20.980 --> 01:29:23.980]  It's per violation in fair credit reporting.
[01:29:23.980 --> 01:29:26.980]  But here's the thing.
[01:29:26.980 --> 01:29:29.980]  I've been up against the lawyers, and they say to me,
[01:29:29.980 --> 01:29:32.980]  you know, you've got us in here for $8,000 worth of violation,
[01:29:32.980 --> 01:29:35.980]  so you know you can only get $1,000 per case.
[01:29:35.980 --> 01:29:38.980]  Ladies and gentlemen, you know my answer.
[01:29:38.980 --> 01:29:40.980]  Let's let the judge and jury decide, okay, pal?
[01:29:40.980 --> 01:29:42.980]  Let's go find out.
[01:29:42.980 --> 01:29:44.980]  Absolutely, and they're not going to want to find out.
[01:29:44.980 --> 01:29:45.980]  Okay, listen, we'll be right back.
[01:29:45.980 --> 01:29:46.980]  I've got some more questions.
[01:29:46.980 --> 01:29:50.980]  We want to continue on a little bit with the nuts and bolts,
[01:29:50.980 --> 01:29:53.980]  and then we'll go to Diane for her comments
[01:29:53.980 --> 01:29:56.980]  and start taking your calls later in the next segment.
[01:29:56.980 --> 01:30:00.980]  We'll be right back.
[01:30:00.980 --> 01:30:02.980]  Are you being harassed by debt collectors
[01:30:02.980 --> 01:30:05.980]  with phone calls, letters, or even lawsuits?
[01:30:05.980 --> 01:30:09.980]  Stop debt collectors now with the Michael Mears proven method.
[01:30:09.980 --> 01:30:12.980]  Michael Mears has won six cases in federal court against debt collectors,
[01:30:12.980 --> 01:30:14.980]  and now you can win too.
[01:30:14.980 --> 01:30:17.980]  You'll get step-by-step instructions in plain English
[01:30:17.980 --> 01:30:20.980]  on how to win in court using federal civil rights statutes,
[01:30:20.980 --> 01:30:24.980]  what to do when contacted by phone, mail, or court summons,
[01:30:24.980 --> 01:30:26.980]  how to answer letters and phone calls,
[01:30:26.980 --> 01:30:28.980]  how to get debt collectors out of your credit report,
[01:30:28.980 --> 01:30:33.980]  how to turn the financial tables on them and make them pay you to go away.
[01:30:33.980 --> 01:30:38.980]  The Michael Mears proven method is the solution for how to stop debt collectors.
[01:30:38.980 --> 01:30:40.980]  Personal consultation is available as well.
[01:30:40.980 --> 01:30:44.980]  For more information, please visit ruleoflawradio.com
[01:30:44.980 --> 01:30:46.980]  and click on the blue Michael Mears banner
[01:30:46.980 --> 01:30:49.980]  or email michaelmears at yahoo.com.
[01:30:49.980 --> 01:30:51.980]  That's ruleoflawradio.com
[01:30:51.980 --> 01:30:57.980]  or email m-i-c-h-a-e-l-m-i-r-r-a-s at yahoo.com
[01:30:57.980 --> 01:31:18.980]  to learn how to stop debt collectors now.
[01:31:18.980 --> 01:31:20.980]  Okay, we are back.
[01:31:20.980 --> 01:31:22.980]  We're talking with Mike about some nuts and bolts here
[01:31:22.980 --> 01:31:26.980]  regarding these civil rights laws, consumer protection laws,
[01:31:26.980 --> 01:31:31.980]  and for sure one thing that I think that folks need to understand here
[01:31:31.980 --> 01:31:34.980]  is that this technique has nothing to do with the debt.
[01:31:34.980 --> 01:31:36.980]  You're not fighting the debt.
[01:31:36.980 --> 01:31:40.980]  It has nothing to do with the debt or the validity of the debt whatsoever.
[01:31:40.980 --> 01:31:43.980]  It has everything to do with the fact that the debt collectors
[01:31:43.980 --> 01:31:46.980]  and the creditors are breaking certain laws,
[01:31:46.980 --> 01:31:51.980]  and you're suing them for their violations of the law,
[01:31:51.980 --> 01:31:55.980]  and the way you get the debt retired and your credit report cleared,
[01:31:55.980 --> 01:31:59.980]  that all comes as part of the settlement agreement, okay?
[01:31:59.980 --> 01:32:01.980]  So that's the way this particular method works.
[01:32:01.980 --> 01:32:05.980]  Now, I have a question concerning the phone calls.
[01:32:05.980 --> 01:32:07.980]  All right, let me give an example.
[01:32:07.980 --> 01:32:10.980]  Okay, I'm helping a friend deal with some of these issues,
[01:32:10.980 --> 01:32:16.980]  and in this particular situation, got this debt collector calling,
[01:32:16.980 --> 01:32:18.980]  sending letters.
[01:32:18.980 --> 01:32:22.980]  At the very first letter, my friend sent a validation letter.
[01:32:22.980 --> 01:32:29.980]  Well, unfortunately, the call ceased, okay,
[01:32:29.980 --> 01:32:32.980]  as per the instructions of the validation letter.
[01:32:32.980 --> 01:32:40.980]  However, the most unusual thing began to happen about a week after that.
[01:32:40.980 --> 01:32:49.980]  My friend started getting a lot of phone calls from another debt collector, okay,
[01:32:49.980 --> 01:32:53.980]  but we haven't been able to figure out who it is,
[01:32:53.980 --> 01:32:57.980]  and this other debt collector has not sent a letter yet,
[01:32:57.980 --> 01:33:01.980]  and we haven't actually been able to talk to any of these people yet
[01:33:01.980 --> 01:33:06.980]  from this second debt collector because what typically ends up happening,
[01:33:06.980 --> 01:33:09.980]  it's an automated calling system, all right?
