[00:00.000 --> 00:06.640]  You're listening to the Liberty Beat, your daily source for Liberty news and
[00:06.640 --> 00:15.640]  activist updates, online at the LibertyBeat.com.
[00:15.640 --> 00:22.680]  This is Justin Armand with your Liberty Beat for June 26, 2014. Gold opened today at $1,316,
[00:22.680 --> 00:29.680]  silver at $21.06 and Bitcoin is trading at $572. Support for the Liberty Beat comes
[00:29.680 --> 00:34.120]  from the notorious activist Michael Cargill. He has a new show called Come and Talk It,
[00:34.120 --> 00:41.840]  live Sunday afternoon at 4 p.m. on 1370 a.m. in Austin. That's 1370 a.m. on Sunday at 4
[00:41.840 --> 00:42.840]  p.m.
[00:42.840 --> 00:46.920]  And from My Magic Mud, an all-natural teeth whitening and strengthening remedy, you can
[00:46.920 --> 00:51.880]  pick a jar up at Brave New Books or visit them online at MyMagicMud.com to hear a short
[00:51.880 --> 00:54.280]  interview with Dr. Griffin Cole.
[00:54.280 --> 01:00.360]  And now the news. According to a report by CNS News, IRS Commissioner John Coxconnan
[01:00.360 --> 01:05.600]  contributed more than $85,000 to Democratic candidates and committees. He gave President
[01:05.600 --> 01:12.800]  Obama at least $5,000 in donations in 2012 and $19,000 to the Democratic National Committee
[01:12.800 --> 01:19.720]  from 1988 to 2008. Open Secrets Records alleges the IRS Commissioner contributed to every
[01:19.720 --> 01:28.160]  Democratic nominee for president since 1980, but never to the Republican Party.
[01:28.160 --> 01:32.920]  Syrian warplanes carried out a cross-border attack on Iraqi towns this week, resulting
[01:32.920 --> 01:38.960]  in the deaths of at least 57 Iraqi citizens. More than 120 others were wounded. The border
[01:38.960 --> 01:43.560]  cities that were struck are under the control of the terrorist group ISIS. The head of Iraq's
[01:43.560 --> 01:49.200]  Provincial Council called the Syrian attacks barbaric, further unveiling the instability
[01:49.200 --> 01:55.000]  of the region. Meanwhile, at least 150 U.S. troops have arrived in Baghdad to help advise
[01:55.000 --> 01:59.560]  Iraqi security officials.
[01:59.560 --> 02:03.900]  A spokesperson for the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services confirmed at least
[02:03.900 --> 02:08.880]  one case of swine flu at the Lackland Air Force Base in San Antonio, where thousands
[02:08.880 --> 02:13.180]  of migrant children are being housed. The diagnosis prompted the government to fly in
[02:13.180 --> 02:18.760]  more than 2,000 H1N1 vaccines. According to reports, other diseases have broken out
[02:18.760 --> 02:23.840]  among the migrants, including scabies, which infected multiple border patrol agents.
[02:23.840 --> 02:27.640]  Support for the Liberty Beat comes from Cabo Bobs, now with two locations in Austin at
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[02:33.480 --> 02:39.280]  Brokerage, Inc., specializing in precious metals since 1977. They don't feed the banks
[02:39.280 --> 02:45.600]  by taking credit cards, but you can bet they take bitcoin online at rrbi.co or by phone
[02:45.600 --> 02:53.040]  at 800-874-9760. You're listening to the Liberty Beat for June 26, 2014. Be sure to
[02:53.040 --> 03:16.040]  check out the website at thelibertybeat.com.
[03:53.060 --> 04:08.320]  chuk it on that one you chuk it on this one you chuk it on your mother and you chuk it
[04:08.320 --> 04:15.340]  Bad Boyz Bad Boyz Bad Boyz Bad Boyz Bad Boyz Sow
[04:15.340 --> 04:16.580]  On Bad Boyz Bad Boyz Bad Boyz window
[04:16.580 --> 04:16.560]  Bad Boyz Bad Boyz Bad Boyz Bad Boyz window
[04:16.560 --> 04:23.640]  Bad Boyz Bad Boyz Bad Boyz Bad Boyz window
[04:23.640 --> 04:26.240]  Bad Boyz Bad Boyz Bad Boyz Bad Boyz window
[04:26.240 --> 04:29.960]  Bad Boyz Bad Boyz Bad Boyz Bad Boyz window
[04:29.960 --> 04:33.380]  Bad Boyz Bad Boyz Bad Boyz Bad boyz window
[04:33.380 --> 04:33.640]  Bad Boyz Bad Boyz Bad Boyz window
[04:33.640 --> 04:33.920]  Bad Boyz Bad Boyz Bad Boyz window
[04:33.920 --> 04:43.360]  Steven's wheel of our radio and we're going to have a Kim Magnuson on again tonight because
[04:43.360 --> 04:50.200]  the CPS is up for sunset and they've had hearings.
[04:50.200 --> 04:58.760]  We had planned to go to the hearings but some medical issues for both of us prevented us.
[04:58.760 --> 05:11.840]  And from what I understand, unlike the last sunset commissions for the bar and the state
[05:11.840 --> 05:19.580]  commission on judicial conduct, this one was absolutely packed.
[05:19.580 --> 05:23.360]  So that is a very good thing.
[05:23.360 --> 05:30.280]  But if you didn't go down and testify, the hearings are closed.
[05:30.280 --> 05:38.120]  However, they're still taking written statements for the legislators and we absolutely suggest
[05:38.120 --> 05:48.960]  that you contact them if you have any kind of issue with family law or child protective
[05:48.960 --> 05:57.660]  services and you have problems with child protective services, you need to contact the
[05:57.660 --> 05:59.660]  legislators.
[05:59.660 --> 06:10.200]  Tell them what the problem is and if you can, try to formulate a solution because it's not
[06:10.200 --> 06:14.800]  enough to tell the legislators that have a problem.
[06:14.800 --> 06:19.400]  You really need to give them a solution and the more research you can do on the solution,
[06:19.400 --> 06:20.400]  the better for the legislators.
[06:20.400 --> 06:27.080]  But you have to understand, legislators are really busy and they have a lot of people
[06:27.080 --> 06:32.280]  coming to them for a lot of issues and for the most part, the legislators don't have
[06:32.280 --> 06:37.880]  time to research out these issues.
[06:37.880 --> 06:44.520]  So if you have an issue for a legislator, then do all the research you can for them
[06:44.520 --> 06:52.600]  because the more they have done for them, the more likely they are to address your issue
[06:52.600 --> 06:53.600]  for you.
[06:53.600 --> 07:00.520]  So I'm having a couple of technical issues here tonight.
[07:00.520 --> 07:06.920]  Deb, if you're listening, can you send me the new caller page?
[07:06.920 --> 07:13.280]  And Ken should be on in a minute and he'll talk about, he was on last week and we talked
[07:13.280 --> 07:18.560]  about some of the issues with the legislators.
[07:18.560 --> 07:32.640]  This is probably the one place where we can have more influence than anywhere else.
[07:32.640 --> 07:41.040]  The legislators, they seldom get their constituents talking to them.
[07:41.040 --> 07:53.160]  And the few who do have the opportunity to really be heard and seriously make a difference.
[07:53.160 --> 07:58.360]  I am, I don't multitask while I'm doing something trying to get my page up.
[07:58.360 --> 07:59.360]  Okay.
[07:59.360 --> 08:08.760]  Anyway, I know this is a little bit not supposed to happen this way, but I'm old and not doing
[08:08.760 --> 08:11.720]  things as well as I used to.
[08:11.720 --> 08:14.720]  Just a second.
[08:14.720 --> 08:19.360]  I actually got it.
[08:19.360 --> 08:20.360]  Okay.
[08:20.360 --> 08:25.360]  Anyway, we have, we've been doing some work in the family law area.
[08:25.360 --> 08:31.760]  As a matter of fact, I have a family law issue at the moment that I'm dealing with, with
[08:31.760 --> 08:34.760]  my extended family.
[08:34.760 --> 08:44.480]  And it is a difficult issue and the more help the legislators can get, the better because,
[08:44.480 --> 08:54.720]  you know, with, you know, Ken was talking about last week that even when CPS, you know,
[08:54.720 --> 09:03.960]  CPS takes a lot of heat, but I've known people who worked in CPS and it is an extremely difficult
[09:03.960 --> 09:04.960]  job.
[09:04.960 --> 09:12.360]  And then CPS comes to the court with recommendations and the courts don't have to pay any attention
[09:12.360 --> 09:16.320]  to those recommendations if they don't want to.
[09:16.320 --> 09:19.240]  Courts can essentially do whatever they want.
[09:19.240 --> 09:27.480]  And if we had a court that was not corrupt, that would be a good thing, I suppose that
[09:27.480 --> 09:36.480]  would be at least acceptable, but we don't have of all of the courts, it appears to be
[09:36.480 --> 09:45.640]  the family courts are the most corrupt or the most, I guess corrupt is not fair.
[09:45.640 --> 09:57.520]  The family courts are the one court that gives the appearance of being arbitrary and capricious.
[09:57.520 --> 10:06.840]  It may well be that these judges have issues we don't know about, but when you read the
[10:06.840 --> 10:18.960]  requirements in the canons of judicial ethics, it requires that the court not only be fair
[10:18.960 --> 10:27.640]  and honest, it must give the appearance of a fair and honest court.
[10:27.640 --> 10:34.520]  And it appears as though the family courts, at least the ones I've dealt with, go to great
[10:34.520 --> 10:43.160]  lengths to demonstrate that they are not fair and honest, that they are petty and vindictive.
[10:43.160 --> 10:49.160]  And if you dare to do anything the judge doesn't like, he will rule against you out of hand
[10:49.160 --> 10:50.920]  at every turn.
[10:50.920 --> 11:03.400]  I guess this must happen in courts in general, but the only court I've seen that has the
[11:03.400 --> 11:10.600]  appearance of being as arbitrary and capricious as the family courts are traffic courts.
[11:10.600 --> 11:17.160]  And anybody who's ever been to traffic court is very well aware that the only reason the
[11:17.160 --> 11:22.920]  judge and prosecutor is in traffic court is not to give you a fair adjudication of your
[11:22.920 --> 11:26.520]  case, but to collect money.
[11:26.520 --> 11:28.720]  That's their only purpose.
[11:28.720 --> 11:38.080]  They will dismiss a case on occasion just as a dog and pony show so that they can say
[11:38.080 --> 11:47.680]  they do not find everybody guilty, but 99.6% they find guilty no matter what.
[11:47.680 --> 11:56.200]  And if you attempt to fight these guys, they will deny everything.
[11:56.200 --> 12:00.560]  They will rule against you out of hand at every turn and we pretty well thought that
[12:00.560 --> 12:09.280]  only occurred in the family courts, but it appears, I'm sorry, in the traffic courts,
[12:09.280 --> 12:15.520]  but it appears that it also occurs in the family courts and of all places.
[12:15.520 --> 12:20.240]  You have a family here that's being torn apart anyway.
[12:20.240 --> 12:29.400]  You have a court that absolutely should at least give the impression that they're fair
[12:29.400 --> 12:36.160]  and honest and listening to the litigants because in family courts, the emotions are
[12:36.160 --> 12:44.000]  so high and the stakes are so high that you would think the courts would take some effort
[12:44.000 --> 12:52.920]  to make these issues less difficult for people to live with, but in watching the courts,
[12:52.920 --> 13:01.920]  it seems that they absolutely have no compassion for the people that come before them of any
[13:01.920 --> 13:02.920]  kind.
[13:02.920 --> 13:10.500]  I know it sounds harsh, but it appears as though the lawyers on both sides merely look
[13:10.500 --> 13:15.840]  at the litigants as sources of income.
[13:15.840 --> 13:25.480]  Both sides appear to look at the estate of the litigants, decide how much of their estate
[13:25.480 --> 13:31.920]  these two lawyers can extract by filing motions and creating contention where it may or may
[13:31.920 --> 13:41.480]  not exist and churn the case until they have extracted all of the clients' estate that
[13:41.480 --> 13:49.440]  they can before the clients start suing them for malpractice or bar grieving them and then
[13:49.440 --> 13:57.120]  they allow the case to come to before the court and make a deal and whoever has the
[13:57.120 --> 14:01.200]  most money gets the deal.
[14:01.200 --> 14:06.920]  I know that's harsh, but that's exactly what we've seen.
[14:06.920 --> 14:15.920]  Whoever has the money wins the case and we really need to do something to change this.
