[00:00.000 --> 00:15.000]  You're listening to the Liberty Beat, your daily source for Liberty news and activist updates, online at thelibertybeat.com.
[00:15.000 --> 00:16.000]  This is Justin Armand.
[00:16.000 --> 00:18.000]  And this is Jessica Armand.
[00:18.000 --> 00:33.000]  Here with your Liberty Beat for Thursday, November 14th, 2013. Gold today at $1,285, silver at $20.74, and bitcoin is soaring at $418.
[00:33.000 --> 00:43.000]  Support for the Liberty Beat comes from Brave New Books, your local source for One World Way, Tinky Tangerine 2.0, and Clearly Filtered.
[00:43.000 --> 00:50.000]  In Austin at 1904 Guadalupe Street, and online at bravenewbookstore.com.
[00:50.000 --> 00:59.000]  Support also comes from Central Texas Gunworks CHL courses, self-defense training, and firearm sales, online at centraltexasgunworks.com.
[00:59.000 --> 01:01.000]  And now the news.
[01:01.000 --> 01:10.000]  The new controversial Common Core curriculum has led nine Hillsboro, Oregon parents to pull their children from government-run schools.
[01:10.000 --> 01:14.000]  Instead, the parents are opting to homeschool for part of the day.
[01:14.000 --> 01:29.000]  KATUTV reports that the students were once receiving A's in math, have now seen their grades plummet to D's since the new curriculum was implemented.
[01:29.000 --> 01:33.000]  Democratic senators are calling for a ban on plastic guns.
[01:33.000 --> 01:45.000]  The senators say that the need for the ban comes as 3D printing technology expands, allowing production of such weapons.
[01:45.000 --> 01:53.000]  The Newtown School shooting continues to be used by anti-gun politicians as a way to limit Second Amendment freedom.
[01:53.000 --> 02:08.000]  Swampsaw at Massachusetts selectman Barry Greenfield has proposed allowing warrantless searches of homes to see if guns are properly being stored. A public meeting on the issue is being scheduled.
[02:08.000 --> 02:18.000]  On Wednesday, WikiLeaks released the secret negotiated draft text for the entire Trans-Pacific Partnership intellectual property rights chapter.
[02:18.000 --> 02:29.000]  The TPP is one of the largest global treaties ever seen and equally controversial because of the secrecy surrounding the agreement that includes 12 different nations.
[02:29.000 --> 02:39.000]  Critics of the agreement have worried about the sovereignty of the individual nations signing on to the agreement, fears that seem to be justified with the release of the draft text.
[02:39.000 --> 02:49.000]  Within the text are measures that would create supranational tribunals to which national courts are expected to abide by.
[02:49.000 --> 03:10.000]  You've been listening to the Liberty Beat. Remember, freeing your mind is freeing our world.
[03:19.000 --> 03:47.000]  All right, bad boys, bad boys and bad girls, what are you going to do when we come for you?
[03:47.000 --> 03:56.000]  Here on the Rule of Law, tonight is Thursday, November 14th, 2013.
[03:56.000 --> 04:00.000]  I am one of your hosts, Deborah Stevens, here with Randy Kelton.
[04:00.000 --> 04:08.000]  And tonight we've got a guest for you guys and gals out there, Mr. Chris Hall of Zombie Killers Ammo and Guns.
[04:08.000 --> 04:15.000]  He's one of our sponsors. He sponsored the Logos Gun Giveaway last year for our fundraiser.
[04:15.000 --> 04:24.000]  And tonight we are going to be talking with Chris some about the ammo situation, the situation with the supply of the ammo.
[04:24.000 --> 04:30.000]  And specifically the reason I'm having him on the first topic we're going to get into,
[04:30.000 --> 04:41.000]  there has been a lot of brouhaha over the closing of the one and only, the last lead ore plant in the United States.
[04:41.000 --> 04:51.000]  All right, there was only one left that did processing, mining of new lead that comes out of the ground.
[04:51.000 --> 05:02.000]  And that has closed. And so there's been kind of a lot of hand wringing and brow wiping and fretting and worrying about,
[05:02.000 --> 05:06.000]  well, what does this mean for the ammo supply? Are we done for?
[05:06.000 --> 05:11.000]  Are the price is going to go out the roof because of this and all of this and that?
[05:11.000 --> 05:17.000]  And so I've kind of suspected that it wasn't really going to be all that bad of a deal.
[05:17.000 --> 05:22.000]  But I wanted to get Chris's take on it. We talked about this a little bit last week.
[05:22.000 --> 05:25.000]  So Chris, welcome to the show. Thank you for coming on.
[05:25.000 --> 05:35.000]  And can you please give us your take as a firearms dealer and an ammo dealer on just what the reality is behind the closing of this plant?
[05:35.000 --> 05:39.000]  Is it really that big of a deal? Is it something that we really shouldn't be too concerned about?
[05:39.000 --> 05:46.000]  I mean, I'm sure it will probably affect the price of some, but is it a major crisis or not really?
[05:46.000 --> 05:48.000]  Can you please give us your take on this?
[05:48.000 --> 05:57.000]  Well, thanks for having me as usual. Honestly, the new lead is not really used for ammunition.
[05:57.000 --> 06:01.000]  It's too soft. It's mixed with other stuff.
[06:01.000 --> 06:11.000]  And so a lot of times they'll use recycled lead, mostly from car batteries is where the majority of the ballistic lead comes from that we use.
[06:11.000 --> 06:16.000]  And it's also shift. We get a lot of it shipped into the United States.
[06:16.000 --> 06:24.000]  So the whole thing of having the actual smelting doesn't really affect us that much here in the United States.
[06:24.000 --> 06:35.000]  Now, obviously, there could be a price increase, but we have tons and tons of car batteries that are used for that kind of lead.
[06:35.000 --> 06:42.000]  So I honestly don't think this will be an issue. I've seen more price of brass going up. That becomes an issue.
[06:42.000 --> 06:46.000]  But this one's not really that big of a deal.
[06:46.000 --> 06:57.000]  Okay. That's kind of what I figured. Now, you were telling me the other night that from what you've seen, we're importing most of our new lead anyway. Is that right?
[06:57.000 --> 07:08.000]  Yeah. And we're down here in Corpus Christi. So we see a lot of what comes in and out of the ports and what's shipped and what the shipping containers are carrying and the people who are transporting this stuff.
[07:08.000 --> 07:20.000]  And actually, we had an 18-wheeler have an accident just recently that was carrying like tons and tons of ingots of lead that had been brought in.
[07:20.000 --> 07:31.000]  I think it came from Brazil. I'm not real sure exactly what location it came from, but we bring so much of the raw goods in anymore.
[07:31.000 --> 07:38.000]  We don't even make our own steel, except for the smaller gauges of steel in the United States.
[07:38.000 --> 07:47.000]  China, Japan, Germany, they make most of our steel as it is for the heavier two inches, three inches and stuff like that.
[07:47.000 --> 08:02.000]  So it's really – yes, there's a lot of legislation that has changed. And yes, it's an end around by the EPA to put a damper on ammunition and firearm sales.
[08:02.000 --> 08:06.000]  But no, it's not going to really have that big of an effect.
[08:06.000 --> 08:20.000]  Okay. Yes, that's kind of what I figured. Now, speaking of this EPA stuff, this is something else that we discussed the other night. Can you tell us just what the big excuse is that the EPA has given to shut down this plant?
[08:20.000 --> 08:34.000]  And how is the EPA – what are these EPA standards? How is this affecting ammunition supply and use in other states, you know, in states that are clamping down on this as well?
[08:34.000 --> 08:41.000]  Well, the big thing that the EPA used for the smelting plant was air quality conditions.
[08:41.000 --> 08:51.000]  And if somebody has plans to build a modern-day smelting, this place has been in business since, like, 34. They've been there forever in a day.
[08:51.000 --> 08:54.000]  They just couldn't keep up with the new regulations.
[08:54.000 --> 09:12.000]  However, California just recently banned the use of lead ammunition in practice and hunting. So you won't be able to even purchase lead ammunition in California, which they're already having problems with animals coming into the cities and things like that.