[01:33:09.980 --> 01:33:14.980]  And so what will happen is my friend will answer the phone,
[01:33:14.980 --> 01:33:21.980]  and either there will be a hangup or sometimes it will come up with a message
[01:33:21.980 --> 01:33:24.980]  saying, hold, please, and then they put you on hold,
[01:33:24.980 --> 01:33:26.980]  and then there's like music, and you sit there and wait.
[01:33:26.980 --> 01:33:28.980]  You know what's going to happen.
[01:33:28.980 --> 01:33:32.980]  And then what ends up happening is then after about three or four minutes,
[01:33:32.980 --> 01:33:34.980]  a little message will come on and say,
[01:33:34.980 --> 01:33:38.980]  we're sorry, we cannot take your call right now, and then disconnect.
[01:33:38.980 --> 01:33:45.980]  Now my friend decided to call this number back to find out who it was, okay,
[01:33:45.980 --> 01:33:48.980]  but not offer them any information because I know in your course you say,
[01:33:48.980 --> 01:33:52.980]  don't return the phone calls from the debt collectors.
[01:33:52.980 --> 01:33:56.980]  You say answer the call, and then when they talk to you,
[01:33:56.980 --> 01:33:59.980]  you have a set of 18 questions that you ask them,
[01:33:59.980 --> 01:34:02.980]  and of course the final question, they'll end up hanging up on you
[01:34:02.980 --> 01:34:06.980]  because you asked the debt collector for their personal Social Security number.
[01:34:06.980 --> 01:34:11.980]  Okay, so at any rate, but you say don't call them back
[01:34:11.980 --> 01:34:15.980]  because you don't want to admit any, and you want to do anything to admit guilt.
[01:34:15.980 --> 01:34:19.980]  Well, my friend wanted to call this obvious debt collector back
[01:34:19.980 --> 01:34:22.980]  to just find out who they were.
[01:34:22.980 --> 01:34:28.980]  Well, it was confirmed that it is a debt collector, and then she just hung up on him.
[01:34:28.980 --> 01:34:30.980]  She just wanted to find out who it was because, you know,
[01:34:30.980 --> 01:34:32.980]  you said not to return the calls.
[01:34:32.980 --> 01:34:36.980]  Well, we've never gotten to the point or she's never gotten to the point
[01:34:36.980 --> 01:34:43.980]  where she's actually been able to field any calls from them calling her.
[01:34:43.980 --> 01:34:46.980]  She's never gotten to the point where they can actually talk to somebody
[01:34:46.980 --> 01:34:50.980]  to ask the 18 questions, but this has been going on for about a month now,
[01:34:50.980 --> 01:34:58.980]  and what we suspect is going on is that either this one debt collector
[01:34:58.980 --> 01:35:04.980]  at least the calls has either sold this to yet another debt collector
[01:35:04.980 --> 01:35:12.980]  who isn't sending a letter yet, or they've hired a subcontracting debt collector
[01:35:12.980 --> 01:35:18.980]  to make the phone calls in order to get around the fact that they had to stop,
[01:35:18.980 --> 01:35:21.980]  the first people had to stop because of the letter.
[01:35:21.980 --> 01:35:26.980]  So what I'd like to know is what is the next step here?
[01:35:26.980 --> 01:35:33.980]  How do we go after this other entity that we believe has either bought the debt again
[01:35:33.980 --> 01:35:35.980]  or is working for the first debt collector?
[01:35:35.980 --> 01:35:39.980]  How do we deal with that situation so we can put a stop to this?
[01:35:39.980 --> 01:35:43.980]  I would immediately, if I was in her shoes,
[01:35:43.980 --> 01:35:49.980]  I would immediately find out an address for them via reverse phone lookup,
[01:35:49.980 --> 01:35:54.980]  however you have to do it, and that's pretty easy to do on the Internet today,
[01:35:54.980 --> 01:35:59.980]  and find out who they are and get a validation letter off to that debt collector.
[01:35:59.980 --> 01:36:04.980]  Now with the validation letter, but you wouldn't be citing any account
[01:36:04.980 --> 01:36:09.980]  because in all honesty we have no idea what's going on here.
[01:36:09.980 --> 01:36:15.980]  Yeah, no, you never cite the account anyway,
[01:36:15.980 --> 01:36:19.980]  but if you can confirm that this is some type of debt collector,
[01:36:19.980 --> 01:36:22.980]  they are obligated under the law when you contact
[01:36:22.980 --> 01:36:26.980]  and they provide you with proof of this alleged account.
[01:36:26.980 --> 01:36:32.980]  And oh, by the way, don't call me, only contact me by U.S. mail is in there,
[01:36:32.980 --> 01:36:37.980]  so you hope they keep calling you after they get that limited cease and desist.
[01:36:37.980 --> 01:36:42.980]  So you can rack up more violations on it, but here's an issue right here.
[01:36:42.980 --> 01:36:47.980]  If that first debt collector has sold this to another debt collector,
[01:36:47.980 --> 01:36:50.980]  there's a little clause in that first letter that says
[01:36:50.980 --> 01:36:56.980]  I don't want to share this information with anybody, okay?