[14:15.920 --> 14:22.520]  I'm working on the litigation engine and I'm hoping that will help the litigants to better
[14:22.520 --> 14:26.200]  understand their position.
[14:26.200 --> 14:33.120]  One of the things that appears to be a great problem in the family court area is you have
[14:33.120 --> 14:44.200]  people that are forced out of their orderly life and into a court situation where they
[14:44.200 --> 14:50.320]  know little or nothing about what is going on.
[14:50.320 --> 14:55.520]  I guess I should back up and say it appears as though it really doesn't matter if they
[14:55.520 --> 14:57.200]  know what's going on.
[14:57.200 --> 15:01.680]  We have metal detectors in the courthouse and forward.
[15:01.680 --> 15:08.640]  Those metal detectors were put in after a lawyer who was going through a divorce.
[15:08.640 --> 15:16.120]  The lawyer's wife's attorney did what is almost standard.
[15:16.120 --> 15:22.120]  They accused the husband of molesting the children.
[15:22.120 --> 15:24.160]  Doesn't matter if it's true or not true.
[15:24.160 --> 15:26.000]  They don't care.
[15:26.000 --> 15:30.720]  They make the accusation and now the husband's put in a position to where he's a child molester
[15:30.720 --> 15:32.720]  whether he is or not.
[15:32.720 --> 15:34.960]  They did that to this man.
[15:34.960 --> 15:41.680]  He fought them, both his lawyer and the other lawyer did the same thing to him as they do
[15:41.680 --> 15:44.920]  to everybody else.
[15:44.920 --> 15:53.040]  He came into court one day, walked into the court, told the court that you and this lawyer
[15:53.040 --> 16:00.880]  have destroyed my life, took out a pistol and shot them both dead.
[16:00.880 --> 16:09.480]  Put down the pistol, plead guilty and would not let his attorneys appeal his conviction.
[16:09.480 --> 16:14.000]  He went to the death chamber.
[16:14.000 --> 16:16.840]  That's when they put in the metal detectors.
[16:16.840 --> 16:18.160]  It was about family law.
[16:18.160 --> 16:26.240]  I was asked to go to Australia to do some seminars and that was about family law.
[16:26.240 --> 16:32.800]  When I got to Australia, there was a guy on the Sydney Bay Bridge with a big banner chastising
[16:32.800 --> 16:37.280]  the family law courts with the police all trying to get him down.
[16:37.280 --> 16:39.960]  Family law is difficult and contentious everywhere.
[16:39.960 --> 16:48.360]  Hang on, Brandy Kelton, Denver Stevens, Wheel of Law Radio are calling number 512-646-1984.
[16:48.360 --> 16:50.320]  We'll have the phones open all night.
[16:50.320 --> 17:00.720]  If you have a question or comment, give us a call, we'll be right back.
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[18:59.960 --> 19:04.960]  You are listening to the Logos Radio Network, LogosRadioNetwork.com.
[19:29.960 --> 19:36.960]  The Logos Radio Network, LogosRadioNetwork.com, the Logos Radio Network, the Logos Radio
[19:59.960 --> 20:02.960]  Network.
[20:02.960 --> 20:07.640]  Okay, we are back.
[20:07.640 --> 20:09.800]  Randy Kelton, Deborah Stevens, Rule of Law Radio.
[20:09.800 --> 20:14.920]  It looks like we'll only be able to have Kianan tonight.
[20:14.920 --> 20:20.200]  And so I will say maybe I'm getting tomorrow night, I'll save the family law issue for
[20:20.200 --> 20:21.200]  tomorrow night.
[20:21.200 --> 20:32.080]  to encourage as many people as possible to write letters to the subcommittee for the sunset of CPS
[20:32.880 --> 20:36.800]  to make suggestions tell them what your issues are and
[20:39.200 --> 20:46.240]  the more they get the more likely they are to make some positive changes. Something else
[20:46.240 --> 20:54.400]  occurred. Sometimes we think we do these things and struggle and nothing ever happens.
[20:55.440 --> 21:04.000]  Well, it turns out things do happen. I live up in Wise County and I struggled with the county for
[21:04.000 --> 21:10.480]  quite a while to try to get them to change things. They had a sheriff, Phil Ryan, who was the next
[21:10.480 --> 21:19.360]  Texas Ranger. And now this is my personal opinion, but it is my personal opinion that he was a no
[21:19.360 --> 21:30.480]  good, low down rotten scoundrel. Well, he retired from office and I actually ran for sheriff
[21:31.120 --> 21:37.680]  after he retired. This is a very democratic county, so I ran as a Democrat because this
[21:37.680 --> 21:44.560]  is the only possible way to get in. And in the primary, there was another person running, a 26
[21:44.560 --> 21:54.240]  year old deputy. And because of him, I dropped out of the race and voted for him. His name was David
[21:54.240 --> 22:04.800]  Walker. David Walker won the election. Now, prior to this, I was relatively well known in the county
[22:04.800 --> 22:15.040]  as someone who worked for a legal remedy. I had a police officer come to me, found me in a hardware
[22:15.040 --> 22:26.960]  store and he never would tell me who sent him to me, but he was a patriot and the educated police
[22:26.960 --> 22:37.200]  department was trying to fire him for his patriot beliefs. I helped him. We took him on. He was off
[22:37.200 --> 22:45.440]  work a year with full pay while they were trying to get him fired. We struggled through it and he
[22:45.440 --> 22:54.160]  wound up winning the whole thing, getting put back on with full seniority. And I've had a number of
[22:54.160 --> 23:00.720]  police officers come to me and ask me if I could do something to help them get rid of a deputy who
[23:00.720 --> 23:10.800]  was causing all of them major trouble, making them all look bad. Once David Walker got into office,
[23:12.480 --> 23:20.080]  I never heard another peep about the sheriff's department. I used to have people coming all the
[23:20.080 --> 23:25.440]  time complaining about deputies doing this, doing that, doing the other. It seemed like there was a
[23:25.440 --> 23:34.720]  constant stream when Phil Ryan was sheriff. When David Walker took over, nothing, not a peep.
[23:35.600 --> 23:43.440]  In eight years, I have not heard a peep from anybody negative about the sheriff's department.
[23:43.440 --> 23:53.040]  And I find out, I knew when David first got in, we had talked about this issue of taking a person
[23:53.600 --> 24:03.120]  arrested before magistrate. And I went through the code and tried to explain to him and show him how
[24:03.120 --> 24:12.960]  if he did things this way, everyone would benefit. Well, he did things that way.
[24:14.640 --> 24:21.600]  And I just talked to a deputy today and their attitude and the way they treat people
[24:22.560 --> 24:28.000]  is exactly the way you want deputies to treat people.
[24:28.000 --> 24:35.200]  And I have absolutely no doubt the reason they conduct themselves this way
[24:35.840 --> 24:42.000]  is they know if they arrest someone for any reason, they're going to have to take them
[24:42.000 --> 24:51.360]  directly to a magistrate and explain themselves. They don't want to go to the magistrate and have
[24:51.360 --> 24:58.240]  the person they arrested railing against the officer and the officers treatment of the person
[24:58.240 --> 25:07.760]  being arrested. Unlike what, I was arrested in 1992. Sheriff's deputy tried to kill me.
[25:08.400 --> 25:12.800]  He wasn't able to get it done and they arrested me to cover up for what he did.
[25:14.160 --> 25:19.760]  Then he took a reserve officer. There was a reserve officer with this deputy.
[25:19.760 --> 25:26.080]  And the reserve officer did everything right. This deputy was absolutely berserk and had no
[25:26.080 --> 25:34.000]  business being a police officer. And he was working on this reserve deputy was working under them.
[25:34.000 --> 25:44.560]  The reserve deputy, when the sheriff's deputy freaked out, lost control. This reserve deputy
[25:44.560 --> 25:51.440]  did everything right. He contained the situation. My next door neighbor and good personal friend
[25:51.440 --> 25:59.200]  heard the impact when the deputy slammed me to the ground. And he came out to see what was going on.
[25:59.840 --> 26:08.400]  This reserve deputy contained Leon. Leon was six foot five, 500 pounds. And he was really,
[26:08.400 --> 26:14.560]  really excited. The deputy contained him. He got everybody back. He stopped the guy that was trying
[26:14.560 --> 26:21.520]  to kill me. He did everything right. Then they got into the, they arrested me, took me to jail,
[26:21.520 --> 26:31.760]  threw me in jail. And then this sheriff's deputy got this reserve deputy and coerced him into making
[26:31.760 --> 26:41.120]  up a story that simply did not happen. They lied like a dog about what happened in a whole street
[26:41.120 --> 26:46.000]  full, in front of a whole street full of people. And when I read the reports, I thought, how could
[26:46.000 --> 26:54.160]  these guys imagine that they can get away with this? Well, they could because everybody protected
[26:54.160 --> 27:00.640]  the officers. It made no difference, difference what the officer said. It made no difference what
[27:00.640 --> 27:07.680]  the officer said. The courts accepted what they said and would not have it challenged.
[27:09.600 --> 27:15.920]  Well, that was 1992. And that's part of what got me after a big time.
[27:18.320 --> 27:23.200]  Now we're, and at the time they could do that because they could arrest me, take me to jail.
[27:23.200 --> 27:29.600]  They had plenty of time to get their story straight. And they might've got me convicted
[27:29.600 --> 27:34.240]  if they were a little bit smarter, but they weren't. They were too arrogant because they knew
[27:34.240 --> 27:42.160]  they could do this with just absolute impunity. Well, anyway, now that they have to take people
[27:42.160 --> 27:52.160]  before magistrate, everything has changed. I am hoping that I can get David Walker to agree to
[27:52.160 --> 28:03.440]  come on the show. I want him to explain how he managed to take a sheriff's department that was
[28:03.440 --> 28:13.200]  such a horrible mess and turn it into a department that every county in the state can look to as an
[28:13.200 --> 28:20.720]  example, how it should be done. Recently, I've talked to about a half a dozen different officers
[28:20.720 --> 28:28.080]  and all of them have essentially the same attitude about how they do their jobs.
[28:28.080 --> 28:35.680]  And in watching them and talking to them, it's clear that when our founders put together this
[28:35.680 --> 28:42.880]  requirement that a person arrested be taken directly to the nearest magistrate,
[28:42.880 --> 28:51.760]  the nearest magistrate, they fully understood the nature of the human animal. They fully
[28:51.760 --> 29:00.800]  understood that this particular requirement made it such that the police were essentially self-regulating.
[29:03.200 --> 29:08.320]  When they're going to have to explain their behavior to a magistrate, they're going to have
[29:08.320 --> 29:13.760]  to explain it immediately because they can't take the person to jail and throw him in jail all night
[29:13.760 --> 29:18.560]  and sit down and figure out what kind of story they're going to make up. They're going to have
[29:18.560 --> 29:23.840]  to take him straight to a magistrate and tell the magistrate their side of the story immediately.
[29:25.600 --> 29:31.120]  And they're going to have the person in front of the magistrate that can rebut their story.
[29:31.120 --> 29:37.280]  And if they pull anything improper, they're going to tell the judge and the judge is likely
[29:37.280 --> 29:43.360]  to be down their throats. So this was self-regulating and it seems to have worked
[29:43.360 --> 29:49.600]  extremely well. This is Randy Kelp, Deborah Stevens, Bluebell Radio. I'll call in number
[29:49.600 --> 29:54.400]  512-646-1984. Give us a call. We'll be right back.
[29:54.400 --> 30:10.320]  A North Dakota court has upheld the first ever use of a robotic drone in the arrest of an American
[30:10.320 --> 30:16.800]  citizen. I'm Dr. Catherine Albrecht, back with the details on this chilling police state decision next.
[30:16.800 --> 30:22.400]  Privacy is under attack. When you give up data about yourself, you'll never get it back again.
[30:22.400 --> 30:26.800]  And once your privacy is gone, you'll find your freedoms will start to vanish too.
[30:27.360 --> 30:33.600]  So protect your rights. Say no to surveillance and keep your information to yourself. Privacy,
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[30:46.160 --> 30:50.880]  Ronnie Brossert, a rancher in North Dakota, was arrested after a standoff with police
[30:50.880 --> 30:55.600]  for refusing to return four cows that had wandered onto his land. It's not the fact
[30:55.600 --> 31:00.640]  that he was arrested, but how. He's the first American to be arrested on U.S. soil through
[31:00.640 --> 31:06.240]  the use of an unmanned aerial vehicle. His lawyer argued that because police had used a drone to
[31:06.240 --> 31:11.120]  track him without a warrant, the case should be dismissed. The judge disagreed, saying the drone
[31:11.120 --> 31:16.800]  had no bearing on the charges. Say what? Using surveillance drones to track and arrest Americans
[31:16.800 --> 31:21.760]  without a warrant is a clear abuse of our constitutional freedoms. I'm Dr. Catherine
[31:21.760 --> 31:49.920]  Albrecht for StartPage.com, the world's most private search engine.