[09:12.000 --> 09:28.000]  So, you know, we've got to stop these worries about this little stuff because they say, oh, that's the condors. Well, a lot of the Parks and Wildlife has done checks and could not find a correlation.
[09:28.000 --> 09:42.000]  Yeah. Okay. So let's explain this a little bit more. The state of California has just recently banned the use of lead ammunition for practice and hunting. That's pretty serious.
[09:42.000 --> 09:50.000]  Okay. Because ammunition that's not made from lead can be pretty expensive that has no lead in it at all.
[09:50.000 --> 10:03.000]  So now you mentioned the condors. Give us the scoop. What is the big excuse that the state of California is using for banning lead for practice and hunting?
[10:03.000 --> 10:21.000]  Well, what they're saying is that the hunters, when they field dress the animal, are leaving the lead slug in the pile and the scavengers eat that lead and they're exposed to lead and then it causes problems reproductively.
[10:21.000 --> 10:34.000]  It happens with humans. That's the reason we banned lead and paint. Excuse me. But there hasn't been enough statistical evidence to prove that that's really what's causing it.
[10:34.000 --> 10:45.000]  I mean, human beings have been eating stuff that's been killed with lead for hundreds of years now. And I don't know. I just don't think that there's the evidence there involved.
[10:45.000 --> 11:03.000]  But it does do a big thing to the firearms industry because now the full copper ammunition and ammunition used for hunting migratory birds is typically three times more expensive than the normal lead ammunition.
[11:03.000 --> 11:11.000]  And it's not as heavy and doesn't have the same ballistics as the lead ammunition does.
[11:11.000 --> 11:24.000]  Right. Right. So all right. So what do you foresee? Actually, well, let's back up here. The last time we had you on, we were in the midst of basically an ammunition drought.
[11:24.000 --> 11:40.000]  And there was a lot of hand wringing and brow fretting over that. Everyone was quite concerned because it was almost impossible to get certain caliber of ammunition and what you could get was just extremely expensive.
[11:40.000 --> 11:50.000]  It's looking to me like that's starting to ease up a bit. So can you please give us a breakdown of what's been happening over the last few months in that regard?
[11:50.000 --> 11:59.000]  And what do you see coming in the future as far as supply and what the factors are that are going to be affecting the prices?
[11:59.000 --> 12:06.000]  Right now, shotgun ammunition is pretty much prevalent. You can find it all over the place.
[12:06.000 --> 12:15.000]  Because of hunting season through most of the nation, you can get a lot of the hunting calibers,.30-06,.243,.223.
[12:15.000 --> 12:24.000]  But the manufacturers knew this. They knew that these times were coming and they didn't change their schedule because there was a whole lot of purchase.
[12:24.000 --> 12:41.000]  A lot of the self-defense ammo, the.380, a lot of the rimfire ammunition, I honestly don't think that we're going to start seeing that back in the stores in large quantities until probably early spring, somewhere around there.
[12:41.000 --> 12:54.000]  It really, unfortunately, it's not going to affect the main thing. It's only going to affect those specific calibers, which are typically the.380s in the rimfires.
[12:54.000 --> 13:05.000]  All right. So what are the factors? You were telling me that there's some factors that will be affecting the price of ammo much more than the closing of this lead ore plant.
[13:05.000 --> 13:10.000]  What are those factors? What's going on? What should we see coming up?
[13:10.000 --> 13:18.000]  Well, the new manufacturer brass has always been the main thing that affects the price of ammunition.
[13:18.000 --> 13:25.000]  Because the brass is reloadable. So a lot of the reloaders, they covet the brass ammunition.
[13:25.000 --> 13:38.000]  The steel ammunition, on the other hand, a lot of people don't like shooting it because it can damage a firearm after a thousand, three thousand, ten thousand rounds, depending on the gun and things like that.
[13:38.000 --> 13:50.000]  I don't see a whole lot of change. I know they're trying to push the prices up and I'm starting to see rimfire be closer to the price of nine millimeter.
[13:50.000 --> 13:56.000]  But rimfire rounds are not reloadable. So they're a single use.
[13:56.000 --> 14:11.000]  I would honestly say if you use a lot of rimfire to convert over to either the.223 that you can reload yourself or the.22 Hornet that you can reload yourself and start reload.
[14:11.000 --> 14:17.000]  Try to save as much of the brass as you can because it's the only way that you're going to mitigate your costs if you shoot a lot.
[14:17.000 --> 14:43.000]  Right. Exactly. Exactly. Well, this is to me, this seems like pretty good news. And I know for myself, I have seen, you know, the self-defense calibers like 380 and nine millimeter, you know, these somewhat lower calibers of like safer for pistols that would be considered that you could have for concealed carry and things like that.
[14:43.000 --> 14:51.000]  And I've seen that reappearing in the stores around here in Austin. So I take that as a good sign and the prices are pretty reasonable too.
[14:51.000 --> 15:12.000]  Well, one of the big things that you will see a change on though is because of the importation bans, you're not going to see a lot of the surplus ammunition coming back where you could buy 500 rounds of old nine millimeter ammo or a thousand rounds of 7.62 by 54R or.30.6 from Korea.
[15:12.000 --> 15:19.000]  Because the new executive orders is going to be affecting the importation of this kind of stuff.
[15:19.000 --> 15:48.000]  I honestly think that you'll start seeing a lot of the surplus guns dry up, the AK-47s, the Mosin-Nagant, the stuff that, you know, they're World War II. Most people think, oh, no big deal. But you'd be surprised how many people have these guns because they don't break. And I don't think you're going to see a big supply of them coming in. So the prices of those is going to start going up.
[15:48.000 --> 15:56.000]  Right. And they kind of already have. Right now it's even difficult to find AK-47s from what I've seen.
[15:56.000 --> 16:20.000]  Yeah. And the thing was, you used to be able to get a decent AK for 300 bucks. And now they're staying right around the $550, $600 range. You can still get the Mosins. Their price has gone up. They were originally 100 bucks. Now they're looking at about $135.
[16:20.000 --> 16:34.000]  Luckily, about the only good thing that I've seen out of this whole big mess is all the manufacturers have decided that they need to build as many AR-15s as they can. So if you're looking for a cheap AR-15, they're coming up.
[16:34.000 --> 17:00.000]  That's excellent news. All right. We are heading into a break here. Folks, if you have questions about firearms, firearms ammunition, any kind of questions, gun laws for our guest, Chris Hall, you can call in 512-646-1984. We're going to have them for a few more segments. And we will be right back on the other side.
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[19:01.000 --> 19:11.000]  You are listening to the Logos Radio Network, the LogosRadioNetwork.com.
[19:31.000 --> 19:53.000]  Okay, folks, we are back. This is the Rule of Law, Randy Kelton, Deborah Stevens. We're here with our guest, Chris Hall, Zombie Killers Ammo and Guns in Corpus Christi, and we're breaking down the situation with ammo and the supply and the pricing and all of that.
[19:53.000 --> 20:13.000]  You know, Chris had mentioned to me the other night that because of this importation ban coming up that that's going to affect the preppers more than people who just buy, you know, a few boxes here and there, people that want to buy cases of it for long-term storage may be more affected by that.
[20:13.000 --> 20:26.000]  So just be aware of that, folks. You may want to, if you're a prepper, if you're into storing up thousands of rounds and this sort of thing, you may want to get moving on stocking up before this all comes into effect.
[20:26.000 --> 20:44.000]  Chris, you wanted to discuss something that you saw today in the news concerning, you know, something that's going on in your area and also Dallas and something about a bank that they're saying don't go to the bank tomorrow or something like that.
[20:44.000 --> 20:46.000]  Can you please break that down?
[20:46.000 --> 21:06.000]  Well, obviously it's part of the rumor mill, but anonymous came out on Facebook posting that there has been a lot of police activity at a bank building in Los Angeles and that the owners of the bank building had changed their insurance policies to only cover catastrophic failures.
[21:06.000 --> 21:30.000]  So I would tell people that are listening to go search this because just like we had the deal in Boston, just like we had the deal in Dallas just recently where we had an awful lot of the police presence doing these staged events, they put it much better than I could.