[01:36:56.980 --> 01:37:00.980]  Because if you do, you're in violation of the Debt Collection Practices Act,
[01:37:00.980 --> 01:37:02.980]  you're claiming I owed this debt,
[01:37:02.980 --> 01:37:07.980]  now you've sold it or given it to some other third party or fourth party,
[01:37:07.980 --> 01:37:11.980]  who gave you permission to share my information with that party?
[01:37:11.980 --> 01:37:16.980]  Uh-oh, uh-oh, so if you wanted to play devil's advocate,
[01:37:16.980 --> 01:37:21.980]  you have the first debt, the one that's calling you, and now the second one.
[01:37:21.980 --> 01:37:25.980]  So now you have two debt collectors, the first debt,
[01:37:25.980 --> 01:37:28.980]  the one that's calling you now becomes the defendant,
[01:37:28.980 --> 01:37:33.980]  the co-defendant being the very first debt collector that called you,
[01:37:33.980 --> 01:37:37.980]  and then the creditor as the third defendant in the case.
[01:37:37.980 --> 01:37:42.980]  Okay, so that leads to the next issue concerning when you see,
[01:37:42.980 --> 01:37:46.980]  the first thing people want to do is send this validation letter
[01:37:46.980 --> 01:37:50.980]  that people will receive as part of your course, and then...
[01:37:50.980 --> 01:37:52.980]  I can't stress how critical that is.
[01:37:52.980 --> 01:37:56.980]  Okay, so that's the key step to start the whole thing off,
[01:37:56.980 --> 01:38:02.980]  and then when you get the certified return receipt back from that validation letter,
[01:38:02.980 --> 01:38:08.980]  then you send a dispute letter to the original creditor, is that correct?
[01:38:08.980 --> 01:38:12.980]  Yeah, and you don't even have to wait when you're dealing with the,
[01:38:12.980 --> 01:38:15.980]  if you've got the debt collector, you can send that letter out immediately
[01:38:15.980 --> 01:38:19.980]  and then send a dispute letter to the creditor.
[01:38:19.980 --> 01:38:24.980]  And then there's something else that you send to the credit agencies also as well.
[01:38:24.980 --> 01:38:29.980]  Right, which is another dispute letter disputing the account in your credit report.
[01:38:29.980 --> 01:38:30.980]  Okay.
[01:38:30.980 --> 01:38:33.980]  Okay, but you wait until the creditor gets their first copy,
[01:38:33.980 --> 01:38:37.980]  because you see the law says, ladies and gentlemen, it's quite simple.
[01:38:37.980 --> 01:38:42.980]  When you dispute this stuff, they need to do an investigation.
[01:38:42.980 --> 01:38:46.980]  And of course, the big question is, what kind of investigation do they do?
[01:38:46.980 --> 01:38:50.980]  How well do they do it? How in-depth is it?
[01:38:50.980 --> 01:38:53.980]  And do they report to the credit bureaus, we're doing an investigation,
[01:38:53.980 --> 01:38:57.980]  we may have some issues, mark the account in dispute,
[01:38:57.980 --> 01:39:03.980]  and the law says that there actually has to be an issue at hand for them to mark it in dispute.
[01:39:03.980 --> 01:39:08.980]  Well, if they do an investigation, how will they know there's an issue
[01:39:08.980 --> 01:39:10.980]  until they do the investigation?
[01:39:10.980 --> 01:39:13.980]  So why wouldn't you just mark the account in dispute temporarily?
[01:39:13.980 --> 01:39:17.980]  Couldn't you remove that 30 days later after your investigation is done
[01:39:17.980 --> 01:39:21.980]  and say, oh, yeah, we're reporting it correctly?
[01:39:21.980 --> 01:39:27.980]  See, and to me, that's called reasonableness in the legal language term,
[01:39:27.980 --> 01:39:29.980]  a reasonableness.
[01:39:29.980 --> 01:39:32.980]  You went in front of a jury and you said, ladies and gentlemen,
[01:39:32.980 --> 01:39:36.980]  I disputed with them, they didn't mark the account in dispute.
[01:39:36.980 --> 01:39:40.980]  The other lawyer is going to go, so, well, that's because we were reporting it correctly.
[01:39:40.980 --> 01:39:41.980]  Oh, really? How do we know that?
[01:39:41.980 --> 01:39:44.980]  Well, we did an investigation. What is your investigation?
[01:39:44.980 --> 01:39:50.980]  How long does it take, and what do you investigate?
[01:39:50.980 --> 01:39:53.980]  First, they don't want to answer those questions.
[01:39:53.980 --> 01:39:58.980]  But the point is, why don't you just mark the account in dispute temporarily?
[01:39:58.980 --> 01:40:00.980]  I'm disputing this with you.
[01:40:00.980 --> 01:40:05.980]  Do your investigation and then remove the dispute from it.
[01:40:05.980 --> 01:40:06.980]  Why don't you do that?
[01:40:06.980 --> 01:40:10.980]  And I can tell you why they don't do it.
[01:40:10.980 --> 01:40:13.980]  Because every time they ask something special to the credit bureaus,
[01:40:13.980 --> 01:40:15.980]  they're going to charge them for it.
[01:40:15.980 --> 01:40:19.980]  So if they got 100,000 of these dispute letters a year
[01:40:19.980 --> 01:40:25.980]  and the credit bureau charged them $5 to mark the account in dispute,
[01:40:25.980 --> 01:40:32.980]  $5 times $100,000, $5 times $100,000.
[01:40:32.980 --> 01:40:33.980]  Why should we do that?
[01:40:33.980 --> 01:40:37.980]  How much could you sue us for for not following the law?
[01:40:37.980 --> 01:40:42.980]  And that's honestly why I believe they don't care about covering their butts in this stuff.