[31:51.760 --> 32:02.080]  The
[32:02.080 --> 32:06.080]  rule of law radio is proud to offer the rule of law traffic seminar. In today's America,
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[33:13.520 --> 33:28.320]  Yeah, Mr. Officer, you're taking the right hand. Won't you follow the law of the land? I don't understand.
[33:28.320 --> 33:56.320]  When you're going to stop abuse, you're power. When you're going to stop abuse, you're power.
[33:56.320 --> 34:04.640]  So please, Mr. Michael and each officer has to abuse their power. Send a request to the leader,
[34:04.640 --> 34:12.160]  the captain of all officers. Tell them to uphold the law, and please don't abuse their power.
[34:12.880 --> 34:20.080]  They beat and they beat and they cheat and they cheat and they lie every hour. So Mr. Officer,
[34:20.080 --> 34:42.080]  please stop abusing your power. You pulled me over. I tell you to be silent, sir. I need to speak to my lawyer, Mr. Officer. You're acting like you're the judge, finding me guilty, sir.
[34:42.080 --> 34:52.080]  Okay, we are back. Randy Kelton, Deborah Stevens, Rural Law Radio, and we're talking about bringing before magistrate.
[34:52.080 --> 35:06.080]  Seeing this happening in Wise County, it's one of those few times when you get to test what you think and believe.
[35:06.080 --> 35:16.080]  We look at a problem, and I'm primarily an engineer, and I looked at this issue back in the 80s.
[35:16.080 --> 35:28.080]  I read the penal code, read the Code of Criminal Procedure, looked at the practice and thought, have I stepped through the looking glass?
[35:28.080 --> 35:38.080]  How can the practice be so dramatically different than the code? And as an engineer, I read the code as a tech manual.
[35:38.080 --> 35:49.080]  And the tech manual, for the most part, is just the way it is. It's not something you get to argue with or bandy about. It is how things are to be done.
[35:49.080 --> 36:07.080]  Well, it's not how things have been done. And I studied the code and looked for not what the problem was so much.
[36:07.080 --> 36:26.080]  The problem was pretty obvious, or not even how they should do things differently. What I was looking for is what is the smallest change we can make
[36:26.080 --> 36:45.080]  that will have the effect of correcting some of the other issues. Policemen abusing their position, arresting people, taking them to jail, arresting people for things that they should never be arrested for.
[36:45.080 --> 37:03.080]  There were all of these problems going on, and there just wasn't reasonable to consider that all of these problems had totally separate genesis.
[37:03.080 --> 37:17.080]  Something was wrong that was allowing these problems to occur. If we can find what that piece was of all of the things I read in the code that were being done wrong,
[37:17.080 --> 37:34.080]  what is the pivotal issue? And the pivotal issue just glared out of the text that it was Chapter 14, Code of Criminal Procedure, Article 14.01,
[37:34.080 --> 37:55.080]  offense within view. A peace officer or any other person may, without a warrant, arrest any offender when the offense is committed in his presence or within his view, if the offense is one classified as a felony or as an offense against the public peace.
[37:55.080 --> 38:10.080]  That is how the law read since 1925. In 1965, the legislature, in its wisdom, added a second paragraph.
[38:10.080 --> 38:29.080]  Paragraph B says, a peace officer may arrest an offender without a warrant for any offense committed in his presence or within his view. That is in direct contradiction to the paragraph above.
[38:29.080 --> 38:50.080]  These are not what you would call in paramateria. The first one says they can arrest only under certain conditions. The second one says they can arrest you for anything they want to.
[38:50.080 --> 39:07.080]  That one sentence turned Texas into a police state, changed everything. Now a policeman can arrest you on a whim for anything he wants to.
[39:07.080 --> 39:32.080]  Prior to that, if you committed an act that was not a felony and was not a breach of the peace, then the officer would have to, he could write your citation, or he would have to go to the magistrate, fill out a complaint, present it to the magistrate, and petition the magistrate to issue a warrant.
[39:32.080 --> 39:43.080]  That would have to be done in an examining trial. And the legislature set out how an examining trial was to be had.
[39:43.080 --> 39:53.080]  Let me step back a second, go back to Article 2.09 Texas Code of Criminal Procedure.
[39:53.080 --> 40:07.080]  And that one is titled, Who Are Magistrates? And it reads, each, who are magistrates, each of the following officers is a magistrate within the meeting of this code.
[40:07.080 --> 40:27.080]  The justices of the Supreme Court, judges of the Court of Criminal Appeals, justices of the Courts of Appeals, the judges of the District Court, the magistrates appointed by the judges of the District Court, Syveksia County, and it goes through a whole bunch of counties,
[40:27.080 --> 40:38.080]  where they are essentially special, anywhere anyone can be appointed to a judicial position.
[40:38.080 --> 40:46.080]  They go through all of the different counties that have those and name them as magistrates.
[40:46.080 --> 40:59.080]  And in all of this, somewhere it says mayors and recorders. I never have figured out what a recorder is.
[40:59.080 --> 41:23.080]  The justices of the peace and the mayors and recorders and the judges of the municipal courts in incorporated cities. Now, Eddie Craig said that he thought the recorder was the municipal judge, but this mentions a municipal judge, so I'm not sure what the recorder is.
[41:23.080 --> 41:43.080]  But certainly mayors. I called the mayor of the town I live in two days ago and wanted him to hold an examining trial to hear my complaint against the chief of police because he refused to take a complaint that I filed with him.
[41:43.080 --> 42:05.080]  And the mayor had absolutely no clue as to what I was talking about. I talked to the chief of police next day and the mayor called him and asked the chief of the police, what is due process?
[42:05.080 --> 42:19.080]  So that was a minor issue, but everyone who is a judge or mayor or a municipal judge or all magistrates.
[42:19.080 --> 42:47.080]  Now we go to 2.10 duty of magistrates. It is the duty of every magistrate to preserve the peace within his jurisdiction by the use of all lawful means to issue all process intended to aid in the preventing and suppressing of crime to cause the arrest of offenders by the use of lawful means in order that they may be brought to punishment.
[42:47.080 --> 42:57.080]  That's his duty and this refers to how he performs that duty if obliquely.
[42:57.080 --> 43:11.080]  Examining court 2.11 when the magistrate sits for the purpose of inquiring into a criminal accusation against any person, this is called an examining court.
[43:11.080 --> 43:33.080]  Now examining courts, they are governed by chapter 16. There is a whole chapter devoted to an examining court and I have yet to talk to a magistrate who had ever even looked at examining trials.
[43:33.080 --> 44:02.080]  Chapter 16, the commitment or discharge of the accused. 16.01 examining trial, when the accused has been brought before a magistrate for an examining trial that officer shall proceed to examine into the truth of the accusation made, allowing the accused however sufficient time to procure counsel in a proper case.
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[46:14.080 --> 46:24.080]  Thank you for watching.
[46:44.080 --> 46:55.080]  Okay, we are back.
[46:55.080 --> 47:01.080]  Randy Kelton, Deborah Stevens, Rule of Law Radio and we're talking about due process.
[47:01.080 --> 47:06.080]  This is what is supposed to be done and I apologize for the last one.
[47:06.080 --> 47:09.080]  I was so busy reading, I read right off the cliff.
[47:09.080 --> 47:11.080]  I missed the outro.
[47:11.080 --> 47:28.080]  Anyway, if anyone here has ever seen the program Night Court, that was a comedy set in New York City where this was a court that ran all night
[47:28.080 --> 47:43.080]  and its purpose was so that a person arrested after normal business hours would be held only long enough to have counsel appointed.
[47:43.080 --> 47:55.080]  And then the person arrested and his lawyer, the prosecuting attorney and the arresting officer would come before the court.
[47:55.080 --> 47:59.080]  The arresting officer would explain why he arrested the person.
[47:59.080 --> 48:09.080]  The person arrested would explain his side and the judge would decide whether the person was held to answer to require or not.
[48:09.080 --> 48:16.080]  That was a comedy but constitutionally it was dead on.
[48:16.080 --> 48:24.080]  That is exactly what our founders intended when they put magistrates in place.
[48:24.080 --> 48:36.080]  And they have police officers bring someone to a magistrate and explain himself not because they didn't trust the police officer.
[48:36.080 --> 48:43.080]  They had them do that so that the public would not have to fear the police.
[48:43.080 --> 48:48.080]  They would not have to fear that the police could arrest and imprison.
[48:48.080 --> 48:58.080]  They could arrest but it was the magistrate who held the key to the jailhouse door, not the police officer.
[48:58.080 --> 49:01.080]  That's how it was intended.
[49:01.080 --> 49:12.080]  And it worked very well from 1216 when it was put in place in the Magna Carta until 1965.
[49:12.080 --> 49:17.080]  1965 appears to be the time when all of this changed.
[49:17.080 --> 49:26.080]  They made some major changes to the codes in 1965 and one of the changes was Chapter 15
[49:26.080 --> 49:33.080]  where when a person is arrested on an existing warrant,
[49:33.080 --> 49:42.080]  it prescribes a somewhat different procedure than that procedure prescribed in Chapter 16.
[49:42.080 --> 49:53.080]  But what the local courts have done is applied the procedures in 1517 to every case
[49:53.080 --> 50:00.080]  so that now Chapter 16 may as well not even be in the code.
[50:00.080 --> 50:03.080]  And that's a whole chapter.
[50:03.080 --> 50:13.080]  And Deb was with me in Williamson County when we went there and called them to account on Chapter 16 and portions of Chapter 17.
[50:13.080 --> 50:21.080]  Chapter 16, the beginning, the first part of it gives you the right to counsel.
[50:21.080 --> 50:26.080]  They're required to give a warning to the accused.
[50:26.080 --> 50:29.080]  The accused can make a voluntary statement.
[50:29.080 --> 50:35.080]  The counsel may examine witnesses, same rules of evidence as on final trial.
[50:35.080 --> 50:42.080]  The presence of the accused, the examination of each witness shall be in the presence of the accused.
[50:42.080 --> 50:47.080]  Anybody here who's ever been arrested?
[50:47.080 --> 50:59.080]  Have you ever been examined by the, I'm sorry, have you ever had any witnesses appear before the court
[50:59.080 --> 51:07.080]  and be examined before the court and when you're before the magistrate?
[51:07.080 --> 51:09.080]  I haven't.
[51:09.080 --> 51:13.080]  I've demanded it a number of times, but they always deny it.
[51:13.080 --> 51:21.080]  The judge or the magistrate accepts whatever the policeman or whoever made the charge.
[51:21.080 --> 51:27.080]  They accept it out of hand without question and sets bail.
[51:27.080 --> 51:29.080]  That's it.
[51:29.080 --> 51:38.080]  Well, this requires all those things, all of those rights and protections afforded by the Constitution.
[51:38.080 --> 51:45.080]  That would be necessary at trial, those same protections are required to be accorded here.
[51:45.080 --> 51:54.080]  Now, once the judge makes a determination of probable cause, Article 16.17,
[51:54.080 --> 52:02.080]  after the examining trial has been had, the judge shall make an order committing the defendant to the jail
[52:02.080 --> 52:11.080]  in the proper county, discharging or admitting him to bail as the law and facts of the case may require.
[52:11.080 --> 52:18.080]  Failure of the judge to make or enter an order within 48 hours after the examining trial has been completed
[52:18.080 --> 52:25.080]  operates as a finding of no probable cause and the accused shall be discharged.
[52:25.080 --> 52:29.080]  On rare occasions, I actually see those orders.
[52:29.080 --> 52:36.080]  Travis County is one where there actually is an order under 16.17.
[52:36.080 --> 52:47.080]  And Travis County is the county where the documents in the case are afforded to the clerk of the court.
[52:47.080 --> 52:58.080]  They don't necessarily do it in a sealed envelope, but here I'm referring to Chapter 17, the section on bail.
[52:58.080 --> 53:08.080]  Once the magistrate holds an examining trial, then we go to Chapter 17.30,
[53:08.080 --> 53:18.080]  shall certify proceedings the magistrate before whom an examining trial has taken place upon a criminal accusation,
[53:18.080 --> 53:28.080]  shall certify to all the proceedings had before him as well as where he discharges, holds to bail or commits,
[53:28.080 --> 53:35.080]  and transmit them sealed up to the court before which the defendant may be tried,
[53:35.080 --> 53:39.080]  writing his name across the seal of the envelope.