[21:30.000 --> 21:49.000]  But you might want to look into it. You might not want to be at this particular bank building because they're worried that a false flag is about to occur, just like 9-11 where we were going to lose a major banking building because right now the administration needs a pretty good distraction and I'm sure that that would make it.
[21:49.000 --> 21:54.000]  Now which bank building is this in Los Angeles?
[21:54.000 --> 22:02.000]  I can't remember off the top of my head, but it was 444 Flower or something.
[22:02.000 --> 22:10.000]  I'd have to look it up again. I just recently read it and went, oh crap, people need to know about that.
[22:10.000 --> 22:17.000]  Yeah, well maybe on the next break we can look that up. So now you said something about Dallas, so what's up with that?
[22:17.000 --> 22:28.000]  Well, a lot of people, especially locally, should know that there was a huge law enforcement staged event. They had a lot of people together.
[22:28.000 --> 22:38.000]  They were going to be doing active shooter scenarios and the whole spiel using the helicopters and blah blah blah.
[22:38.000 --> 22:53.000]  I honestly think that they're trying to get people used to seeing this kind of stuff because I know I would be freaking out if I looked up and saw half a dozen helicopters trying to do touch-off and land.
[22:53.000 --> 23:06.000]  I'm hoping that I'm just freaking out and not really paying attention to what I should be paying attention to, but there's an awful lot of stuff coming down the pike right now that is very disturbing.
[23:06.000 --> 23:15.000]  Okay, well I wanted to get into this LAX shooting and your analysis of that, but before we go into the analysis of what happened there,
[23:15.000 --> 23:21.000]  because it's quite interesting, we discussed this the other night on the phone, we do have a couple of callers that are on topic.
[23:21.000 --> 23:30.000]  I'm going to go first to Russ in Texas. Russ, thank you for calling in. What is your question or comment for our guest Chris Hall tonight?
[23:30.000 --> 23:38.000]  Well, it's kind of a question for both you and Chris. I came across a very interesting case on firearms.
[23:38.000 --> 23:54.000]  The fellow's name was Rod Clast and he was traveling in Washington D.C. and he was pulled over and he had a pistol and I believe he had a rifle in his truck because he's a private attorney general and a bounty hunter.
[23:54.000 --> 24:11.000]  The U.S. Marshals were called out and the Washington D.C. police, he had about six cops there and U.S. Marshals and they charged him with a firearms charge and he said no, a pistol and a rifle are not firearms.
[24:11.000 --> 24:31.000]  And so he actually got slapped with a lawsuit and got thrown in jail and he proceeded to go in front of a grand jury and he's one of the very first people who went in front of a grand jury and is arguing the fact that a pistol and a rifle are not considered firearms.
[24:31.000 --> 24:44.000]  And that comes from the 1934 National Firearms Act and also a Supreme Court decision which said a pistol and a rifle are not firearms.
[24:44.000 --> 24:49.000]  And I'm just curious, are you all aware of what the definition of a firearm is?
[24:49.000 --> 25:11.000]  I am from the ATF standpoint. The ATF standpoint basically says anything that's projected from the end of a barrel that is projected with gas, expanding gases, black powder or explosives can be classified as a firearm, section 18 something.
[25:11.000 --> 25:21.000]  That is actually in Title 18, Section 921 and that is where they are arresting people for firearms.
[25:21.000 --> 25:36.000]  But if you look in the footnotes, Deborah, if you go to the actual law books and look at the footnote, it says in the footnote that Title 18, Section 921 comes from the 1968 Gun Control Act.
[25:36.000 --> 25:47.000]  In the footnote it says nothing in this Act can be construed to change any of the terms in the 1934 National Firearms Act.
[25:47.000 --> 26:06.000]  And that 1934 National Firearms Act says a firearm is one of four things, a sawed-off shotgun less than 18 inches, a fully automatic rifle and a silencer.
[26:06.000 --> 26:27.000]  Those are the four categories defined in the National Firearms Act. So basically he testified in front of a grand jury and really frustrated the attorneys because the attorneys knew what he was talking about and he went in front of actual people who had never heard that definition.
[26:27.000 --> 26:43.000]  And so I think there's going to be a ruling coming down in this case very quickly, like within the next week. And I went and did a lot of research and even the Supreme Court says a pistol and a rifle are not considered a firearm.
[26:43.000 --> 26:58.000]  And you just, I guarantee you there's a bunch of ATF guys out there greeting their teach right now. What was the name of the gentleman again? Rod, R-O-D, Class, T-L-E-S-S.
[26:58.000 --> 27:10.000]  Rod Class is relatively well known in the legal reform movement. He's been around a long time and he is really an excellent researcher.
[27:10.000 --> 27:35.000]  Yeah. So basically in Title 18, Section 921 is where they're charging people and that comes from the 1968 Firearms Act. He says read the footnotes of that 1968 act in the book because it says that, you know, in the footnotes it says nothing in this act is going to change anything in the 1934 National Firearms Act,
[27:35.000 --> 27:48.000]  it just says a firearm is a sawed-off shotgun, a rifle shorter than 16 inches, and a fully automatic rifle and a silencer. Those are the only four firearms definitions.
[27:48.000 --> 28:05.000]  It also goes back to the Dick Act of 1902 as well. So those trump Title 18, Section 921, which is what they're charging people for firearms, and he's blowing the lid on that case. That's awesome.
[28:05.000 --> 28:20.000]  There are some other issues as well. In Texas, there are some different definitions of firearms also and some types of pistols are not considered firearms. Chris, we talked about that the other night. You want to explain about that?
[28:20.000 --> 28:28.000]  Correct. And that follows federal law as well. A black powder pistol is not considered a firearm.
[28:28.000 --> 28:32.000]  Now tell us what a black powder pistol is.
[28:32.000 --> 28:45.000]  That would be a percussion cap and ball pistol. And you can legally open or concealed carry that pistol in the state of Texas, and it's not a firearm.
[28:45.000 --> 28:54.000]  So you can't get in trouble for violating the concealed carry law. You can't get in trouble for violating open carry laws.
[28:54.000 --> 29:02.000]  And so far, the only place that I've seen they actually have a problem with that is the Austin Capitol DPS.
[29:02.000 --> 29:19.000]  Right. I was going to say there's video of these people getting tackled. And, you know, as we discussed the other night, it's not enough for people to just fight these bogus charges and beat the case and have a successful defense.
[29:19.000 --> 29:31.000]  That's not enough. If we want to stop the madness, we're going to have to go on the offense and start suing these people into oblivion, personally suing them.
[29:31.000 --> 29:41.000]  Randy likes to go after them from the criminal side. I'm all for that. But I don't think that's enough. We've got to start suing them into oblivion.
[29:41.000 --> 29:45.000]  That gets their attention. Both ways get their attention. We've got to hit them from both angles.
[29:45.000 --> 29:49.000]  All right. Listen, folks, we are going to break. Russ, do you want to hang on to the other side?
[29:49.000 --> 29:50.000]  Yeah.
[29:50.000 --> 30:01.000]  Okay. All right. We're going to go back to Russ on the other side. We've got other callers as well. Doug, Alex and more. We'll be right back.
[30:01.000 --> 30:06.000]  Bad economic times are hurting more than employment. They're also hurting education.
[30:06.000 --> 30:15.000]  Now some schools are dropping Fridays and offering four-day school weeks instead. I'm Dr. Catherine Albrecht, and I'll be back to describe the trend.
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[30:45.000 --> 30:54.000]  In Chicago, educators want to add school days to prepare kids for today's competitive workplace. But in the rural West, schools are going the other way.
[30:54.000 --> 31:05.000]  They're dropping classes on Fridays due to budget cuts. From South Dakota to Colorado, districts are moving to a four-day week to save money for programs like after school sports.
[31:05.000 --> 31:14.000]  To soften the blow, some schools are lengthening the four remaining days and shortening lunch breaks. If kids spend that fifth day doing something productive, I'm all for it.
[31:14.000 --> 31:18.000]  Who knows? Maybe parents will take over where the schools leave off.
[31:18.000 --> 31:30.000]  I'm Dr. Catherine Albrecht. More news and information at CatherineAlbrecht.com.