[01:40:42.980 --> 01:40:48.980]  Because it's easier to just violate, it's cheaper in the long run to just violate the law,
[01:40:48.980 --> 01:40:52.980]  and when some people catch them at it, then they just pay them off.
[01:40:52.980 --> 01:41:00.980]  Well, yeah, and the point is you've got some clerk sitting there who's got $6 an hour, $7, $8 an hour,
[01:41:00.980 --> 01:41:03.980]  who's instructed by them, just look at it on the computer screen,
[01:41:03.980 --> 01:41:06.980]  and if there's a balance due, that's what they owe.
[01:41:06.980 --> 01:41:07.980]  So we're reporting it directly.
[01:41:07.980 --> 01:41:09.980]  How do we know that?
[01:41:09.980 --> 01:41:17.980]  What kind of investigation have you done to show that there's been no tampering with the database system,
[01:41:17.980 --> 01:41:19.980]  that there aren't errors in there?
[01:41:19.980 --> 01:41:26.980]  And there was a case several years ago in Indiana, and I always bring it up, called Spears v. Brennan.
[01:41:26.980 --> 01:41:31.980]  It's a very good case that went to the appeals court of the state of Indiana,
[01:41:31.980 --> 01:41:37.980]  and they explained how an account should be verified.
[01:41:37.980 --> 01:41:43.980]  They also said that a contract is not proof of any account or monies owed,
[01:41:43.980 --> 01:41:48.980]  a statement is not proof of any monies or account owed, et cetera, et cetera.
[01:41:48.980 --> 01:41:51.980]  So what is it that it takes to prove an account?
[01:41:51.980 --> 01:42:00.980]  It's called, in the bookkeeping legalese, and they talk about it in this case, Spears v. Brennan,
[01:42:00.980 --> 01:42:06.980]  alleged accounting, it's called, alleged, okay?
[01:42:06.980 --> 01:42:11.980]  You show us from the first day that this alleged account was opened through today,
[01:42:11.980 --> 01:42:16.980]  where all the monies went, how they were charged, how they were credited, the interest applied,
[01:42:16.980 --> 01:42:21.980]  any late payments that were made, any interest from that, right up through today,
[01:42:21.980 --> 01:42:30.980]  and give us a full ledger accounting, because they could claim you owe $100,000.
[01:42:30.980 --> 01:42:34.980]  But it might be $98,000.
[01:42:34.980 --> 01:42:37.980]  But in their credit report, they're saying $100,000.
[01:42:37.980 --> 01:42:42.980]  So my first question is, are they reporting accurate information?
[01:42:42.980 --> 01:42:44.980]  And obviously they are not.
[01:42:44.980 --> 01:42:47.980]  Now, is this a federal case that you're citing here?
[01:42:47.980 --> 01:42:56.980]  This was a state case that was in Indiana under fair credit debt collection law,
[01:42:56.980 --> 01:43:03.980]  Spears v. Brennan, and the debt collector came after this guy and saying,
[01:43:03.980 --> 01:43:07.980]  you owe this money, and they're saying, that's not proof of anything.
[01:43:07.980 --> 01:43:08.980]  That's not enough.
[01:43:08.980 --> 01:43:12.980]  Just because you owe the money, and this person says so, you've got to be able to prove it.
[01:43:12.980 --> 01:43:13.980]  You've got to be able to show it.
[01:43:13.980 --> 01:43:20.980]  Now, Mike, you can import this state case into federal cases.
[01:43:20.980 --> 01:43:22.980]  Oh, I use it all the time as an example.
[01:43:22.980 --> 01:43:24.980]  Sure, sure.
[01:43:24.980 --> 01:43:26.980]  I always cite that case, because it's very well known.
[01:43:26.980 --> 01:43:33.980]  If you go Google it, Spears, S-P-E-A-R-S versus Brennan, E-R-E-N-N-A-N,
[01:43:33.980 --> 01:43:34.980]  it would have come right up.
[01:43:34.980 --> 01:43:37.980]  You can go read the case, about 20 pages long, but it's very informative.
[01:43:37.980 --> 01:43:38.980]  Okay, excellent.
[01:43:38.980 --> 01:43:40.980]  All right, when we get back on the other side,
[01:43:40.980 --> 01:43:43.980]  we're going to talk a little bit more about dealing with the creditors
[01:43:43.980 --> 01:43:46.980]  and what happens when they send you statements and stuff like that,
[01:43:46.980 --> 01:43:50.980]  and then we'll get comments from Diane during the next segment.
[01:43:50.980 --> 01:43:54.980]  This is the rule of law, Randy Kelton, Eddie Craig, Debra Stevens,
[01:43:54.980 --> 01:43:55.980]  our special guest, Mike Mears.
[01:43:55.980 --> 01:44:06.980]  We'll be right back.
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[01:45:09.980 --> 01:45:37.980]  Okay, we are back.
[01:45:37.980 --> 01:45:45.980]  Okay, Mike, so let's just walk through now a little bit about dealing with the creditors.
[01:45:45.980 --> 01:45:50.980]  Okay, so you send a dispute letter that's included in your course.
[01:45:50.980 --> 01:45:57.980]  You send this dispute letter to the original creditor right after you send the validation letter to the debt collector.
[01:45:57.980 --> 01:46:04.980]  Now, generally what happens is they'll want to send you statements.
[01:46:04.980 --> 01:46:08.980]  So then what happens at that point after they send you the statements?
[01:46:08.980 --> 01:46:10.980]  How do you proceed from there?
[01:46:10.980 --> 01:46:17.980]  Well, see, I know who I'm dealing with, so I become the proverbial SOB just like they are.