[53:39.080 --> 53:43.080]  The voluntary statement of the defendant, the testimony, bail bonds,
[53:43.080 --> 53:53.080]  and every other proceeding in the case shall thus be delivered to the clerk of the proper court without delay.
[53:53.080 --> 54:02.080]  And this one, those of you who carefully read the Texas Constitution will find this one most interesting.
[54:02.080 --> 54:10.080]  17.31, duty of clerks who receive such proceedings.
[54:10.080 --> 54:19.080]  If the proceedings be delivered to a district clerk, he shall keep them safely and deliver the same to the next grand jury.
[54:19.080 --> 54:28.080]  If the proceedings are delivered to a county clerk, he shall, without delay, deliver them to the district or county attorney of his county.
[54:28.080 --> 54:35.080]  Now, this never happens, absolutely never happens.
[54:35.080 --> 54:47.080]  Deb and I went to Williamson County and I looked at some case and I couldn't find a criminal complaint.
[54:47.080 --> 55:00.080]  And that's important because the court of jurisdiction cannot get jurisdiction
[55:00.080 --> 55:05.080]  until there's a determination of probable cause made by a magistrate.
[55:05.080 --> 55:17.080]  And then that determination of probable cause in the form of a 16.17 order is forwarded to the clerk of the court of jurisdiction as required by 17.30.
[55:17.080 --> 55:21.080]  So here we went in and looked in the record and there was no criminal complaint.
[55:21.080 --> 55:26.080]  Ninety percent of everyone you look at will have no criminal complaint in it.
[55:26.080 --> 55:44.080]  No criminal complaint, the importance of the criminal complaint is that it is the criminal accusation that gives the magistrate jurisdiction to hold an examining trial.
[55:44.080 --> 56:01.080]  Without a complaint, without someone accusing another person of a crime, the magistrate has no jurisdiction so he can't hold an examining trial because there's nothing to examine.
[56:01.080 --> 56:06.080]  So he must have a complaint in order to get jurisdiction to hold the examining trial.
[56:06.080 --> 56:15.080]  Once a determination of probable cause has been made by the magistrate, that ends the magistrate's jurisdiction.
[56:15.080 --> 56:28.080]  He must forward the criminal complaint and all the documents had in the hearing, sealed up in an envelope to the clerk of the court of jurisdiction.
[56:28.080 --> 56:36.080]  This moves jurisdiction from the magistrate to the court of jurisdiction.
[56:36.080 --> 56:41.080]  Now, you'll hear a lot said about an arraignment.
[56:41.080 --> 56:45.080]  I talked to my chief of police here in the town of Vietnam.
[56:45.080 --> 56:47.080]  He was talking about an arraignment.
[56:47.080 --> 56:59.080]  I didn't address the issue with him but he was actually talking about an examining trial and he's calling it an arraignment, that's why I didn't address it.
[56:59.080 --> 57:15.080]  But an arraignment is a hearing held by the court of jurisdiction and it is a hearing for the purpose of determining the identity of the accused and taking a plea.
[57:15.080 --> 57:17.080]  That's an arraignment.
[57:17.080 --> 57:26.080]  Because of the way the magistrates are doing the examining trial, it looks like an arraignment.
[57:26.080 --> 57:29.080]  They don't really do an examining trial.
[57:29.080 --> 57:34.080]  They just determine the identity of the accused and take a plea.
[57:34.080 --> 57:43.080]  And in taking the plea, they find probable cause as a matter of course out of hand.
[57:43.080 --> 57:47.080]  Now, they even do that here in Wise County.
[57:47.080 --> 57:58.080]  And I did not take that issue on yet because at least they are taking the people directly to the nearest magistrate.
[57:58.080 --> 58:07.080]  And that has had the effect of dramatically improving the relationships between the police and the public here in Wise County.
[58:07.080 --> 58:17.080]  But I will be addressing this particular issue in order to get the magistrates to actually hold a real examining trial.
[58:17.080 --> 58:24.080]  If you've been arrested, you almost always feel like it was wrongful, almost not always.
[58:24.080 --> 58:30.080]  And you really want to tell somebody, you need the magistrate to actually listen.
[58:30.080 --> 58:34.080]  You may make the same determination but at least you'll feel like you were listened to.
[58:34.080 --> 58:41.080]  This is Randy Kelton, Denver Stevens, Radio La Radio, our call-in number, 512-646-1984.
[58:41.080 --> 58:50.080]  Give us a call, we'll be taking your calls, and we'll be right back.
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[59:50.080 --> 01:00:00.080]  You're listening to the Logos Radio Network at logosradionetwork.com.
[01:00:00.080 --> 01:00:15.080]  You're listening to the Liberty Beat, your daily source for Liberty news and activist updates, online at thelibertybeat.com.
[01:00:15.080 --> 01:00:28.080]  This is Justin Armand with Your Liberty Beat for June 26, 2014. Gold opened today at $1,316, silver at $21.06, and Bitcoin is trading at $572.
[01:00:28.080 --> 01:00:34.080]  Support for the Liberty Beat comes from the notorious activist Michael Cargill. He has a new show called Come and Talk It!
[01:00:34.080 --> 01:00:42.080]  Live Sunday afternoon at 4 p.m. on 1370 a.m. in Austin. That's 1370 a.m. on Sunday at 4 p.m.
[01:00:42.080 --> 01:00:48.080]  And from My Magic Mud, an all-natural teeth whitening and strengthening remedy, you can pick a jar up at Brave New Books
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[01:00:53.080 --> 01:01:04.080]  And now the news. According to a report by CNS News, IRS Commissioner John Coxconnan contributed more than $85,000 to Democratic candidates and committees.
[01:01:04.080 --> 01:01:15.080]  He gave President Obama at least $5,000 in donations in 2012 and $19,000 to the Democratic National Committee from 1988 to 2008.
[01:01:15.080 --> 01:01:27.080]  Open Secrets Records alleges the IRS Commissioner contributed to every Democratic nominee for president since 1980, but never to the Republican Party.
[01:01:27.080 --> 01:01:36.080]  Syrian warplanes carried out a cross-border attack on Iraqi towns this week, resulting in the deaths of at least 57 Iraqi citizens.
[01:01:36.080 --> 01:01:42.080]  More than 120 others were wounded. The border cities that were struck are under the control of the terrorist group ISIS,
[01:01:42.080 --> 01:01:50.080]  the head of Iraq's provincial council, called the Syrian attacks barbaric, further unveiling the instability of the region.
[01:01:50.080 --> 01:01:59.080]  Meanwhile, at least 150 U.S. troops have arrived in Baghdad to help advise Iraqi security officials.
[01:01:59.080 --> 01:02:08.080]  A spokesperson for the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services confirmed at least one case of swine flu at the Lackland Air Force Base in San Antonio,
[01:02:08.080 --> 01:02:16.080]  where thousands of migrant children are being housed. The diagnosis prompted the government to fly in more than 2,000 H1N1 vaccines.
[01:02:16.080 --> 01:02:23.080]  According to reports, other diseases have broken out among the migrants, including scabies, which infected multiple Border Patrol agents.
[01:02:23.080 --> 01:02:32.080]  Support for the Liberty Beat comes from Cabo Babs, now with two locations in Austin at 500 East Ben White Boulevard and 2828 Rio Grande Boulevard,
[01:02:32.080 --> 01:02:38.080]  and from Roberts & Roberts Brokerage, Inc., specializing in precious metals since 1977.
[01:02:38.080 --> 01:02:49.080]  They don't feed the banks by taking credit cards, but you can bet they take bitcoin. Online at rrbi.co or by phone at 800-874-9760.
[01:02:49.080 --> 01:03:12.080]  You're listening to the Liberty Beat for June 26, 2014. Be sure to check out the website at thelibertybeat.com.
[01:03:19.080 --> 01:03:29.080]  The Liberty Beat is a production of the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services.
[01:03:50.080 --> 01:04:01.080]  Okay, we are back. Randy Kelton, Debra Stevens, Rewire Radio, and we're talking about due process. We're talking about how it should be done.
[01:04:01.080 --> 01:04:19.080]  The code is very clear and very well constructed. After all, this code is the culmination of some 600 years of law of adjudicating cases.
[01:04:19.080 --> 01:04:25.080]  All of this came directly down to us from the Magna Carta.
[01:04:25.080 --> 01:04:32.080]  Just about every situation that can occur has occurred.
[01:04:32.080 --> 01:04:42.080]  I once had a lawyer tell me that all of the case law is essentially replaced every 20 years,
[01:04:42.080 --> 01:04:50.080]  because there are so many cases, just about everything that can happen re-happens every 20 years.
[01:04:50.080 --> 01:04:55.080]  We've been through this so much that they developed a very good body of law.
[01:04:55.080 --> 01:05:08.080]  If our public officials followed the body of law, the vast majority of the problems that we are having would simply go away.
[01:05:08.080 --> 01:05:11.080]  We wouldn't have to address all of these.
[01:05:11.080 --> 01:05:21.080]  Okay, well, I've walked through the examining trial, and now I'll go back to Chapter 14.
[01:05:21.080 --> 01:05:28.080]  Chapter 14 is really pivotal. A peace officer can arrest someone without a warrant.
[01:05:28.080 --> 01:05:41.080]  In 1401, we read that one, and it was 1402. 1402, within view of a magistrate, what 1402 says is that if a magistrate observes a crime being committed,
[01:05:41.080 --> 01:05:48.080]  he can order an officer who may or may not have seen the crime occur to order a person.
[01:05:48.080 --> 01:06:02.080]  But the reasons that a magistrate can order a, let me read it, a peace officer may arrest without warrant when a felony or breach of the peace has been committed in the presence
[01:06:02.080 --> 01:06:10.080]  or within the view of a magistrate, and such magistrate verbally orders the arrest of the defendant.
[01:06:10.080 --> 01:06:19.080]  Now, authority of peace officers. Any peace officer may arrest without a warrant.
[01:06:19.080 --> 01:06:32.080]  Persons found in suspicious places and under circumstances which reasonably show that such persons have been guilty of some felony.
[01:06:32.080 --> 01:06:45.080]  Violation of Title IX, Chapter 42 penal code, breach of the peace or offense under Section 49.02 penal code, and 49 goes to alcohol,
[01:06:45.080 --> 01:06:51.080]  or threaten or are about to commit some offense against the laws.
[01:06:51.080 --> 01:07:04.080]  A person who the peace officer has probable cause to believe have committed an assault resulting in bodily injury to another person, and the peace officer has probable cause to believe
[01:07:04.080 --> 01:07:09.080]  that there is danger of further bodily injury to that person.
[01:07:09.080 --> 01:07:22.080]  Persons who the peace officer has probable cause to believe have committed an offense defined by Section 2507 of the penal code, violation of protective order, or by Section 38112,
[01:07:22.080 --> 01:07:33.080]  penal code violation of protective order issued on basis of sexual assault, if the offense is not committed in the presence of the peace officer.
[01:07:33.080 --> 01:07:39.080]  Persons who the peace officer has probable cause to believe have committed an offense involving family violence.
[01:07:39.080 --> 01:07:50.080]  Persons who the peace officer has probable cause to believe have prevented or interfered with the individual's ability to place a telephone call in an emergency,
[01:07:50.080 --> 01:07:58.080]  as defined by Section 42.062 penal code, if the offense is not committed in the presence of the peace officer.
[01:07:58.080 --> 01:08:14.080]  A person who makes a statement to the peace officer that would be admissible against the person under Article 38.21 and establishes probable cause to believe that that person has committed a felony.
[01:08:14.080 --> 01:08:30.080]  Then we go to Paragraph B, 1403. A peace officer shall arrest without a warrant a person who the peace officer has probable cause to believe has committed an offense under 2507, that was protective order.
[01:08:30.080 --> 01:08:45.080]  38112 is also protective order. If the offense is committed in the presence of the peace officer, if reasonably necessary to verify an allegation of a violation of a protective order
[01:08:45.080 --> 01:08:53.080]  or the commission of an offense involving family violence, the peace officer shall remain at the scene of the investigation to verify the allegation
[01:08:53.080 --> 01:09:05.080]  and to prevent the further commission of the violation of family violence. A peace officer who is out, okay, the rest of this is specific to family violence.