[31:30.000 --> 31:36.000]  This is Building 7, a 47-story skyscraper that fell on the afternoon of September 11.
[31:36.000 --> 31:43.000]  The government says that fire brought it down. However, 1,500 architects and engineers concluded it was a controlled demolition.
[31:43.000 --> 31:48.000]  Over 6,000 of my fellow service members have given their lives. Thousands of my fellow first responders are dying.
[31:48.000 --> 31:57.000]  I'm not a conspiracy theorist. I'm a structural engineer. I'm a New York City correction officer. I'm an Air Force pilot. I'm a father who lost his son. We're Americans, and we deserve the truth.
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[33:11.000 --> 33:26.000]  Okay, folks, we are back. This is the Rule of Law, Randy Kelton and Deborah Stevens.
[33:26.000 --> 33:34.000]  We're here with our guest, Chris Hall, from Zombie Killers Ammo and Guns in Corpus Christi, and we're discussing various firearms issues.
[33:34.000 --> 33:54.000]  And right now we're discussing the black powder pistol and other firearms that are technically not firearms as far as the legal definition is concerned, perhaps in our common layman's vernacular we would call them a firearm, but under the definition of law they are not.
[33:54.000 --> 34:20.000]  And these legal issues involving this, and as Chris was saying, and Russ, we're going to get right back to you, but I wanted to bring Randy and he had a comment, like Chris was saying, the only people that seem to have a problem with this, or some of the people that seem to have a problem with this, are the DPS troopers on the Capitol grounds here in Austin, the state Capitol grounds.
[34:20.000 --> 34:25.000]  So now, Randy, you had a couple of comments about these black powder pistols?
[34:25.000 --> 34:35.000]  Yeah, first about the false flag in California, just do a search for California false flag bank and you'll get hits right on it.
[34:35.000 --> 34:38.000]  Okay, good. Now what were you going to say about the black powder pistols?
[34:38.000 --> 34:59.000]  Black powder. I have some friends with a black powder club, and if you have never seen a black powder pistol go off, it is a treat. I would never want one to go off pointing at me, because they belch fire and smoke six feet out the end of them.
[34:59.000 --> 35:27.000]  It would scare me to death, even if he didn't hit me with that chunk of lead that comes out of them. But, well, I have read a story about here in Wise County about some Indians chasing a 16 year old girl down and they caught her in front of a neighbor's house and shot her in the back with these black powder pistols and set her clothes on fire.
[35:27.000 --> 35:33.000]  But these guys did do the black powder shootout and they were challenged by the National Guard.
[35:33.000 --> 35:37.000]  This is a shooting club you're talking about?
[35:37.000 --> 35:38.000]  Yes, a black powder shooting club.
[35:38.000 --> 35:40.000]  This is in Wise County?
[35:40.000 --> 35:41.000]  Yes.
[35:41.000 --> 35:49.000]  Okay, so they were challenged to a shootoff by the National Guard and what happened?
[35:49.000 --> 36:04.000]  Well, they beat the National Guard in terms of accuracy at 50 yards and then just to make things more interesting, they moved the targets out to 100 yards.
[36:04.000 --> 36:13.000]  The National Guard couldn't reach them with their M16s and the black powder guys tore those targets up.
[36:13.000 --> 36:20.000]  These long guns at 100 yards for them was nothing.
[36:20.000 --> 36:26.000]  You're talking about the ball that comes out of those things. That's a big round ball.
[36:26.000 --> 36:35.000]  You get hit with a nine millimeter or even an M16 at any kind of near range and it'll punch a little hole right through you.
[36:35.000 --> 36:42.000]  That black powder is not going to, that ball coming out of that black powder weapon is not going to punch any hole through you.
[36:42.000 --> 36:47.000]  It's going to snatch you up off the ground and throw you backwards. You'll land on your head over there.
[36:47.000 --> 36:52.000]  Don't know if it'll kill you or not, but it's going to take you down.
[36:52.000 --> 36:57.000]  Yeah, Chris, weren't you saying that it's actually three quarters of an inch in diameter?
[36:57.000 --> 37:05.000]  Yes, and that's the thing that most people don't understand is these weapons were designed to take down very, very large game.
[37:05.000 --> 37:13.000]  You're talking about a bison. The Minuet ball, which is a French lead ball, is a Sabbath round.
[37:13.000 --> 37:18.000]  Hornaday makes awesome modern day versions of it.
[37:18.000 --> 37:32.000]  These things are no joke, man. They're like a slug out of a 12 gauge shotgun, but you're taking a shot 100, 175 yards out and putting it in a pretty accurate, well, pretty accurate.
[37:32.000 --> 37:39.000]  You can do a quarter of a minute of angle if you know what you're doing, which is very accurate.
[37:39.000 --> 37:43.000]  That would be like having a custom built AR-15.
[37:43.000 --> 37:45.000]  Wow.
[37:45.000 --> 37:58.000]  I read a story about the fight at Adobe walls. That's up in the flat out west and south of Amarillo.
[37:58.000 --> 38:12.000]  There was an old Adobe, some old Adobe buildings, and there were some buffalo hunters there and they used, this 1860s, they used black powder weapons.
[38:12.000 --> 38:20.000]  And I read the story from both the Indian side, from a German kid who had been taken by the Indians and was there with the Comanche.
[38:20.000 --> 38:29.000]  And from the white guy's side, well, Bat Masterson was there, but he didn't play a part.
[38:29.000 --> 38:34.000]  Well, they got in this big fight and everybody told the story exactly the same.
[38:34.000 --> 38:40.000]  The Indians backed away and they're up on top of a hill and an 18 year old kid was the best shot.
[38:40.000 --> 38:47.000]  And they saw these three Indians sitting up there on the rise and they asked him if he thought he could hit one of them.
[38:47.000 --> 38:52.000]  And he said he could try. And he set up and got his windage and fired.
[38:52.000 --> 38:58.000]  And he said it took, what, almost a minute, and then one of the Indians fell.
[38:58.000 --> 38:59.000]  Wow.
[38:59.000 --> 39:07.000]  When the Indians told it, they were there discussing what to do next.
[39:07.000 --> 39:11.000]  And one of the guys' head exploded.
[39:11.000 --> 39:15.000]  They never heard the report of the weapon.
[39:15.000 --> 39:17.000]  That's how far away he was.
[39:17.000 --> 39:18.000]  Amazing.
[39:18.000 --> 39:21.000]  And they took that as an omen.
[39:21.000 --> 39:23.000]  Let's get the heck out of here.
[39:23.000 --> 39:26.000]  All right. Well, listen, let's go back to our callers.
[39:26.000 --> 39:29.000]  We've got Russ from Texas that had some more to say.
[39:29.000 --> 39:32.000]  Russ, what else you got for us?
[39:32.000 --> 39:40.000]  Yeah, I just wanted to tell your listeners the section of the USP code where they can find the definition of firearm.
[39:40.000 --> 39:49.000]  You can look up 1934 Firearms Act or you can look up 26 USC, which is U.S. code, 5845.
[39:49.000 --> 39:53.000]  And you're going to recognize Title 26 as the tax code.
[39:53.000 --> 39:56.000]  And you're going to think, what in the heck is firearms doing in the tax code?
[39:56.000 --> 40:04.000]  Well, you know, in 1934, when the act was passed, it was during the time of Al Capone and Prohibition and the gang.
[40:04.000 --> 40:09.000]  And they used to stall off their shotguns and stall off their rifles and throw them underneath their trench coats.
[40:09.000 --> 40:16.000]  So the way to counteract that, they went after them for tax fraud for not having tax stamps on their guns.
[40:16.000 --> 40:22.000]  They were supposed to go take their guns in and get paid their 200 bucks and get a tax stamp.
[40:22.000 --> 40:31.000]  And, you know, the Firearms Act is not making stall off shotguns and stall off rifles and fully automatic rifles illegal.
[40:31.000 --> 40:33.000]  They're just saying you need a tax stamp.
[40:33.000 --> 40:38.000]  You need to go pay your 200 bucks and register it and get a tax stamp.
[40:38.000 --> 40:40.000]  And back then, 200 bucks was a lot of money.
[40:40.000 --> 40:42.000]  But that's the thing that really kills me.