[01:46:17.980 --> 01:46:19.980]  Okay?
[01:46:19.980 --> 01:46:25.980]  So when they send something back and you'll even get letters that will come back and say,
[01:46:25.980 --> 01:46:34.980]  we need your Social Security number, we need the account number before we can do an investigation.
[01:46:34.980 --> 01:46:39.980]  And I look at a letter like that and I say, oh, really?
[01:46:39.980 --> 01:46:43.980]  You see, because here's my attitude.
[01:46:43.980 --> 01:46:52.980]  You go in in front of that jury and you stand up there and say, they violated, they didn't mark my account in this dispute.
[01:46:52.980 --> 01:46:56.980]  The opposing counsel gets up and says, well, wait a minute.
[01:46:56.980 --> 01:47:00.980]  We sent you a letter asking for your Social Security number and your account number.
[01:47:00.980 --> 01:47:01.980]  Uh-huh.
[01:47:01.980 --> 01:47:03.980]  Well, I never got that letter.
[01:47:03.980 --> 01:47:05.980]  Well, we put it in the mail.
[01:47:05.980 --> 01:47:06.980]  Really?
[01:47:06.980 --> 01:47:09.980]  Did you send that certified mail and I signed for it?
[01:47:09.980 --> 01:47:10.980]  No.
[01:47:10.980 --> 01:47:11.980]  Oh, I know.
[01:47:11.980 --> 01:47:12.980]  You sent it FedEx and I said, no.
[01:47:12.980 --> 01:47:13.980]  UPS?
[01:47:13.980 --> 01:47:14.980]  No.
[01:47:14.980 --> 01:47:19.980]  But we put it in the mail and our mail is, so let me get this straight, counselor.
[01:47:19.980 --> 01:47:21.980]  Mail doesn't get lost?
[01:47:21.980 --> 01:47:24.980]  Is that what you're trying to convince us of?
[01:47:24.980 --> 01:47:28.980]  See, because, ladies and gentlemen, you're going to have everything done by certified mail.
[01:47:28.980 --> 01:47:31.980]  You're going to be able to prove everything you say.
[01:47:31.980 --> 01:47:38.980]  And in a court of law, black and white proof is very difficult to not accept.
[01:47:38.980 --> 01:47:39.980]  Okay?
[01:47:39.980 --> 01:47:42.980]  Well, he's going to get up and say, oh, we didn't have your account number.
[01:47:42.980 --> 01:47:43.980]  We asked you for that.
[01:47:43.980 --> 01:47:44.980]  Really?
[01:47:44.980 --> 01:47:48.980]  Ladies and gentlemen of the jury.
[01:47:48.980 --> 01:47:57.980]  These guys are in my credit report and they don't know who I am.
[01:47:57.980 --> 01:48:00.980]  You think that's going to fly with the jury?
[01:48:00.980 --> 01:48:02.980]  When they get up and say, we asked for all this.
[01:48:02.980 --> 01:48:04.980]  You didn't provide us with all the information.
[01:48:04.980 --> 01:48:05.980]  Wait a minute.
[01:48:05.980 --> 01:48:07.980]  You're in my credit report and now you say you don't know who I am?
[01:48:07.980 --> 01:48:14.980]  Oh, so you are reporting erroneous information and accurate information in my credit report
[01:48:14.980 --> 01:48:18.980]  because you do not have the systems in place to prevent error.
[01:48:18.980 --> 01:48:20.980]  Uh-oh, another violation.
[01:48:20.980 --> 01:48:21.980]  The law is very clear.
[01:48:21.980 --> 01:48:28.980]  The law says they must have the systems in place to prevent error, period.
[01:48:28.980 --> 01:48:29.980]  Okay?
[01:48:29.980 --> 01:48:33.980]  So they want to go there and find that out.
[01:48:33.980 --> 01:48:37.980]  You know, sentence statements, again, isn't proof of anything.
[01:48:37.980 --> 01:48:41.980]  My attitude is you're accusing me of something.
[01:48:41.980 --> 01:48:43.980]  You say I owe money.
[01:48:43.980 --> 01:48:45.980]  You need to prove everything.
[01:48:45.980 --> 01:48:48.980]  And a statement isn't proof of anything.
[01:48:48.980 --> 01:48:51.980]  We know what it takes to provide proof of an account.
[01:48:51.980 --> 01:48:53.980]  Go look at Spears versus Brennan.
[01:48:53.980 --> 01:48:57.980]  Give me a ledger accounting from day one and then maybe I'll accept that those numbers are right.
[01:48:57.980 --> 01:49:03.980]  But until that happens and you can prove to me in this court that you've done that,
[01:49:03.980 --> 01:49:05.980]  you're BSing in my credit report.
[01:49:05.980 --> 01:49:09.980]  And, Mike, if they actually do come up with a ledger accounting,
[01:49:09.980 --> 01:49:16.980]  would that ledger accounting also, it seems like it would have to show the fact that it did get charged off
[01:49:16.980 --> 01:49:19.980]  and so therefore there is no more debt?
[01:49:19.980 --> 01:49:20.980]  Well, that's another whole point.
[01:49:20.980 --> 01:49:24.980]  But you know what, Deborah, I've never seen any of that happen.
[01:49:24.980 --> 01:49:27.980]  It never even gets to that point.
[01:49:27.980 --> 01:49:28.980]  They don't care.
[01:49:28.980 --> 01:49:29.980]  They don't care.
[01:49:29.980 --> 01:49:30.980]  They're not afraid of you.
[01:49:30.980 --> 01:49:33.980]  You're just another know-nothing consumer.