[01:09:05.080 --> 01:09:26.080]  So it's real clear here that while the 1401A says that a peace officer may arrest an offender without a warrant for any offense committed in his presence or within his view,
[01:09:26.080 --> 01:09:44.080]  1403 specifically limits any offense to the offenses listed in 1403, which include felonies, breaches of the peace, and breaches of a protective order.
[01:09:44.080 --> 01:10:00.080]  But the courts have, or primarily the prosecutors, have pretty well told the police they can arrest you for anything they want to.
[01:10:00.080 --> 01:10:17.080]  And the problem with that is the average conviction rate in the state of Texas, 99.6. It rounds up to 100.
[01:10:17.080 --> 01:10:30.080]  This has created a condition to where we have grossly inflated the number of people in our Texas prisons at 30 to 40 grand a year per person.
[01:10:30.080 --> 01:10:44.080]  And our prisons have been stuffed full and we've had to build new prisons, not because there's more crime, but the FBI says that crime has been steadily decreasing for the last 20 years.
[01:10:44.080 --> 01:10:52.080]  So with crime decreasing, our prisons are filling up more and more.
[01:10:52.080 --> 01:10:59.080]  The United States houses approximately 3% of the world's population.
[01:10:59.080 --> 01:11:14.080]  We incarcerate approximately 50% of, I'm sorry, we house approximately 50% of the world's population of inmates, that's a better way to say that.
[01:11:14.080 --> 01:11:23.080]  3% of the population, 50% of the inmates, would you recognize a police state if you were in one?
[01:11:23.080 --> 01:11:36.080]  And this didn't happen because we have some despotic dictator who has forced all these people into political prisons.
[01:11:36.080 --> 01:11:44.080]  Stalin never housed as many prisoners as we're housing.
[01:11:44.080 --> 01:12:03.080]  This all happened because we just weren't paying attention. And for us not paying attention, for us not standing up and wailing in righteous indignation when our policemen stepped a half inch across a legal line.
[01:12:03.080 --> 01:12:07.080]  This is the world when we have reaped.
[01:12:07.080 --> 01:12:23.080]  Your children will grow up in the worst police state the world has ever seen, and for the most part, we're all sitting back here in a state of cognitive dissonance, saying it's not happening, it's not happening.
[01:12:23.080 --> 01:12:26.080]  Well, it is happening right in front of us.
[01:12:26.080 --> 01:12:45.080]  And if the fact that this injustice is being visited on so many people is not enough to motivate you, you might consider at $30,000 a year how much this is costing you and your tax money.
[01:12:45.080 --> 01:13:00.080]  And what else we could be doing with that tax money if we weren't housing prisoners, just to facilitate the administrative convenience of prosecutors and judges.
[01:13:00.080 --> 01:13:11.080]  We are paying incredible amounts of money every year, just so the judge can go out on the weekends or on Friday evening and play golf.
[01:13:11.080 --> 01:13:17.080]  You don't have to sit in court and be bored with a bunch of unnecessary trials.
[01:13:17.080 --> 01:13:37.080]  Why bother with trials when you can violate every right a person has and force him into a position such that when the prosecutor comes to him with a perfectly reasonable deal, he has no rational option but to take the deal.
[01:13:37.080 --> 01:13:39.080]  That's my story and I'm sticking to it.
[01:13:39.080 --> 01:13:41.080]  We do have a caller.
[01:13:41.080 --> 01:13:45.080]  We're going to go to Larry in Missouri.
[01:13:45.080 --> 01:13:46.080]  Hello, Larry.
[01:13:46.080 --> 01:13:50.080]  What do you have for us today?
[01:13:50.080 --> 01:13:51.080]  Hello, Mr. Randy.
[01:13:51.080 --> 01:13:52.080]  How are you?
[01:13:52.080 --> 01:13:54.080]  I'm good.
[01:13:54.080 --> 01:13:55.080]  Okay.
[01:13:55.080 --> 01:13:58.080]  Just had a question concerning garnishment.
[01:13:58.080 --> 01:14:12.080]  Well, say here that I purchased the Dearest Dictionary from the Rule of Love website with the issue of having breach of contract issues with someone and it really helped me a lot.
[01:14:12.080 --> 01:14:21.080]  And I had a default judgment awarded, given to me in my favor.
[01:14:21.080 --> 01:14:29.080]  So now I'm coming up just to kind of go quickly here.
[01:14:29.080 --> 01:14:33.080]  So I got the default judgment here in a few weeks.
[01:14:33.080 --> 01:14:44.080]  The gentleman that I or the person that I had the default judgment against filed bankruptcy after the default judgment.
[01:14:44.080 --> 01:14:54.080]  So I have a garnishment bankruptcy hearing at the bankruptcy court here from my district, Missouri, coming up.
[01:14:54.080 --> 01:15:04.080]  And I've never been to this process before, so I was calling to see if perhaps you were familiar with it or can tell me what can I expect or what documentation I should have.
[01:15:04.080 --> 01:15:08.080]  Bankruptcy is not my area.
[01:15:08.080 --> 01:15:09.080]  Okay.
[01:15:09.080 --> 01:15:14.080]  So I don't know if you can bankrupt out of a court judgment.
[01:15:14.080 --> 01:15:18.080]  I think you can.
[01:15:18.080 --> 01:15:19.080]  Okay.
[01:15:19.080 --> 01:15:24.080]  I think he may be able to bankrupt right out from under here.
[01:15:24.080 --> 01:15:26.080]  But don't quote me on that.
[01:15:26.080 --> 01:15:35.080]  That's just from what I vaguely remember hearing and I can't quote a source.
[01:15:35.080 --> 01:15:39.080]  So it's most likely wrong.
[01:15:39.080 --> 01:15:41.080]  What was the nature of the claim?
[01:15:41.080 --> 01:15:45.080]  Did it involve fraud?
[01:15:45.080 --> 01:15:49.080]  Well, it was a breach of contract.
[01:15:49.080 --> 01:16:01.080]  It was just a loan that was given to this gentleman with a specific payback period.
[01:16:01.080 --> 01:16:02.080]  Yeah, he can bankrupt.
[01:16:02.080 --> 01:16:06.080]  I'm going to almost guarantee you're getting bankrupt out of that.
[01:16:06.080 --> 01:16:10.080]  If it were fraud, then he can't.
[01:16:10.080 --> 01:16:14.080]  You know, here in Texas, we have homestead loss.
[01:16:14.080 --> 01:16:18.080]  And if you homestead your property, it can't be touched.
[01:16:18.080 --> 01:16:19.080]  IRS can't get it.
[01:16:19.080 --> 01:16:24.080]  Nobody can get it unless you're sued for fraud.
[01:16:24.080 --> 01:16:28.080]  Fraud mitigates everything.
[01:16:28.080 --> 01:16:31.080]  If you could commit fraud, you have no protection.
[01:16:31.080 --> 01:16:33.080]  That's why I asked the question.
[01:16:33.080 --> 01:16:41.080]  If it's not a judgment based on fraud, I'm going to bet you could bankrupt out.
[01:16:41.080 --> 01:16:43.080]  Okay.
[01:16:43.080 --> 01:16:46.080]  It comes as an unsecured debt.
[01:16:46.080 --> 01:16:49.080]  Let's write it off.
[01:16:49.080 --> 01:16:50.080]  Okay.
[01:16:50.080 --> 01:16:52.080]  Is that it?
[01:16:52.080 --> 01:16:53.080]  Yes, sir.
[01:16:53.080 --> 01:16:54.080]  Thank you.
[01:16:54.080 --> 01:16:55.080]  Okay.
[01:16:55.080 --> 01:16:56.080]  Thank you.
[01:16:56.080 --> 01:16:57.080]  We're about to go to break.
[01:16:57.080 --> 01:16:58.080]  Randy Kelton, Debra Stevens.
[01:16:58.080 --> 01:16:59.080]  You have our radio.
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[01:19:25.080 --> 01:19:45.080]  Okay, we are back.
[01:19:45.080 --> 01:19:49.080]  Randy Kelton, Deborah Stevens, and we now have Ken Magnuson.
[01:19:49.080 --> 01:19:57.080]  And Ken, we spoke earlier about the family law and the CPS.
[01:19:57.080 --> 01:20:02.080]  You talked to someone who was actually was able to make it to the hearing.
[01:20:02.080 --> 01:20:06.080]  Will you tell us about what you heard went on there?
[01:20:06.080 --> 01:20:14.080]  Okay, the report back from the, this was the Sunset Advisory Commission.
[01:20:14.080 --> 01:20:19.080]  And just to review real quick, Sunset Advisory Commission is a commission made
[01:20:19.080 --> 01:20:25.080]  of state legislators and two public members that review agencies of Texas to see whether
[01:20:25.080 --> 01:20:30.080]  or not they need to be quote-unquote sunset or closed to save the taxpayers money.
[01:20:30.080 --> 01:20:35.080]  Usually it's used as an opportunity to look over the agency and how it's operating and see
[01:20:35.080 --> 01:20:42.080]  whether or not it needs some significant retooling or reworking or divisions or whatever.
[01:20:42.080 --> 01:20:46.080]  The agency that was up was Family Protective Services,
[01:20:46.080 --> 01:20:49.080]  which includes Adult Protective Services
[01:20:49.080 --> 01:20:55.080]  and Child Protective Services also referred to as CPS in Texas.
[01:20:55.080 --> 01:21:01.080]  There's some other things that it does, but they're related to those two major functions.
[01:21:01.080 --> 01:21:06.080]  The hearings were, I was unable to attend because of other issues.
[01:21:06.080 --> 01:21:12.080]  But one of the people that I knew that was going down there said it was standing room only.
[01:21:12.080 --> 01:21:17.080]  They had two ante rooms with monitors in it and they were packed full
[01:21:17.080 --> 01:21:20.080]  and it was standing room in the hallway only.
[01:21:20.080 --> 01:21:23.080]  And I just recently got an email message saying the testimony,
[01:21:23.080 --> 01:21:30.080]  which started at 9 o'clock in the morning, continued until 1253 a.m. the next morning.
[01:21:30.080 --> 01:21:38.080]  So they were taking a lot and this was horrendous testimony about abuses of power by CPS,
[01:21:38.080 --> 01:21:48.080]  lies, misdirection, failed investigations, and even one woman testified as to the fact that
[01:21:48.080 --> 01:21:54.080]  CPS had taken her child away and the child had died in the hands of the foster parents.
[01:21:54.080 --> 01:22:01.080]  So this was just showing that CPS is just incompetent in an overall perspective of what's going on.
[01:22:01.080 --> 01:22:06.080]  So anybody that's hearing this, they are going to still take written testimony
[01:22:06.080 --> 01:22:11.080]  that you can submit to the Sunset Commission through June 30th.
[01:22:11.080 --> 01:22:17.080]  So if you want to write up a story or write your concerns, the key is to,
[01:22:17.080 --> 01:22:21.080]  I would suggest everybody go out and read the reports by the agency
[01:22:21.080 --> 01:22:26.080]  as well as the staff recommendations or reports by the Sunset Commission first
[01:22:26.080 --> 01:22:29.080]  to find out where the lay of the land is.
[01:22:29.080 --> 01:22:35.080]  I'm still preparing my comments that I intend to submit and that's where we're at at this point.
[01:22:35.080 --> 01:22:39.080]  Almost everybody that had a horror story down there was immediately greeted
[01:22:39.080 --> 01:22:43.080]  after their testimony by a member of the Child Protective Services
[01:22:43.080 --> 01:22:49.080]  and they've essentially announced to these individuals that they were going to reopen their cases.
[01:22:49.080 --> 01:22:53.080]  And that's good news if they really do it, but I think that's a lot of lip service
[01:22:53.080 --> 01:23:00.080]  because they were in the whirlwind at the time of hearing this horrendous failure of this agency.
[01:23:00.080 --> 01:23:05.080]  Now to give some basic ideas of what's going on is Child Protective Services,
[01:23:05.080 --> 01:23:10.080]  in my overview and estimation, is the work that they're supposed to do,
[01:23:10.080 --> 01:23:17.080]  hypothetically in a perfect world, they're supposed to protect children from abusive situations
[01:23:17.080 --> 01:23:22.080]  or criminal conduct against them or unsafe living conditions.
[01:23:22.080 --> 01:23:27.080]  And unsafe living conditions doesn't necessarily mean that you haven't cleaned the dishes
[01:23:27.080 --> 01:23:30.080]  this morning from breakfast yet and it's evening.
[01:23:30.080 --> 01:23:37.080]  It indicates when it's a significant risk to the child for safety reasons,
[01:23:37.080 --> 01:23:40.080]  for their health and well-being over the long term.