[40:42.000 --> 40:49.000]  In Miller versus the Supreme Court, the attorney didn't show up and Miller didn't show up.
[40:49.000 --> 40:53.000]  But they argued that a sawed-off shotgun was a militia weapon.
[40:53.000 --> 40:58.000]  And the court says, well, it's not a militia weapon.
[40:58.000 --> 41:06.000]  But since we've had World War II and the trench warfare, the trench warfare, one of the best weapons out there was the Browning A5.
[41:06.000 --> 41:13.000]  And the Remington and both of those were very short shotguns shooting buckshot.
[41:13.000 --> 41:19.000]  And the Germans had an absolute fit trying to get those guns.
[41:19.000 --> 41:21.000]  You're right.
[41:21.000 --> 41:25.000]  And, you know, I guess the last point I want to make is I've been using that term wrong.
[41:25.000 --> 41:27.000]  I've been calling everything a firearm.
[41:27.000 --> 41:33.000]  And, Deb, I've listened to your archives and I've heard you say it a lot in the past as well.
[41:33.000 --> 41:36.000]  So I've got to correct the way I use that term.
[41:36.000 --> 41:39.000]  I'm using pistol and rifle from here on out.
[41:39.000 --> 41:43.000]  And even a handgun, a handgun is defined as a firearm.
[41:43.000 --> 41:48.000]  So please don't use the term handgun when referring to your pistol.
[41:48.000 --> 41:50.000]  Yes, it's absolutely true.
[41:50.000 --> 42:00.000]  This is how they wrap people up into these commercial agreements to be regulated is with terms that we use in common vernacular.
[42:00.000 --> 42:10.000]  And they take them and they turn them into a legal definition, okay, into a definition that is in the statute or in the regulations.
[42:10.000 --> 42:18.000]  And so if you start using those terms and not realizing that they are specific words that are defined in the statute and the code,
[42:18.000 --> 42:20.000]  well, then you've just agreed to be regulated.
[42:20.000 --> 42:21.000]  You just got nailed.
[42:21.000 --> 42:27.000]  And as far as the Al Capone thing, you know, what I would say, well, same thing that Harmon Taylor would say.
[42:27.000 --> 42:30.000]  It's like, well, did he agree to be a taxpayer or not?
[42:30.000 --> 42:39.000]  Because if he's not a taxpayer, then that statute does not apply to him that would require this tax stamp.
[42:39.000 --> 42:41.000]  All right, it doesn't matter.
[42:41.000 --> 42:44.000]  If you're not a taxpayer, then the statute doesn't apply to you.
[42:44.000 --> 42:46.000]  Everything is by commercial agreement.
[42:46.000 --> 42:49.000]  If you've agreed to be regulated, it applies to you.
[42:49.000 --> 42:52.000]  If you have not agreed to be regulated, the law just doesn't apply to you.
[42:52.000 --> 42:54.000]  It's just that simple.
[42:54.000 --> 43:01.000]  And so I don't really know, I mean, I know that they finally ended up taking him down for tax evasion,
[43:01.000 --> 43:07.000]  probably because his lawyers didn't understand this principle and they probably called him a taxpayer, you know.
[43:07.000 --> 43:14.000]  But if you just stick to your guns, so to speak, no pun intended, and say, I'm not a taxpayer.
[43:14.000 --> 43:17.000]  I don't have to get that tax stamp.
[43:17.000 --> 43:18.000]  Shove it.
[43:18.000 --> 43:24.000]  Well, that's another thing I've been reading a lot of information for about taxes.
[43:24.000 --> 43:27.000]  There's no law that says you're required to pay taxes.
[43:27.000 --> 43:28.000]  No, of course not.
[43:28.000 --> 43:33.000]  And if you can't prove that there's a, that's the whole thing.
[43:33.000 --> 43:35.000]  What statute have I violated?
[43:35.000 --> 43:41.000]  Well, the thing is, and we've talked about this before, if you've agreed that you are a taxpayer,
[43:41.000 --> 43:48.000]  then the whole Title 26 applies to you and they can go after you for willful failure to file if you didn't file.
[43:48.000 --> 43:52.000]  But if you have not agreed, then no, there's no requirement upon you.
[43:52.000 --> 43:56.000]  Russ, thank you for calling.
[43:56.000 --> 44:00.000]  We'll be right back.
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[46:22.000 --> 46:48.000]  Alright, watching the sparks fly, or in the case of the black powder pistols, it's like watching the smoke and fire fly, which we've been talking about.
[46:48.000 --> 46:54.000]  We've been talking about definitions in law and whether you've agreed to be regulated or not.
[46:54.000 --> 46:57.000]  And just briefly, we'll go over the taxpayer issue.
[46:57.000 --> 47:07.000]  Chris was saying on the break that from his research, and he's absolutely true, there's no requirement to file or pay taxes as far as the IRS is concerned.
[47:07.000 --> 47:08.000]  That's true.
[47:08.000 --> 47:14.000]  Even one of the head commissioners of the IRS recently testified to Congress that it is a voluntary system.
[47:14.000 --> 47:15.000]  That is true.
[47:15.000 --> 47:20.000]  Well, then how come so many people are taken down for willful failure to file and this sort of thing?
[47:20.000 --> 47:23.000]  Well, it's because they've agreed.
[47:23.000 --> 47:25.000]  They have agreed to be regulated.
[47:25.000 --> 47:27.000]  They have agreed that they are taxpayers.
[47:27.000 --> 47:32.000]  If you have agreed that you're a taxpayer, then the whole of Title 26 applies to you.
[47:32.000 --> 47:35.000]  And yes, you've agreed that you would file and all this sort of thing.
[47:35.000 --> 47:39.000]  So if you don't, they can go after you for willful failure to file.
[47:39.000 --> 47:48.000]  Now, most people have ensnared themselves in dozens if not hundreds of ways of an agreement that says that they are a taxpayer.
[47:48.000 --> 47:55.000]  And so if you've agreed that you're a taxpayer, you can't just go and say, oh, well, I'm not required to file.
[47:55.000 --> 47:56.000]  Oh, yes, you are.
[47:56.000 --> 47:58.000]  You are required to file.
[47:58.000 --> 48:03.000]  You're required to do everything they say under that statute if you've agreed that you're a taxpayer.
[48:03.000 --> 48:09.000]  And if you don't want to be a taxpayer anymore, that is a long, arduous task that could take years.
[48:09.000 --> 48:11.000]  You have to look at everything in your life.
[48:11.000 --> 48:15.000]  And that is something that we're not going to get into right now.
[48:15.000 --> 48:22.000]  If that's something that you're more, that you have some interest in, I would recommend contacting Mr. Harmon Taylor.
[48:22.000 --> 48:26.000]  And you can, he has given out his email address.
[48:26.000 --> 48:34.000]  That is legal underscore reality at earthlink.net. And you can sign up for his email list.
[48:34.000 --> 48:37.000]  He writes articles and sends them out to the email list.
[48:37.000 --> 48:49.000]  But along that same lines, along those same lines, we were discussing about this, what they are going after people for right now concerning rudely displaying a firearm.
[48:49.000 --> 48:56.000]  And one thing that a lot of people are fighting on this is saying, well, it's not really displaying.
[48:56.000 --> 49:02.000]  Well, it doesn't matter if you're really displaying it or not, if it's not a firearm.
[49:02.000 --> 49:05.000]  OK, so we need to first things first.
[49:05.000 --> 49:09.000]  It's not a firearm, all right, when you're talking about the black powder pistols.
[49:09.000 --> 49:16.000]  But also along those same lines, let's assume it is a firearm for a second, according to the statute.
[49:16.000 --> 49:18.000]  Let's just say, for example, it is.
[49:18.000 --> 49:21.000]  Well, guess what? Even that doesn't matter.
[49:21.000 --> 49:32.000]  Even if you are quote rudely displaying it, if you have not been, if you have not agreed to be regulated by those laws and by those regulations.
[49:32.000 --> 49:40.000]  Now, of course, if you have purchased the quote firearm from a federal firearms license dealer, like Mr.
[49:40.000 --> 49:44.000]  Chris Hall here, our guest, and you paid federal reserve notes for them.