[01:49:33.980 --> 01:49:35.980]  What are you going to do to us?
[01:49:35.980 --> 01:49:37.980]  So they don't even bother providing the ledger account.
[01:49:37.980 --> 01:49:39.980]  It just doesn't even get to that point.
[01:49:39.980 --> 01:49:41.980]  I've never seen one.
[01:49:41.980 --> 01:49:43.980]  Never seen one.
[01:49:43.980 --> 01:49:45.980]  Statements, anybody can make a statement up.
[01:49:45.980 --> 01:49:51.980]  And I love it when people say that to me and I say you're the kind of person I want to go for
[01:49:51.980 --> 01:49:54.980]  because I'm going to sit here right now and write on this little pad of paper,
[01:49:54.980 --> 01:49:58.980]  you owe me $1,000 and I'm going to mail it to you,
[01:49:58.980 --> 01:50:01.980]  and you better pay me that money or I'm going to sue you.
[01:50:01.980 --> 01:50:04.980]  Now what if they send you, after your dispute letter,
[01:50:04.980 --> 01:50:09.980]  what if the creditor sends you copies of the receipts from the stores with your signature on it?
[01:50:09.980 --> 01:50:10.980]  Well, then what?
[01:50:10.980 --> 01:50:13.980]  Does that constitute any kind of legitimate proof?
[01:50:13.980 --> 01:50:18.980]  Well, you hit the word right there, copies.
[01:50:18.980 --> 01:50:20.980]  Copies.
[01:50:20.980 --> 01:50:22.980]  Copy.
[01:50:22.980 --> 01:50:26.980]  Copy.
[01:50:26.980 --> 01:50:28.980]  People, they'll ask you in a courtroom, is this your signature?
[01:50:28.980 --> 01:50:30.980]  I don't know, it's a copy.
[01:50:30.980 --> 01:50:32.980]  I don't know if it's my signature.
[01:50:32.980 --> 01:50:36.980]  I had a company a few years ago called Kenseiko Finance.
[01:50:36.980 --> 01:50:39.980]  They're out of business now.
[01:50:39.980 --> 01:50:43.980]  People who used to work there have gotten blogs put together and they talk about,
[01:50:43.980 --> 01:50:47.980]  and gosh, we know this could never happen,
[01:50:47.980 --> 01:50:51.980]  it was not uncommon for them to copy people's signatures
[01:50:51.980 --> 01:50:54.980]  and paste them into contracts and agreements.
[01:50:54.980 --> 01:50:58.980]  That's, of course, why they're not in business anymore.
[01:50:58.980 --> 01:51:01.980]  Copies, copies, copies.
[01:51:01.980 --> 01:51:03.980]  All right, very good.
[01:51:03.980 --> 01:51:10.980]  Okay, so when you file these, or not when you, but you have filed these lawsuits,
[01:51:10.980 --> 01:51:17.980]  and in your course, the structure of the lawsuit, mainly the main defendant is the debt collector
[01:51:17.980 --> 01:51:20.980]  and then as the co-defendant is the creditor,
[01:51:20.980 --> 01:51:26.980]  so then you end up getting some kind of settlement agreement from both of them.
[01:51:26.980 --> 01:51:31.980]  I guess the debt collector is forced to agree that they're not going to share the information anymore
[01:51:31.980 --> 01:51:33.980]  and that the debt is retired,
[01:51:33.980 --> 01:51:39.980]  and then you force the creditor to retire the debt, so to speak,
[01:51:39.980 --> 01:51:43.980]  and as part of that you force them to remove all history from your credit report.
[01:51:43.980 --> 01:51:44.980]  Is that correct?
[01:51:44.980 --> 01:51:47.980]  Correct, and never to report it again now or in the future.
[01:51:47.980 --> 01:51:51.980]  You've got to use these lawyer words, okay,
[01:51:51.980 --> 01:51:59.980]  because lawyers have a real problem with anything unless you put an exact phrase in place, okay,
[01:51:59.980 --> 01:52:02.980]  like the time when all this is going to be done.
[01:52:02.980 --> 01:52:05.980]  If you go and do this settlement agreement, sign up for this settlement agreement,
[01:52:05.980 --> 01:52:07.980]  don't put a date for this to close.
[01:52:07.980 --> 01:52:15.980]  The lawyers think it's five years from now, okay, because that's their attitude.
[01:52:15.980 --> 01:52:21.980]  So Mike, what are the typical violations of the Fair Credit Reporting Act?
[01:52:21.980 --> 01:52:26.980]  This would be violations on the part of the original creditor, I would imagine.
[01:52:26.980 --> 01:52:30.980]  Yeah, well, how about if debt collectors in your credit report, does he fall under fair credit?
[01:52:30.980 --> 01:52:32.980]  Well, I would imagine so.
[01:52:32.980 --> 01:52:33.980]  There you go.
[01:52:33.980 --> 01:52:37.980]  So now you've taken the debt collector in under debt collection and fair credit.
[01:52:37.980 --> 01:52:38.980]  Oh, boy.
[01:52:38.980 --> 01:52:41.980]  So what are the typical violations that occur here under fair credit?
[01:52:41.980 --> 01:52:48.980]  Failure to mark the account in dispute, reporting erroneous and inaccurate information.
[01:52:48.980 --> 01:52:49.980]  All right.
[01:52:49.980 --> 01:52:54.980]  That's two violations under fair credit, 1,000 per violation,
[01:52:54.980 --> 01:52:56.980]  they're in three credit bureaus, that's $6,000.
[01:52:56.980 --> 01:52:58.980]  Per month.