[01:23:40.080 --> 01:23:44.080]  However, Child Protective Services, it would appear, based on their budgets
[01:23:44.080 --> 01:23:49.080]  and the number of calls they get, is incredibly understaffed
[01:23:49.080 --> 01:23:54.080]  and most of the staff is horribly underpaid.
[01:23:54.080 --> 01:23:58.080]  And I'm still not to the point of trying to find out what their requirements are
[01:23:58.080 --> 01:24:03.080]  for education for people that are supposed to go out and do investigations.
[01:24:03.080 --> 01:24:07.080]  Now from the other side of the perspective, which I've talked about at length,
[01:24:07.080 --> 01:24:14.080]  is how CPS always ends up in, when something is found or suspected,
[01:24:14.080 --> 01:24:17.080]  ends up in court proceedings, in family court.
[01:24:17.080 --> 01:24:20.080]  And this is where my expertise of watching the family courts
[01:24:20.080 --> 01:24:24.080]  over the course of the last 20 years finds judges and attorneys
[01:24:24.080 --> 01:24:29.080]  and ad litem attorneys and amicus attorneys and social studies workers
[01:24:29.080 --> 01:24:34.080]  and even the attorneys that represent the parties totally disinterested
[01:24:34.080 --> 01:24:39.080]  in actually getting to the bottom of facts and actually having empirical evidence to hear,
[01:24:39.080 --> 01:24:44.080]  they want to just rush to judgment and make temporary orders,
[01:24:44.080 --> 01:24:48.080]  which usually create more animosity between the couples.
[01:24:48.080 --> 01:24:54.080]  And most of the time it's wrong because nobody's really done a real investigation
[01:24:54.080 --> 01:24:59.080]  because nobody in the process that I've described so far is actually qualified.
[01:24:59.080 --> 01:25:02.080]  Let me take it this way.
[01:25:02.080 --> 01:25:05.080]  Most of the time children are qualified.
[01:25:05.080 --> 01:25:12.080]  And then when the judge or an associate judge in some cases shows a particular leaning
[01:25:12.080 --> 01:25:18.080]  of which parent they're showing support for, all of a sudden social studies
[01:25:18.080 --> 01:25:24.080]  and CPS reports all come in to side with what the judge has determined.
[01:25:24.080 --> 01:25:29.080]  We think that some of this may be being created by grants that are from the federal government,
[01:25:29.080 --> 01:25:35.080]  to what I can basically tell up to 50% of the cost of child protective services
[01:25:35.080 --> 01:25:38.080]  or family protective services in Texas.
[01:25:38.080 --> 01:25:41.080]  It's through various grant proposals and federal money.
[01:25:41.080 --> 01:25:47.080]  Now the question is how that federal money is injected into the process may create
[01:25:47.080 --> 01:25:53.080]  an untenable conflict of interest because if it's based on numbers of cases,
[01:25:53.080 --> 01:25:57.080]  the agency is then motivated to create cases where none should exist
[01:25:57.080 --> 01:26:03.080]  and exacerbate cases and create essentially the mountain out of the molehill type case
[01:26:03.080 --> 01:26:11.080]  in order to justify another grant or another avenue of revenue from the federal government,
[01:26:11.080 --> 01:26:20.080]  which makes the entire process fraught with partiality and capricious and arbitrary determinations
[01:26:20.080 --> 01:26:24.080]  in addition to the fact that many of the people that they hire are not qualified
[01:26:24.080 --> 01:26:27.080]  to do any investigation whatsoever.
[01:26:27.080 --> 01:26:31.080]  So that's where we're at at this point and we need to look at it.
[01:26:31.080 --> 01:26:33.080]  There are a number of lawsuits that are in federal court.
[01:26:33.080 --> 01:26:36.080]  I'm still trying to find all of them.
[01:26:36.080 --> 01:26:42.080]  They were mentioned in the report by the agency and most of it is about the fact that families
[01:26:42.080 --> 01:26:50.080]  that lose children that are put in foster care or adopted out aren't being given due process.
[01:26:50.080 --> 01:26:53.080]  The process is streamlined. There's no empirical evidence.
[01:26:53.080 --> 01:26:55.080]  There's no real appeal process.
[01:26:55.080 --> 01:27:00.080]  The appeal process through Child Protective Services at this point in time is you ask for an appeal
[01:27:00.080 --> 01:27:04.080]  and it's essentially an in-department closed door.
[01:27:04.080 --> 01:27:08.080]  Yeah, we looked at your documents and we see no reason to reverse the findings.
[01:27:08.080 --> 01:27:10.080]  So it's not really an appeal.
[01:27:10.080 --> 01:27:15.080]  It's kind of like the same kind of appeal we see when we appeal a complaint against a judge
[01:27:15.080 --> 01:27:19.080]  with judicial conduct or an attorney with the state bar.
[01:27:19.080 --> 01:27:23.080]  They don't do anything. They just rubber stamp them.
[01:27:23.080 --> 01:27:26.080]  Similar to what we've been hearing on the news about the VA
[01:27:26.080 --> 01:27:33.080]  and essentially meeting their 14-day intake and appointment schedule,
[01:27:33.080 --> 01:27:37.080]  bureaucrats are known when they're under the gun to falsify documents
[01:27:37.080 --> 01:27:40.080]  in order to look like they're doing their job.
[01:27:40.080 --> 01:27:46.080]  This is just another failure that's impacting families across the state and other states.
[01:27:46.080 --> 01:27:49.080]  Texas is not alone.
[01:27:49.080 --> 01:27:55.080]  Ken, I'm listening to this as an engineer.
[01:27:55.080 --> 01:28:04.080]  And the first thing I wonder is how does this agency manage to hire all of these people
[01:28:04.080 --> 01:28:14.080]  and have them be so absolutely horribly corrupt and inconsiderate and unfeeling?
[01:28:14.080 --> 01:28:18.080]  Okay. Well, first off, I'm not going to say they're all that.
[01:28:18.080 --> 01:28:22.080]  Hold on. Hold on. I'm being facetious here.
[01:28:22.080 --> 01:28:23.080]  Okay.
[01:28:23.080 --> 01:28:27.080]  Clearly that's not the case.
[01:28:27.080 --> 01:28:32.080]  What is going on politically?
[01:28:32.080 --> 01:28:38.080]  I've known some people who work for CPS and they have very serious complaints
[01:28:38.080 --> 01:28:48.080]  and their complaints are almost exclusively political that they can't go out and do their jobs
[01:28:48.080 --> 01:28:55.080]  because they have so much political pressure from their bosses that they're not allowed to
[01:28:55.080 --> 01:29:02.080]  or they have so many people they're trying to handle at one time they can't keep up with all of them.
[01:29:02.080 --> 01:29:08.080]  This points to a systemic problem.
[01:29:08.080 --> 01:29:17.080]  Do you have any suggestions of what we could do to rework the agency
[01:29:17.080 --> 01:29:27.080]  in a way that would make them more credible or credible is not the term I'm looking for,
[01:29:27.080 --> 01:29:37.080]  but give them more credence and at the same time give them the ability to actually do their jobs?
[01:29:37.080 --> 01:29:42.080]  Because I know we can't film an agency with people who are just up carrying.
[01:29:42.080 --> 01:29:44.080]  Hang on. We're about to go to break.
[01:29:44.080 --> 01:29:49.080]  I'll see if I can think of how to say this when I come back so I don't keep stumbling over my tongue.
[01:29:49.080 --> 01:30:04.080]  Randy Kelton, Deborah Stevens, ruler of our radio, I call it number 512-646-1984, we'll be right back.
[01:30:04.080 --> 01:30:10.080]  Top quiz, which is a better deal, a supersized coffee at the regular price or the normal size at a discount?
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[01:33:07.080 --> 01:33:30.080]  Yeah, and who you want to chip?
[01:33:30.080 --> 01:33:48.800]  Okay.
[01:33:48.800 --> 01:33:49.800]  We are back.
[01:33:49.800 --> 01:33:50.800]  Brandon McKelvin.
[01:33:50.800 --> 01:33:57.080]  Deborah Stevens here with Steve, here with Ken Magnuson, and what I was leading up to
[01:33:57.080 --> 01:34:04.080]  is realize that in any group, there are going to be some really bad apples that need to
[01:34:04.080 --> 01:34:16.080]  be weeded out, and it's inappropriate to focus our attention only on the anomalies.
[01:34:16.080 --> 01:34:24.080]  What is consistently going on that is a problem, and what can we do to maybe find some adjustments
[01:34:24.080 --> 01:34:27.080]  to fix this?
[01:34:27.080 --> 01:34:38.080]  For instance, we want to go to how the courts deal with CPS and how those funding CPS deal
[01:34:38.080 --> 01:34:45.080]  with the people who are actually implementing it, because I know some people that are in
[01:34:45.080 --> 01:34:53.080]  CPS, and they really want to help these kids, but they feel as though they're hamstrung.
[01:34:53.080 --> 01:34:59.080]  What can we do to make it so that somebody who really cares and wants to do the right
[01:34:59.080 --> 01:35:04.080]  thing can do the right thing, and what is it that's screwing things up?
[01:35:04.080 --> 01:35:07.080]  You got some suggestions, Ken?
[01:35:07.080 --> 01:35:09.080]  Well, first off, you have to look at the problem.
[01:35:09.080 --> 01:35:12.080]  The problem is not a single problem.
[01:35:12.080 --> 01:35:19.080]  This is a culmination of a whole series of problems that lead us to, number one, there
[01:35:19.080 --> 01:35:24.080]  are good employees that are there, that are well qualified, that follow all the rules
[01:35:24.080 --> 01:35:29.080]  and regulations, including best standards and practices and everything, and they don't
[01:35:29.080 --> 01:35:34.080]  get in there and testify about essentially anomalous things that they've seen in the
[01:35:34.080 --> 01:35:39.080]  home that has nothing to do with the care of the kids and raise it as a primary issue
[01:35:39.080 --> 01:35:41.080]  of separating the child from the parent.
[01:35:41.080 --> 01:35:43.080]  There are those good employees.
[01:35:43.080 --> 01:35:48.080]  There's that segment, but at the bottom end of this, the pay level and the pay grade for
[01:35:48.080 --> 01:35:53.080]  these employees is relatively low, which means that the people that they're attracting to
[01:35:53.080 --> 01:35:59.080]  this are either relatively low educational standpoint, meaning that they don't have many
[01:35:59.080 --> 01:36:05.080]  credentials, they couldn't get a job anywhere else, or they're wanting to participate here
[01:36:05.080 --> 01:36:11.080]  because either they've got some other issues or whatever, or they've got their own agenda.
[01:36:11.080 --> 01:36:14.080]  They really think they're going to go out and solve the problems with families, and
[01:36:14.080 --> 01:36:20.080]  the problem is that some cases these people maybe have a heightened sense of how they
[01:36:20.080 --> 01:36:25.080]  think a family should be raised, and they're injecting their standards into a family in
[01:36:25.080 --> 01:36:33.080]  which they have no right nor lawful capability of telling you how to raise your children
[01:36:33.080 --> 01:36:38.080]  as long as the children are not in danger, as long as the children are not being abused.
[01:36:38.080 --> 01:36:43.080]  You've got to get across that criteria first, and I think there's a lot of them that are
[01:36:43.080 --> 01:36:47.080]  in that position where they see, they always see fire.
[01:36:47.080 --> 01:36:50.080]  No matter where they go, if they're called and they go into a household, they're always
[01:36:50.080 --> 01:36:55.080]  looking for the smoking gun, if we're going to use some more metaphors here.
[01:36:55.080 --> 01:37:00.080]  They're looking for the smoking gun that proves that there's some sort of abuse happening,
[01:37:00.080 --> 01:37:07.080]  and they may jump to conclusions because they haven't been taught or trained properly in
[01:37:07.080 --> 01:37:11.080]  standards and practices for this kind of operation.
[01:37:11.080 --> 01:37:17.080]  Number one is I'm aware of a case in which the mother was having problems taking care
[01:37:17.080 --> 01:37:20.080]  of the kids because she was injured from a car accident.
[01:37:20.080 --> 01:37:27.080]  The eldest son had to utilize a fire extinguisher on more than two occasions to put out a fire
[01:37:27.080 --> 01:37:32.080]  in the kitchen because the mother could no longer operate the fire extinguisher, and
[01:37:32.080 --> 01:37:38.080]  yet when CPS was notified about this to do an investigation, all they did was referred
[01:37:38.080 --> 01:37:43.080]  to the court records, and this gets back to the family court and how the family courts
[01:37:43.080 --> 01:37:48.080]  are absolutely unbelievably corrupt, and now the family judges that might be listening
[01:37:48.080 --> 01:37:52.080]  to me, if you're following the law and you're following the rules and you're looking at
[01:37:52.080 --> 01:37:55.080]  empirical evidence, I'm not talking about you.