[49:44.000 --> 49:46.000]  Well, then guess what? You just agreed to be regulated.
[49:46.000 --> 49:56.000]  OK, so the only way that you could say I never agreed to be regulated by that is you would have to purchase the weapon from someone
[49:56.000 --> 50:03.000]  who is not a licensed federal firearms dealer and not purchase the item with federal reserve notes, purchase it with something else.
[50:03.000 --> 50:07.000]  I don't care if it's a bag of salt or gold, silver, whatever it is.
[50:07.000 --> 50:14.000]  But these are ways that people ensnare themselves into being regulated without realizing it.
[50:14.000 --> 50:25.000]  And so I would say, well, at least for the black powder guys, don't even bother talking about the fact that it's rudely or not rudely displayed.
[50:25.000 --> 50:27.000]  That's not even the point. It's not a firearm.
[50:27.000 --> 50:34.000]  Now, they probably have agreed to be regulated, though, if they bought the black powder pistol from a federal firearms dealer with federal reserve notes.
[50:34.000 --> 50:37.000]  So in that event, then you just say it's not a firearm, right, Chris?
[50:37.000 --> 50:44.000]  Right. And not only that, but most of you will notice there's really no background check for a black powder.
[50:44.000 --> 50:48.000]  I can sell them in bulk to anybody who wants a black powder pistol.
[50:48.000 --> 50:56.000]  I don't have to do a background check on a black powder pistol because it's not a federal mandated firearm.
[50:56.000 --> 51:05.000]  And that's where you're ready to problems with felons and this and that, but technically it's not a gun.
[51:05.000 --> 51:10.000]  The thing that I like about Texas is that you can open and carry long guns.
[51:10.000 --> 51:14.000]  And with my Class 3 license, I can carry a machine gun.
[51:14.000 --> 51:22.000]  Well, then if I'm walking down the street and a police officer just wants to see my weapon, not only does he have to have probable cause to be searching my weapon,
[51:22.000 --> 51:31.000]  but he also has to have permission from the chief of police to look at my weapon as a dealer because it's an ATF item.
[51:31.000 --> 51:35.000]  It's a Class 3 item, and he's not certified to actually touch that weapon.
[51:35.000 --> 51:41.000]  Interesting. Interesting. All right. Well, folks, do you want to take some more calls?
[51:41.000 --> 51:42.000]  Sure.
[51:42.000 --> 51:47.000]  Okay. All right. We've got Alex in Texas is next with a question and comment on topic.
[51:47.000 --> 51:55.000]  Alex, thank you for calling in tonight. What is your question or comment for our guest, Chris Hall?
[51:55.000 --> 52:03.000]  Alex? Do we have Alex on the line?
[52:03.000 --> 52:09.000]  Okay. I think Alex may have stepped away for a moment. I hear something going on in the background.
[52:09.000 --> 52:12.000]  Alex, if you're out there listening, we will be right back with you.
[52:12.000 --> 52:17.000]  All right. We are going to go now briefly to Doug in Texas.
[52:17.000 --> 52:21.000]  Doug, what is your question or comment for Chris Hall, our guest?
[52:21.000 --> 52:34.000]  Yeah, Chris, you said several times about the rimfire, you know, like the rimfire cartridges, so-and-so.
[52:34.000 --> 52:42.000]  Is there any rimfire other than.22 long rifle and.22 magnum?
[52:42.000 --> 52:51.000]  Yes. The.17 HMR, they have a new one that just came out, which is a.17 also.
[52:51.000 --> 52:55.000]  It's a little hard to find, and it's based off of the Hilti gun cartridge.
[52:55.000 --> 53:02.000]  So it's a.22 caliber body, but it's been necked down to the.17 HMR, and it's extremely fast.
[53:02.000 --> 53:08.000]  It's a lot of fun to shoot. It's very accurate, about 3,000 feet per second out of the rifle.
[53:08.000 --> 53:12.000]  But there are quite a few different types of rimfire.
[53:12.000 --> 53:18.000]  There's actually even pinfire, which are 5mm, 5.5mm.
[53:18.000 --> 53:23.000]  Man, there are tons and tons of different kinds of rimfire, but you run into problems finding them,
[53:23.000 --> 53:27.000]  or you have to have somebody load them for you.
[53:27.000 --> 53:35.000]  No, I just wasn't aware of any. Do they still make the.22 short and.22 long?
[53:35.000 --> 53:40.000]  Yes, they do. Typically, you can especially order them.
[53:40.000 --> 53:46.000]  Wideners usually has those crazy calipers like that.
[53:46.000 --> 53:50.000]  The.22 short, you'll see a lot of CCI makes them. They're for pistols.
[53:50.000 --> 53:56.000]  And you'll find the CD BB caps, which are extremely thin.
[53:56.000 --> 54:03.000]  Basically, all they are is primer, but they'll fire the round out, and they're very subsonic.
[54:03.000 --> 54:12.000]  So if you do have a suppressed weapon, or if you are trying to keep it quiet, you can fire those kinds of rounds.
[54:12.000 --> 54:17.000]  They're good for about 20, 25 yards.
[54:17.000 --> 54:21.000]  Well, thank you. I'm pretty much enlightened by that,
[54:21.000 --> 54:28.000]  because I wasn't aware that there was anything other than.22 that was rimfire.
[54:28.000 --> 54:37.000]  Yeah, the.17 HMR is actually a really good bombarding round out to about 140 yards.
[54:37.000 --> 54:40.000]  That's like a small BB, right?
[54:40.000 --> 54:46.000]  It's the exact same size as a BB. It just comes out of the gun at about 2,000 feet per second.
[54:46.000 --> 54:52.000]  Right. As opposed to 1,100 or whatever.
[54:52.000 --> 54:53.000]  Correct.
[54:53.000 --> 55:03.000]  All right. Okay. Well, thanks for that. I feel like I'm well informed. Thank you, sir, for what you do.
[55:03.000 --> 55:04.000]  My pleasure.
[55:04.000 --> 55:06.000]  All right. Thanks, Doug.
[55:06.000 --> 55:11.000]  All right. We had Rob from New Mexico that had a question on topic, but he just dropped off the line.
[55:11.000 --> 55:15.000]  And apparently, Alex has still stepped away from his phone.
[55:15.000 --> 55:18.000]  We have a couple of other callers, but it doesn't look like they're on topic.
[55:18.000 --> 55:26.000]  So I'm going to, John, Mark, if you all want to just stay on hold for a little bit while we talk some more about these specific issues.
[55:26.000 --> 55:29.000]  We've got a couple minutes before we go to break.
[55:29.000 --> 55:36.000]  But one thing I wanted to mention, one thing I wanted to ask you about, Chris, regarding some events.
[55:36.000 --> 55:46.000]  Before we get into the analysis of the LAX false flag, I wanted to get your recap of the Alamo events,
[55:46.000 --> 55:48.000]  the Alamo open carry event.
[55:48.000 --> 55:53.000]  And there's also another open carry event coming up that you wanted to mention to our listeners.
[55:53.000 --> 55:56.000]  So first, let's talk about what happened at the Alamo.
[55:56.000 --> 56:04.000]  Well, the news says we had about 400 people show up open carrying weapons.
[56:04.000 --> 56:09.000]  When I was out there, there looked well more over 1,200. I've got lots of pictures of that.
[56:09.000 --> 56:15.000]  That was an amazing event to see all the patriots out there.
[56:15.000 --> 56:24.000]  There were a lot of gentlemen that came out and spoke and speech-to-speak irregulars, and it was amazing.
[56:24.000 --> 56:31.000]  But you've got to remember, long carry of rifles in Texas is legal, or open carry of long rifles in Texas is legal.
[56:31.000 --> 56:36.000]  So you're allowed to carry your rifle, your shotgun with you wherever you go.
[56:36.000 --> 56:42.000]  They have to have probable cause to search your ID. You don't have to give them your ID. You don't have to do nothing.
[56:42.000 --> 56:46.000]  I recommend you record it, because we've had some problems in a few places.
[56:46.000 --> 56:54.000]  But we need to get more people on carrying these weapons, because we want to get open carry legal in the state of Texas.