[01:52:58.980 --> 01:53:01.980]  Per month, and every month they update it, they break the law,
[01:53:01.980 --> 01:53:04.980]  because those accounts are updated monthly with the credit bureaus.
[01:53:04.980 --> 01:53:05.980]  Okay.
[01:53:05.980 --> 01:53:10.980]  Sometimes every month, and here's how I justify this, it's common sense.
[01:53:10.980 --> 01:53:15.980]  You're a bank robber, you rob a bank in May, they don't catch you.
[01:53:15.980 --> 01:53:18.980]  You rob a bank in June, they don't catch you.
[01:53:18.980 --> 01:53:21.980]  You rob a bank in July, and they catch you.
[01:53:21.980 --> 01:53:26.980]  And they got you on the video cameras with your face on the first two bank robbers,
[01:53:26.980 --> 01:53:31.980]  but white robberies, but they're not going to charge you with them, are they?
[01:53:31.980 --> 01:53:33.980]  Well, of course they are.
[01:53:33.980 --> 01:53:37.980]  Well, they break in the law every month, you're going to get charged with it.
[01:53:37.980 --> 01:53:39.980]  And you got any question about that?
[01:53:39.980 --> 01:53:41.980]  Let's let the judge and jury decide.
[01:53:41.980 --> 01:53:43.980]  See if they agree with me.
[01:53:43.980 --> 01:53:48.980]  So, Mike, how long do they have to mark your account in dispute on the credit report
[01:53:48.980 --> 01:53:51.980]  after you notify them that the account is in dispute?
[01:53:51.980 --> 01:53:55.980]  Well, the bureaus have 30 to 45 days to respond.
[01:53:55.980 --> 01:53:58.980]  And generally they'll come back and say, we're reporting this correctly.
[01:53:58.980 --> 01:54:03.980]  And then now you're seeing a lot more, I'm seeing accounts where they're coming back,
[01:54:03.980 --> 01:54:05.980]  people get all panicky.
[01:54:05.980 --> 01:54:08.980]  Call me up and say, oh my God, Mike, they marked my account in dispute.
[01:54:08.980 --> 01:54:09.980]  They did?
[01:54:09.980 --> 01:54:15.980]  Wow, you're one of the first ones I've ever heard them do that with.
[01:54:15.980 --> 01:54:21.980]  I says, read exactly to me what it says in the credit report now.
[01:54:21.980 --> 01:54:25.980]  The consumer disputes this account.
[01:54:25.980 --> 01:54:27.980]  Oh, really?
[01:54:27.980 --> 01:54:29.980]  So who would that be?
[01:54:29.980 --> 01:54:31.980]  Well, I guess I'm the consumer, right?
[01:54:31.980 --> 01:54:35.980]  So you've disputed it and they marked it in your behalf in dispute.
[01:54:35.980 --> 01:54:40.980]  The problem with that is it doesn't stop affecting your credit score or your credit report
[01:54:40.980 --> 01:54:46.980]  until there's a phrase like this that comes in from the creditor that says,
[01:54:46.980 --> 01:54:51.980]  the creditor indicates that this account is in dispute.
[01:54:51.980 --> 01:54:54.980]  Then it stops affecting your credit score.
[01:54:54.980 --> 01:55:00.980]  And when creditors look at that report, they are to ignore that line of credit
[01:55:00.980 --> 01:55:03.980]  because the creditor has indicated that it's in dispute.
[01:55:03.980 --> 01:55:05.980]  But they don't do that.
[01:55:05.980 --> 01:55:06.980]  They don't have to.
[01:55:06.980 --> 01:55:08.980]  We're big money people.
[01:55:08.980 --> 01:55:09.980]  What are you going to do to us?
[01:55:09.980 --> 01:55:11.980]  You're just a know-nothing.
[01:55:11.980 --> 01:55:14.980]  So just for the time frame when people are getting into this,
[01:55:14.980 --> 01:55:20.980]  how long does the creditor have to mark the account in dispute on your credit report
[01:55:20.980 --> 01:55:24.980]  under that language that you said from the time that they received the letter?
[01:55:24.980 --> 01:55:27.980]  Well, it's not very clear in the Fair Credit Reporting Act.
[01:55:27.980 --> 01:55:29.980]  It just says they must do an investigation.
[01:55:29.980 --> 01:55:32.980]  But I would think 30 days should be enough.
[01:55:32.980 --> 01:55:35.980]  However, they're never going to mark it in dispute anyway.
[01:55:35.980 --> 01:55:36.980]  Okay.
[01:55:36.980 --> 01:55:41.980]  Let me give you a little example right now because you want to have a chuckle.
[01:55:41.980 --> 01:55:44.980]  You talked about the violation.
[01:55:44.980 --> 01:55:46.980]  See, we didn't get expanded into this too much,
[01:55:46.980 --> 01:55:50.980]  but let's say you have this credit card and you're the owner of the card,
[01:55:50.980 --> 01:55:55.980]  and you have a significant other in your life, a husband, a wife, whatever,
[01:55:55.980 --> 01:56:00.980]  and they are an authorized user and they're in their credit report too.
[01:56:00.980 --> 01:56:06.980]  All the violations just double.
[01:56:06.980 --> 01:56:11.980]  So when you go into court, it's you and your significant other are the plaintiff.
[01:56:11.980 --> 01:56:13.980]  Right.
[01:56:13.980 --> 01:56:18.980]  So $6,000 a month goes to $12,000 a month.
[01:56:18.980 --> 01:56:23.980]  Now, let me show you a case or talk to you about a case right now I have going on
[01:56:23.980 --> 01:56:28.980]  in Minnesota because this will blow your socks off.