[01:37:55.080 --> 01:38:00.080]  I'm talking about the ones that are out there churning these cases, and to use another metaphor,
[01:38:00.080 --> 01:38:06.080]  allowing the attorneys and the social studies and CPS to pour gasoline on the case and spark
[01:38:06.080 --> 01:38:13.080]  a lit match to create more animosity, more betrayal, and a heightened sense of urgency
[01:38:13.080 --> 01:38:16.080]  within the context of the parents.
[01:38:16.080 --> 01:38:21.080]  They feel absolutely victimized, which they should feel victimized, but they don't know
[01:38:21.080 --> 01:38:26.080]  where to turn because some of the most dangerous attorneys are their own who have failed over
[01:38:26.080 --> 01:38:30.080]  and over and over again to actually advocate their case.
[01:38:30.080 --> 01:38:37.080]  So, in any event, when you have those pressures there, you can have good CPS workers that
[01:38:37.080 --> 01:38:43.080]  get good information and either say that this story is true or this story is not true, and
[01:38:43.080 --> 01:38:47.080]  then all of a sudden you have a judge that decides they want to dismiss it.
[01:38:47.080 --> 01:38:53.080]  They don't want to listen to the CPS worker, and essentially, either the CPS workers have
[01:38:53.080 --> 01:39:00.080]  credibility with the courts because of standards and practices and using empirical science
[01:39:00.080 --> 01:39:10.080]  and something that would survive scrutiny under a Daubert motion, then the court should
[01:39:10.080 --> 01:39:16.080]  not have any discretion to disregard what they say as long as it's brought in written
[01:39:16.080 --> 01:39:23.080]  format to all the parties and everybody gets to see where all the facts lie, what's been
[01:39:23.080 --> 01:39:28.080]  testified, but I'm seeing the family court process where nobody allows videotaping, nobody
[01:39:28.080 --> 01:39:33.080]  allows audio taping, and if you don't video and audio tape, you can't catch these people
[01:39:33.080 --> 01:39:37.080]  lying about what the children said, which is being done all the time.
[01:39:37.080 --> 01:39:43.080]  Now, there are some block grants from the federal government that help place kids that
[01:39:43.080 --> 01:39:50.080]  are abused in foster care or in adoption, and this is a national thing, and there's
[01:39:50.080 --> 01:39:55.080]  been a lot of rumor mills going on about why that all exists, but I think it was set up
[01:39:55.080 --> 01:40:03.080]  initially to help an incredibly bad situation and help fund a department that usually didn't
[01:40:03.080 --> 01:40:08.080]  end up with the money and the wherewithal to go through that process of placement when
[01:40:08.080 --> 01:40:09.080]  it was necessary.
[01:40:09.080 --> 01:40:15.080]  Now, all of a sudden, this money is available, and if this money is available under the wrong
[01:40:15.080 --> 01:40:23.080]  set of circumstances and rules of process where the money may be used and where it may
[01:40:23.080 --> 01:40:28.080]  not be used, and it's just a general revenue fund, and all they got to do is generate numbers,
[01:40:28.080 --> 01:40:34.080]  now there's a motivation for them to generate numbers when no case exists necessarily in
[01:40:34.080 --> 01:40:37.080]  order to continue to get the federal money.
[01:40:37.080 --> 01:40:43.080]  So that needs to be looked at, but part of this is also standards of practices.
[01:40:43.080 --> 01:40:48.080]  I have yet to see a manual anywhere out there that talks about standards and practices.
[01:40:48.080 --> 01:40:52.080]  At this point, I don't know what the requirements of CPS workers are.
[01:40:52.080 --> 01:40:58.080]  I've heard some numbers that talk about $31,000, $32,000 a year as a starting pay, which is
[01:40:58.080 --> 01:41:04.080]  pretty low, and my past understanding, and I could be wrong at this, was that they had
[01:41:04.080 --> 01:41:11.080]  to have some sort of master's degree in social sciences of some sort, either in psychology
[01:41:11.080 --> 01:41:18.080]  or something of that nature, where they could then go through training programs within the
[01:41:18.080 --> 01:41:19.080]  agency.
[01:41:19.080 --> 01:41:24.080]  The problem is that the agency would train them, and these people can find better work
[01:41:24.080 --> 01:41:25.080]  elsewhere.
[01:41:25.080 --> 01:41:29.080]  Working for a law office or whatever with regards to family law issues comes to mind
[01:41:29.080 --> 01:41:30.080]  immediately.
[01:41:30.080 --> 01:41:35.080]  So how do you essentially attract people to this agency to do the right job?
[01:41:35.080 --> 01:41:38.080]  They, number one, need more transparency on how they do it.
[01:41:38.080 --> 01:41:40.080]  Where do these block grants come from?
[01:41:40.080 --> 01:41:41.080]  Where do they go to?
[01:41:41.080 --> 01:41:42.080]  Who's being paid the money?
[01:41:42.080 --> 01:41:44.080]  Why is it being paid?
[01:41:44.080 --> 01:41:50.080]  And they're all hiding this money as block grants given to the attorney general's office
[01:41:50.080 --> 01:41:55.080]  under the 4D Court Administration of Child Support, and this money is essentially being
[01:41:55.080 --> 01:42:00.080]  designated as judicial, and there's no Open Records or Public Information Act available
[01:42:00.080 --> 01:42:01.080]  on it.
[01:42:01.080 --> 01:42:03.080]  So we don't know where the money's coming from.
[01:42:03.080 --> 01:42:07.080]  We know how much is given to the state as an entirety, but we don't know who's getting
[01:42:07.080 --> 01:42:08.080]  paid this money.
[01:42:08.080 --> 01:42:14.080]  And I think that's where the dirty little secrets are happening.
[01:42:14.080 --> 01:42:16.080]  That's where all of the corruption is.
[01:42:16.080 --> 01:42:23.080]  And I'm suspicious that there's attorneys and maybe even social workers or even CPS
[01:42:23.080 --> 01:42:31.080]  workers that may be getting kickbacks in order to create this false sense of necessity with
[01:42:31.080 --> 01:42:33.080]  regards to child protection.
[01:42:33.080 --> 01:42:36.080]  So that may be part of the problem.
[01:42:36.080 --> 01:42:41.080]  So we need to have more visibility of the agency, but we also need to have some sort
[01:42:41.080 --> 01:42:48.080]  of public process in place that talks about standards and practices, and that always written
[01:42:48.080 --> 01:42:49.080]  reports need to be submitted.
[01:42:49.080 --> 01:42:55.080]  If a written report isn't submitted, their testimony should not be admissible in court.
[01:42:55.080 --> 01:43:00.080]  That's one of the things we keep hearing is that the CPS worker calls all of the parents,
[01:43:00.080 --> 01:43:06.080]  tells a story about everything's fine, and then walks into court and just totally surprises
[01:43:06.080 --> 01:43:09.080]  them by changing the story.
[01:43:09.080 --> 01:43:11.080]  And that shouldn't be allowed.
[01:43:11.080 --> 01:43:16.080]  So this contacting with these people and telling them stories over the phone should absolutely
[01:43:16.080 --> 01:43:17.080]  be prohibited.
[01:43:17.080 --> 01:43:20.080]  They should be required to submit written documents.
[01:43:20.080 --> 01:43:24.080]  But that seems to be something that the family courts in general are trying to avoid.
[01:43:24.080 --> 01:43:25.080]  They don't want any written documents.
[01:43:25.080 --> 01:43:27.080]  They don't want any track records.
[01:43:27.080 --> 01:43:31.080]  They want everybody to make a deal under mediated settlement agreement so you can't appeal
[01:43:31.080 --> 01:43:33.080]  anything.
[01:43:33.080 --> 01:43:35.080]  So that's where we're at.
[01:43:35.080 --> 01:43:36.080]  Okay.
[01:43:36.080 --> 01:43:40.080]  We're about to go to break.
[01:43:40.080 --> 01:43:44.080]  I think the thing that struck me is the transparency.
[01:43:44.080 --> 01:43:49.080]  I was going to ask how can we fix it, and we can't fix it until we can see it.
[01:43:49.080 --> 01:43:50.080]  Hang on.
[01:43:50.080 --> 01:43:52.080]  Randy Kelton, Deborah Stevens here with Ken Magnuson.
[01:43:52.080 --> 01:43:56.080]  I'll call it number 512-646-1984.
[01:43:56.080 --> 01:44:00.080]  We will be right back.
[01:44:00.080 --> 01:44:03.080]  Do you feel tired when talking about important topics like money and politics?
[01:44:03.080 --> 01:44:04.080]  Sorry.
[01:44:04.080 --> 01:44:07.080]  Are you confused by words like the Constitution or the Federal Reserve?
[01:44:07.080 --> 01:44:08.080]  What?
[01:44:08.080 --> 01:44:12.080]  If so, you may be diagnosed with the deadliest disease known today, stupidity.
[01:44:12.080 --> 01:44:14.080]  Hi.
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[01:46:05.080 --> 01:46:23.080]  Music playing.
[01:46:23.080 --> 01:46:39.080]  Music playing.
[01:46:39.080 --> 01:46:41.080]  Okay, we are back.
[01:46:41.080 --> 01:46:45.080]  Randy Kelton, Deborah Stevens, here with our special guest, Ken Magnuson.
[01:46:45.080 --> 01:46:49.080]  And when you were talking, there was one thing that really struck me.
[01:46:49.080 --> 01:46:53.080]  You asked what we can do to fix this, what is actually wrong,
[01:46:53.080 --> 01:46:57.080]  and you gave me an answer in a way I didn't expect.
[01:46:57.080 --> 01:47:05.080]  We don't know what the heck is wrong, because what's really wrong is the doors are closed.
[01:47:05.080 --> 01:47:12.080]  So we think we know what's going wrong, but we can't see it.
[01:47:12.080 --> 01:47:25.080]  So, Ken, what could we do, what would be the most likely things we could actually get done
[01:47:25.080 --> 01:47:30.080]  that would have the effect of opening these doors up for us?
[01:47:30.080 --> 01:47:36.080]  Well, the first suggestion I would have is anybody that's had a bad experience with CPS
[01:47:36.080 --> 01:47:41.080]  is to write a report and submit it before the 30th to the Sunset Advisory Commission.
[01:47:41.080 --> 01:47:45.080]  And one of the things that I would suggest, most people tell the story.
[01:47:45.080 --> 01:47:48.080]  I'm one of the few people that goes down there and I write,
[01:47:48.080 --> 01:47:52.080]  here's what I'm seeing, here's the problems we're observing,
[01:47:52.080 --> 01:47:56.080]  and here's how we need to address this in order to fix it.
[01:47:56.080 --> 01:47:59.080]  And the first thing I would say is that we need more visibility.
[01:47:59.080 --> 01:48:03.080]  The agency needs to have its policies and practices out in the public.
[01:48:03.080 --> 01:48:10.080]  There needs to be a public complaint process in which we can have hearings against CPS employees
[01:48:10.080 --> 01:48:16.080]  that have either been accused of acting in bad faith or have actually acted in bad faith
[01:48:16.080 --> 01:48:19.080]  and have some sort of process where we can complain
[01:48:19.080 --> 01:48:23.080]  and actually have some sort of actual due process hearing
[01:48:23.080 --> 01:48:27.080]  to see whether or not this person needs to be replaced on the case
[01:48:27.080 --> 01:48:29.080]  because there's bias or prejudice.
[01:48:29.080 --> 01:48:33.080]  The other issue is to review this agency more frequently.
[01:48:33.080 --> 01:48:38.080]  When three, four hundred people show up at a commission hearing for Sunset Commission,
[01:48:38.080 --> 01:48:41.080]  and we only get to do this once every twelve years,
[01:48:41.080 --> 01:48:43.080]  we're not doing it frequently enough.
[01:48:43.080 --> 01:48:48.080]  The legislature has allowed this agency to become fat, dumb, and happy,
[01:48:48.080 --> 01:48:51.080]  however you want to define that,
[01:48:51.080 --> 01:48:56.080]  and has essentially a laissez-faire attitude towards the agency
[01:48:56.080 --> 01:49:03.080]  and has failed to oversee what its actual goals and administrative policies and practices should be.
[01:49:03.080 --> 01:49:08.080]  And now the people come in and now the legislature acts like, oh, we had no idea.