[56:54.000 --> 57:00.000]  Yeah, absolutely. And of course, the problems with the gentleman up here, I believe it was in Temple,
[57:00.000 --> 57:04.000]  where it ended up being national news.
[57:04.000 --> 57:09.000]  He was just walking down the road with his long arm, with his son,
[57:09.000 --> 57:14.000]  and it ended up being a takedown and arrest, and it was just a nightmare.
[57:14.000 --> 57:17.000]  And I don't know exactly what the state of his case is right now.
[57:17.000 --> 57:24.000]  But again, folks, anyone out there within the sound of my voice, I urge you, if you experience problems like this,
[57:24.000 --> 57:29.000]  no matter what it is, traffic tickets, if it has to do with firearms, open carry,
[57:29.000 --> 57:36.000]  any time you are charged with a crime that you did not commit, you not only need to fight it tooth and nail from a defensive standpoint,
[57:36.000 --> 57:42.000]  but you have got to go after these people with Randy's methods and to sue them.
[57:42.000 --> 57:46.000]  We've got to go on the offense, or else this problem isn't going to be solved.
[57:46.000 --> 57:54.000]  Now, Chris, we're about to head into break, but why don't you mention the open carry event that's coming up?
[57:54.000 --> 57:59.000]  Well, CJ Grisham is the gentleman, he's the founder of OCT,
[57:59.000 --> 58:04.000]  and he's the guy who's actually fighting the open carry charge for this rifle.
[58:04.000 --> 58:08.000]  They gave him a mistrial, and they're retrying him again.
[58:08.000 --> 58:12.000]  And as soon as we get done here, I'm going to be all over the internet telling them,
[58:12.000 --> 58:16.000]  hey, look, you need to bring up the definition of a firearm,
[58:16.000 --> 58:22.000]  as if we can't get this thing thrown out, or at least take it to a higher court, because the judge won't recluse themselves.
[58:22.000 --> 58:29.000]  Right, absolutely. All right, and then the event that's coming up, the open carry event coming up?
[58:29.000 --> 58:36.000]  It is December 14th, and they'll be at the Capitol in Austin.
[58:36.000 --> 58:38.000]  Okay, excellent. We'll talk about that some more on the other side.
[58:38.000 --> 58:39.000]  We're heading into break right now.
[58:39.000 --> 58:44.000]  Folks, we will be right back. If you've got a question on the topic, 512-646-1984.
[58:44.000 --> 58:46.000]  We'll be right back.
[58:50.000 --> 58:54.000]  The Bible remains the most popular book in the world,
[58:54.000 --> 58:58.000]  yet countless readers are frustrated because they struggle to understand it.
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[59:52.000 --> 01:00:03.000]  You're listening to the Logos Radio Network at logosradionetwork.com.
[01:00:03.000 --> 01:00:09.000]  You're listening to the Liberty Beat, your daily source for Liberty news and activist updates,
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[01:00:15.000 --> 01:00:17.000]  This is Justin Armand.
[01:00:17.000 --> 01:00:19.000]  And this is Jessica Armand.
[01:00:19.000 --> 01:00:24.000]  Here with your Liberty Beat for Thursday, November 14, 2013.
[01:00:24.000 --> 01:00:35.000]  Gold only today at $1,285, silver at $20.74, and bitcoin is soaring at $418.
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[01:00:59.000 --> 01:01:01.000]  And now the news.
[01:01:01.000 --> 01:01:07.000]  The new controversial Common Core curriculum has led nine Hillsboro, Oregon parents
[01:01:07.000 --> 01:01:10.000]  to pull their children from government-run schools.
[01:01:10.000 --> 01:01:14.000]  Instead, the parents are opting to homeschool for part of the day.
[01:01:14.000 --> 01:01:20.000]  KATUTV reports that the students who were once receiving A's in math
[01:01:20.000 --> 01:01:29.000]  have now seen their grades plummet to D's since the new curriculum was implemented.
[01:01:29.000 --> 01:01:33.000]  Democratic senators are calling for a ban on plastic guns.
[01:01:33.000 --> 01:01:39.000]  The senators say that the need for the ban comes as 3D printing technology expands,
[01:01:39.000 --> 01:01:45.000]  allowing production of such weapons.
[01:01:45.000 --> 01:01:50.000]  The Newtown School shooting continues to be used by anti-gun politicians
[01:01:50.000 --> 01:01:53.000]  as a way to limit Second Amendment freedom.
[01:01:53.000 --> 01:01:57.000]  Swampsot, Massachusetts selectman Barry Greenfield has proposed
[01:01:57.000 --> 01:02:02.000]  allowing warrantless searches of homes to see if guns are properly being stored.
[01:02:02.000 --> 01:02:08.000]  A public meeting on the issue is being scheduled.
[01:02:08.000 --> 01:02:13.000]  On Wednesday, WikiLeaks released the secret negotiated draft text
[01:02:13.000 --> 01:02:18.000]  for the entire Trans-Pacific Partnership intellectual property rights chapter.
[01:02:18.000 --> 01:02:24.000]  The TPP is one of the largest global treaties ever seen and equally controversial
[01:02:24.000 --> 01:02:29.000]  because of the secrecy surrounding the agreement that includes 12 different nations.
[01:02:29.000 --> 01:02:32.000]  Critics of the agreement have worried about the sovereignty
[01:02:32.000 --> 01:02:35.000]  of the individual nations signing on to the agreement.
[01:02:35.000 --> 01:02:39.000]  Fears that seem to be justified with the release of the draft text.
[01:02:39.000 --> 01:02:43.000]  Within the text are measures that would create super-national tribunals
[01:02:43.000 --> 01:02:49.000]  to which national courts are expected to abide by.
[01:02:49.000 --> 01:02:51.000]  You've been listening to the Liberty Beat.
[01:02:51.000 --> 01:03:05.000]  Remember, freeing your mind is freeing our world.
[01:03:51.000 --> 01:03:56.000]  Okay, folks, we are back.
[01:03:56.000 --> 01:04:00.000]  This is the rule of law, Randy Kelton and Deborah Stevens.
[01:04:00.000 --> 01:04:06.000]  We are here with Chris Hall and we are discussing the events that happened,
[01:04:06.000 --> 01:04:10.000]  well, the events that happened at the Alamo and the upcoming event,
[01:04:10.000 --> 01:04:13.000]  hopefully upcoming event at the Capitol.
[01:04:13.000 --> 01:04:17.000]  Well, as far as the event at the Alamo, from what I heard,
[01:04:17.000 --> 01:04:23.000]  people were open carrying firearms-style pistols.
[01:04:23.000 --> 01:04:28.000]  I'm not talking about black powder, but like your regular modern-day stuff
[01:04:28.000 --> 01:04:32.000]  and the cops were not harassing, so I thought that was a pretty good sign.
[01:04:32.000 --> 01:04:34.000]  They were long arms.
[01:04:34.000 --> 01:04:35.000]  Oh, they were just long?
[01:04:35.000 --> 01:04:39.000]  Okay, I heard reports that people were actually open carrying pistols as well.
[01:04:39.000 --> 01:04:42.000]  No, long arms only and black powder.
[01:04:42.000 --> 01:04:43.000]  Okay, all right.
[01:04:43.000 --> 01:04:49.000]  Well, speaking, okay, so now let's move on to the hopefully to come event
[01:04:49.000 --> 01:04:53.000]  at the Capitol, and I was asking Chris on the break if he knew what time
[01:04:53.000 --> 01:04:56.000]  it was going to happen on December 14th,
[01:04:56.000 --> 01:05:00.000]  and you were saying that it looked like it may not happen after all
[01:05:00.000 --> 01:05:04.000]  because of some trouble, because of some administrative rules.
[01:05:04.000 --> 01:05:07.000]  Can you please tell us about this?
[01:05:07.000 --> 01:05:13.000]  Right, the open carrying Texas people published a letter that they had gotten
[01:05:13.000 --> 01:05:17.000]  from the DPS that said that they were enforcing administrative rules
[01:05:17.000 --> 01:05:22.000]  that said that they got to determine the safe environment of the Capitol,
[01:05:22.000 --> 01:05:27.000]  and it also basically said that there was no weapons allowed at all
[01:05:27.000 --> 01:05:29.000]  on the Capitol grounds.