[01:56:28.980 --> 01:56:30.980]  It is so funny.
[01:56:30.980 --> 01:56:32.980]  It's unbelievable.
[01:56:32.980 --> 01:56:38.980]  The guy had this credit card with this major credit card company,
[01:56:38.980 --> 01:56:42.980]  and last March he sent him my letter of validation.
[01:56:42.980 --> 01:56:44.980]  Excuse me, letter of dispute.
[01:56:44.980 --> 01:56:47.980]  You dispute with creditors, you validate with debt collectors.
[01:56:47.980 --> 01:56:51.980]  There is a difference.
[01:56:51.980 --> 01:56:53.980]  He sends out the letter of dispute in March.
[01:56:53.980 --> 01:56:59.980]  March nothing happens, April doesn't add nothing, May, June, July.
[01:56:59.980 --> 01:57:01.980]  All of a sudden the lady calls me.
[01:57:01.980 --> 01:57:07.980]  Now, they have a default judgment on this guy in the local court on this account.
[01:57:07.980 --> 01:57:10.980]  And, of course, they have the default judgment in this credit report,
[01:57:10.980 --> 01:57:17.980]  and, of course, they're bad-mouthing him, you know, charged off the whole nine yards.
[01:57:17.980 --> 01:57:21.980]  She calls me last week, she says, Mike,
[01:57:21.980 --> 01:57:27.980]  my husband's account and all this in his credit reports have all been deleted.
[01:57:27.980 --> 01:57:32.980]  The judgment is gone, the line of credit, everything is gone.
[01:57:32.980 --> 01:57:37.980]  This is really, yeah, wow.
[01:57:37.980 --> 01:57:38.980]  Well, that's okay.
[01:57:38.980 --> 01:57:39.980]  You disputed in March.
[01:57:39.980 --> 01:57:40.980]  It's now August.
[01:57:40.980 --> 01:57:42.980]  That's March, April, May, June, July.
[01:57:42.980 --> 01:57:47.980]  That's five months' worth of violations that you can prove that they didn't mark it for five months
[01:57:47.980 --> 01:57:54.980]  in dispute since you sent them the dispute letter, so that's $30,000 there.
[01:57:54.980 --> 01:58:00.980]  And her name, her first name is, I wouldn't even give it out because we haven't filed the case yet,
[01:58:00.980 --> 01:58:05.980]  but she says, and, Mike, wait until we come back.
[01:58:05.980 --> 01:58:06.980]  No, go ahead.
[01:58:06.980 --> 01:58:08.980]  We've got 60 seconds, so go ahead.
[01:58:08.980 --> 01:58:14.980]  Well, she comes back and she says, but, Mike, they deleted it from my husband's credit report,
[01:58:14.980 --> 01:58:17.980]  but they didn't delete it from my credit report.
[01:58:17.980 --> 01:58:25.980]  You see, she's an authorized user, and there's still bad mouth in her and her credit report.
[01:58:25.980 --> 01:58:28.980]  Do you see the problem with this whole thing, Deborah?
[01:58:28.980 --> 01:58:34.980]  I think that they're the ones who are starting to see the problem.
[01:58:34.980 --> 01:58:39.980]  Okay, listen, when we come back, I want to talk a little bit about what responsibilities
[01:58:39.980 --> 01:58:45.980]  and liabilities are on the part of the credit reporting agencies and how the laws apply to them,
[01:58:45.980 --> 01:58:51.980]  and then we'll go to Diane Beale during the next segment, and then we'll start taking your calls.
[01:58:51.980 --> 01:58:52.980]  Callers, stay on the board.
[01:58:52.980 --> 01:58:55.980]  We'll be with you next hour.
[01:58:55.980 --> 01:58:58.980]  This is the rule of law.
[01:58:58.980 --> 01:59:04.980]  It is so enlightening to listen to 90.1 FM, but finding things on the Internet isn't so easy,
[01:59:04.980 --> 01:59:07.980]  and neither is finding like-minded people to share it with.
[01:59:07.980 --> 01:59:10.980]  Oh, well, I guess you haven't heard of Brave New Books, then.
[01:59:10.980 --> 01:59:11.980]  Brave New Books?
[01:59:11.980 --> 01:59:12.980]  Yes.
[01:59:12.980 --> 01:59:17.980]  Brave New Books has all the books and DVDs you're looking for by authors like Alex Jones, Ron Paul,
[01:59:17.980 --> 01:59:18.980]  and G. Edward Griffin.
[01:59:18.980 --> 01:59:22.980]  They even stock Interfood, Berkey products, and Calvin Soaps.
[01:59:22.980 --> 01:59:24.980]  There's no way a place like that exists.
[01:59:24.980 --> 01:59:26.980]  Go check it out for yourself.
[01:59:26.980 --> 01:59:30.980]  It's downtown at 1904 Guadalupe Street, just south of UT.
[01:59:30.980 --> 01:59:34.980]  By UT, there's never anywhere to park down there.
[01:59:34.980 --> 01:59:40.980]  Actually, they now offer a free hour of parking for paying customers at the 500 MLK Parking Facility,
[01:59:40.980 --> 01:59:42.980]  just behind the bookstore.
[01:59:42.980 --> 01:59:45.980]  It does exist, but when are they open?
[01:59:45.980 --> 01:59:50.980]  Monday through Saturday, 11 AM to 9 PM, and 1 to 6 PM on Sundays.
[01:59:50.980 --> 02:00:05.980]  So give them a call at 512-480-2503, or check out their events page at bravenewbookstore.com.