[01:49:08.080 --> 01:49:13.080]  Well, that may be partially true because most of the people that I talk to that have problems
[01:49:13.080 --> 01:49:22.080]  with an issue in court or with the legislature or with agencies that the legislature oversees,
[01:49:22.080 --> 01:49:26.080]  they almost never go and talk to their state senator and state representative.
[01:49:26.080 --> 01:49:31.080]  And that's who you vote for in November, either every other year or every third year,
[01:49:31.080 --> 01:49:36.080]  depending on which precinct you may live in or which county you may live in.
[01:49:36.080 --> 01:49:40.080]  And the issue that comes to heart is you need to make a pest of yourself.
[01:49:40.080 --> 01:49:46.080]  You need to sit down and try to write what's happening in the most articulate way you can
[01:49:46.080 --> 01:49:50.080]  and try to ask those questions of why is it happening this way,
[01:49:50.080 --> 01:49:55.080]  what should be done to fix this, and where is the problem with this agency,
[01:49:55.080 --> 01:50:00.080]  and try to get your state representative involved in the process in a meaningful way.
[01:50:00.080 --> 01:50:04.080]  And I'm saying right now that the squeaky wheel gets the oil.
[01:50:04.080 --> 01:50:10.080]  The idea is to be an absolute pain in the ass and bother them and have meetings
[01:50:10.080 --> 01:50:13.080]  and talk with them and find out what they're going to do.
[01:50:13.080 --> 01:50:17.080]  When they say they're going to look into it, write them letters.
[01:50:17.080 --> 01:50:21.080]  Don't send them just emails. Emails are too easy just to ignore.
[01:50:21.080 --> 01:50:23.080]  Administrative staff looks at it.
[01:50:23.080 --> 01:50:28.080]  The intern that they just got from some junior college down the road or whatever comes in,
[01:50:28.080 --> 01:50:35.080]  and the emails end up in the, you know, to be read at some later date or century,
[01:50:35.080 --> 01:50:37.080]  and your email is never seen.
[01:50:37.080 --> 01:50:42.080]  So I suggest that people put them in an envelope, make them professional,
[01:50:42.080 --> 01:50:47.080]  very formal letters, and mail them because that's the only way you can be sure
[01:50:47.080 --> 01:50:49.080]  that they're going to take them seriously.
[01:50:49.080 --> 01:50:58.080]  And let me make a suggestion. Try to avoid talking about personalities.
[01:50:58.080 --> 01:51:04.080]  When you're in one of these situations, you have a lot of emotional issues,
[01:51:04.080 --> 01:51:11.080]  and we tend to look for someone on whom we can heap all the evils
[01:51:11.080 --> 01:51:14.080]  and then rail at in righteous indignation.
[01:51:14.080 --> 01:51:20.080]  Well, that may make us feel better. It won't help us to an outcome.
[01:51:20.080 --> 01:51:28.080]  If we have someone that's acting improperly, rather than pass judgment on the person,
[01:51:28.080 --> 01:51:38.080]  we might back up and look and say, what protections were not in place to prevent this,
[01:51:38.080 --> 01:51:44.080]  and what protections could we put in place or what changes could we make
[01:51:44.080 --> 01:51:47.080]  to keep this particular thing from happening?
[01:51:47.080 --> 01:51:51.080]  Because there's always going to be rascals out there.
[01:51:51.080 --> 01:51:58.080]  And if we find a rascal and we get all excited about the rascal and get rid of him,
[01:51:58.080 --> 01:52:02.080]  odds are we're going to get another one if we don't have a system
[01:52:02.080 --> 01:52:12.080]  that anticipates the rascal behavior and has procedures in place to prevent that from happening.
[01:52:12.080 --> 01:52:14.080]  Does that make sense, Ken?
[01:52:14.080 --> 01:52:19.080]  Well, yeah. The idea is they should have policies and practices that weed out those
[01:52:19.080 --> 01:52:21.080]  that can't do the investigations properly.
[01:52:21.080 --> 01:52:25.080]  If the individual CPS workers that are out there and may be listening to this,
[01:52:25.080 --> 01:52:28.080]  that are doing the job well, and they're going, I'm overwhelmed.
[01:52:28.080 --> 01:52:33.080]  I have, you know, 100 cases to do in a month and only 30 days to do it,
[01:52:33.080 --> 01:52:36.080]  and I don't have any resources and all of this.
[01:52:36.080 --> 01:52:40.080]  That's a problem that they need to talk to their legislators about.
[01:52:40.080 --> 01:52:42.080]  Here it is. They want to do the right job,
[01:52:42.080 --> 01:52:48.080]  and yet the agency's keeping responsibilities or requirements as far as quotas on them
[01:52:48.080 --> 01:52:53.080]  in which it's not unrealistic that they can address these issues.
[01:52:53.080 --> 01:52:55.080]  Now, that's an issue the state can address.
[01:52:55.080 --> 01:53:02.080]  We can look at it with regards to either, in some cases, believe it or not,
[01:53:02.080 --> 01:53:07.080]  when more money is required, you need to solve the problem by providing more money.
[01:53:07.080 --> 01:53:11.080]  And if more money is needed in order to hire competent people
[01:53:11.080 --> 01:53:15.080]  and then keep them properly trained and have proper oversight,
[01:53:15.080 --> 01:53:19.080]  we can weed those rascals out.
[01:53:19.080 --> 01:53:21.080]  And I almost went to Elmer Fudd right there.
[01:53:21.080 --> 01:53:28.080]  But anyway, to be able to find the bad apples
[01:53:28.080 --> 01:53:32.080]  and get rid of them before they do significant damage,
[01:53:32.080 --> 01:53:35.080]  if they've done damage or they review those cases
[01:53:35.080 --> 01:53:38.080]  and put them under an audit process of some sort,
[01:53:38.080 --> 01:53:40.080]  they can go back and reopen those cases.
[01:53:40.080 --> 01:53:44.080]  But one example that's been told to me is the appellate process right now in CPS.
[01:53:44.080 --> 01:53:48.080]  If you've been harmed by the report written by CPS,
[01:53:48.080 --> 01:53:50.080]  you ask for an appeal and it's done internally,
[01:53:50.080 --> 01:53:53.080]  you don't get to testify, you don't get to make arguments.
[01:53:53.080 --> 01:53:59.080]  It's all done in-house, secret, in some room in Austin or wherever, okay,
[01:53:59.080 --> 01:54:02.080]  Area 51 for all we know.
[01:54:02.080 --> 01:54:04.080]  And I'm being sarcastic.
[01:54:04.080 --> 01:54:07.080]  Don't get excited about that.
[01:54:07.080 --> 01:54:12.080]  In any event, the appeal process goes through,
[01:54:12.080 --> 01:54:18.080]  and if they find that there's no abuse or there's no, you know,
[01:54:18.080 --> 01:54:21.080]  there's no substance in the findings of facts or whatever,
[01:54:21.080 --> 01:54:24.080]  they're required by statute at this point in time
[01:54:24.080 --> 01:54:28.080]  to expunge those records from their servers and their files.
[01:54:28.080 --> 01:54:32.080]  And one thing I've seen in government for all the years I've looked
[01:54:32.080 --> 01:54:34.080]  is every time you see something being expunged,
[01:54:34.080 --> 01:54:38.080]  now I'm not saying don't make it available to the regular, to the normal public,
[01:54:38.080 --> 01:54:42.080]  but it still should be available five years down the road
[01:54:42.080 --> 01:54:46.080]  for the agency to be reviewing it and saying, you know,
[01:54:46.080 --> 01:54:51.080]  Ms. Jones was a really lousy CPS worker, let's see what she did in the past,
[01:54:51.080 --> 01:54:54.080]  in order for us to say, oh, boy, this is bad.
[01:54:54.080 --> 01:54:57.080]  We missed this, we missed this, we missed that.
[01:54:57.080 --> 01:55:02.080]  But if the agency has a statute that the legislature has given them
[01:55:02.080 --> 01:55:05.080]  to expunge the records and hide their sins,
[01:55:05.080 --> 01:55:07.080]  which is what I think it's there for,
[01:55:07.080 --> 01:55:09.080]  it's not to protect the identity of the kids,
[01:55:09.080 --> 01:55:15.080]  it's not to protect the parents that have had these things, you know, unfairly done.
[01:55:15.080 --> 01:55:16.080]  It's a report.
[01:55:16.080 --> 01:55:18.080]  It can be confidential within the department,
[01:55:18.080 --> 01:55:22.080]  but if things go back to family court or whatever,
[01:55:22.080 --> 01:55:26.080]  the attorneys and parties involved in that procedure
[01:55:26.080 --> 01:55:30.080]  should have availability to see how many of these reports happen
[01:55:30.080 --> 01:55:34.080]  and who participated and find out where the ball was dropped
[01:55:34.080 --> 01:55:38.080]  or to find out that the CPS worker was entirely vindicated.
[01:55:38.080 --> 01:55:42.080]  What was done was done according to practices and policies, and everything's good.
[01:55:42.080 --> 01:55:45.080]  They get the stamp of approval then.
[01:55:45.080 --> 01:55:48.080]  But hiding it, all that does, destroying the record,
[01:55:48.080 --> 01:55:52.080]  all that does is allows them to sweep a lot of dirt under the carpet,
[01:55:52.080 --> 01:55:56.080]  and then 12 years from now when we're back at Sunset Commission hearings,
[01:55:56.080 --> 01:56:01.080]  nobody will have any records of any of this, and it's all like it never happened,
[01:56:01.080 --> 01:56:09.080]  except the outcome and the harm to the family and the children and the parents will be irreversible.
[01:56:09.080 --> 01:56:17.080]  It opens the door for these individuals who shouldn't be there to act with impunity
[01:56:17.080 --> 01:56:23.080]  because in a review, it is in the agency's self-interest to show themselves in good light,
[01:56:23.080 --> 01:56:34.080]  so it's in their interest to rule in a way that covers up any improprieties on their part
[01:56:34.080 --> 01:56:40.080]  because then the evidence of those improprieties will be erased,
[01:56:40.080 --> 01:56:44.080]  and they come up with no liability.
[01:56:44.080 --> 01:56:51.080]  Right. Well, I think they're exempt from liability anywhere under sovereign immunity.
[01:56:51.080 --> 01:56:57.080]  No, I'm not talking about them being sued, but we can't go to the legislature and say,
[01:56:57.080 --> 01:57:04.080]  look how these guys have been screwing this thing up because they've erased all the records.
[01:57:04.080 --> 01:57:09.080]  Right. But that's part of what we need to see. We need to see more of that.
[01:57:09.080 --> 01:57:15.080]  We also need to see annual public hearings on this agency, and they need to do it regionally.
[01:57:15.080 --> 01:57:21.080]  When I mean regionally, there's enough people involved in these CPS reports across the state
[01:57:21.080 --> 01:57:26.080]  that they ought to have regional districts set up, and there ought to be public hearings
[01:57:26.080 --> 01:57:30.080]  in each of those regional districts at least once a year to allow people to come in
[01:57:30.080 --> 01:57:34.080]  and testify to their problems and try to get some sort of change,
[01:57:34.080 --> 01:57:39.080]  and that material needs to be then forwarded to the Sunset Advisory Commission,
[01:57:39.080 --> 01:57:43.080]  and we need to do the sunset on this agency again in three years.
[01:57:43.080 --> 01:57:52.080]  This agency is broken, and it stinks to high heaven in how it does its practices,
[01:57:52.080 --> 01:58:04.080]  and the outcome of its abuses of power will harm families in perpetuity, and that's not acceptable.
[01:58:04.080 --> 01:58:12.080]  Thank you, Ken, for being with us, and anybody out there who's had a CPS issue,
[01:58:12.080 --> 01:58:17.080]  write something to your legislators, suggest changes we can make.
[01:58:17.080 --> 01:58:24.080]  This is a place where you and I, as individuals in a state of 26 million,
[01:58:24.080 --> 01:58:31.080]  can have real, profound, and lasting changes that'll help everybody.
[01:58:31.080 --> 01:58:33.080]  Thank you all for listening.
[01:58:33.080 --> 01:58:37.080]  We'll be back tomorrow night with our four-hour info marathon.
[01:58:37.080 --> 01:58:39.080]  Make sure you tune in.
[01:58:39.080 --> 01:58:50.080]  Thank you all for listening, and good night.
[01:59:09.080 --> 01:59:33.080]  We'll see you next time.
[01:59:39.080 --> 02:00:00.080]  You're listening to the Logos Radio Network at logosradionetwork.com.