[01:05:29.000 --> 01:05:32.000]  Okay, so they don't know if they're actually going to go through with it
[01:05:32.000 --> 01:05:33.000]  or not then?
[01:05:33.000 --> 01:05:37.000]  Right, I haven't heard yay or nay.
[01:05:37.000 --> 01:05:40.000]  I'm hoping they do, but I haven't heard for sure.
[01:05:40.000 --> 01:05:42.000]  Okay, I've got some comments on this.
[01:05:42.000 --> 01:05:44.000]  I know Randy does as well.
[01:05:44.000 --> 01:05:49.000]  All right, number one, administrative rules is really only going to apply
[01:05:49.000 --> 01:05:51.000]  to employees of the Capitol,
[01:05:51.000 --> 01:05:58.000]  but if somebody decides that or if a group decides that they want to get a
[01:05:58.000 --> 01:06:03.000]  permit to have an event on the Capitol grounds,
[01:06:03.000 --> 01:06:06.000]  then those administrative rules are going to apply.
[01:06:06.000 --> 01:06:13.000]  All right, and so an event for a permitted event on the Capitol grounds
[01:06:13.000 --> 01:06:20.000]  will allow you to assemble in a certain area like up front and center
[01:06:20.000 --> 01:06:25.000]  on the Capitol grounds, on the steps, on the front walkway
[01:06:25.000 --> 01:06:29.000]  as you go up on the front steps as you're entering in,
[01:06:29.000 --> 01:06:35.000]  it'll let you get a sound system and use the electricity and all this and that.
[01:06:35.000 --> 01:06:40.000]  Okay, if it's an unpermitted event, you can't,
[01:06:40.000 --> 01:06:44.000]  or they won't let you have a sound system and plug in your electricity,
[01:06:44.000 --> 01:06:47.000]  and they may tell you...
[01:06:47.000 --> 01:06:49.000]  Hold on, there's some background noise in here, Chris.
[01:06:49.000 --> 01:06:51.000]  That was my bad, no, I'm sorry.
[01:06:51.000 --> 01:06:56.000]  Okay, they may tell you that you can't block the entrance and things like this,
[01:06:56.000 --> 01:07:01.000]  or you can't assemble on the sidewalk, you have to be on the grass,
[01:07:01.000 --> 01:07:06.000]  or you may have to assemble more towards the back area,
[01:07:06.000 --> 01:07:08.000]  towards the fence and things like this,
[01:07:08.000 --> 01:07:11.000]  but I can guarantee you right now from my experience,
[01:07:11.000 --> 01:07:15.000]  knowing what I know from being in the school of Harmon Taylor all this time,
[01:07:15.000 --> 01:07:18.000]  that if they apply for a permit,
[01:07:18.000 --> 01:07:23.000]  well, if they've already applied for a permit, it may already be too late, okay?
[01:07:23.000 --> 01:07:26.000]  But even if they apply for a permit,
[01:07:26.000 --> 01:07:30.000]  if they ask permission and go through the permitting process,
[01:07:30.000 --> 01:07:32.000]  whether or not they obtain the permit or not,
[01:07:32.000 --> 01:07:34.000]  if they've already submitted an application for a permit,
[01:07:34.000 --> 01:07:36.000]  they're probably already hosed, all right?
[01:07:36.000 --> 01:07:40.000]  They would have to have their event under maybe a different name
[01:07:40.000 --> 01:07:44.000]  or not call themselves the OCT or not call the event
[01:07:44.000 --> 01:07:46.000]  whatever it was that they were going to call it,
[01:07:46.000 --> 01:07:49.000]  but if they do anything with the permitting process whatsoever,
[01:07:49.000 --> 01:07:52.000]  they're going to be bound by those administrative rules, all right?
[01:07:52.000 --> 01:07:54.000]  So that's my answer to the question.
[01:07:54.000 --> 01:08:00.000]  Just go do it and don't necessarily try to do it on the steps or on the front sidewalk,
[01:08:00.000 --> 01:08:03.000]  but on the grass towards the corner,
[01:08:03.000 --> 01:08:09.000]  even though it won't be as visible of an event to passersby,
[01:08:09.000 --> 01:08:13.000]  that's going to be the main solution that I could offer right now.
[01:08:13.000 --> 01:08:16.000]  Randy, do you have other comments?
[01:08:16.000 --> 01:08:20.000]  Well, my comment was about the Capitol Police.
[01:08:20.000 --> 01:08:23.000]  They're not police.
[01:08:23.000 --> 01:08:26.000]  They're security guards.
[01:08:26.000 --> 01:08:29.000]  They are, there's nothing that,
[01:08:29.000 --> 01:08:33.000]  when I was there at the subcommittee hearing meeting
[01:08:33.000 --> 01:08:38.000]  when they wouldn't allow my videographer to videotape the meeting,
[01:08:38.000 --> 01:08:50.000]  I went to the Capitol Police to file a complaint against the head of the subcommittee chair,
[01:08:50.000 --> 01:08:55.000]  and in talking to them and the sergeant at arms,
[01:08:55.000 --> 01:09:01.000]  neither the sergeant at arms nor the Capitol Police
[01:09:01.000 --> 01:09:08.000]  are employed in the capacity of a peace officer.
[01:09:08.000 --> 01:09:15.000]  I'm sorry, Randy, do they have arresting authority then?
[01:09:15.000 --> 01:09:18.000]  Not that I can tell.
[01:09:18.000 --> 01:09:26.000]  You see, even if a DPS officer is a certified peace officer,
[01:09:26.000 --> 01:09:32.000]  on being hired by the DPS, he's hired as a police officer.
[01:09:32.000 --> 01:09:37.000]  In Texas, we have police officers and we have peace officers.
[01:09:37.000 --> 01:09:45.000]  A peace officer is someone employed for the purpose of enforcing the criminal laws.
[01:09:45.000 --> 01:09:49.000]  A police officer is a traffic cop.
[01:09:49.000 --> 01:09:52.000]  The administrative code that creates the Department of Public Safety
[01:09:52.000 --> 01:09:56.000]  specifically says that the Department of Public Safety
[01:09:56.000 --> 01:10:02.000]  may not enforce the criminal laws except at the request of
[01:10:02.000 --> 01:10:05.000]  and under the direction of local law enforcement.
[01:10:05.000 --> 01:10:07.000]  Well, and this is not even a criminal law.
[01:10:07.000 --> 01:10:09.000]  This is an administrative policy.
[01:10:09.000 --> 01:10:10.000]  Okay.
[01:10:10.000 --> 01:10:14.000]  Now, this goes to them being able to make an arrest,
[01:10:14.000 --> 01:10:17.000]  to act as a police officer.
[01:10:17.000 --> 01:10:20.000]  I'm sorry, act as a peace officer.
[01:10:20.000 --> 01:10:22.000]  They're traffic cops.
[01:10:22.000 --> 01:10:25.000]  That's the only authority they have, and I can't find anything
[01:10:25.000 --> 01:10:29.000]  that grants any added authority to the Capitol Police.
[01:10:29.000 --> 01:10:31.000]  They're just security guards.
[01:10:31.000 --> 01:10:35.000]  Well, again, and that whole security guard issue goes to
[01:10:35.000 --> 01:10:38.000]  whether or not you've agreed to the terms and conditions
[01:10:38.000 --> 01:10:40.000]  of the administrative policy.
[01:10:40.000 --> 01:10:43.000]  And so if you've agreed to the terms and conditions
[01:10:43.000 --> 01:10:49.000]  of the administrative policy of the administration of the Capitol,
[01:10:49.000 --> 01:10:52.000]  then you're probably subject to being hogtied
[01:10:52.000 --> 01:10:56.000]  and quote unquote arrested or whatever by these security guards.
[01:10:56.000 --> 01:10:57.000]  Hold on, hold on.
[01:10:57.000 --> 01:11:02.000]  This is not a private corporation.
[01:11:02.000 --> 01:11:06.000]  Now, the state may be incorporated, but it's not a private corporation.
[01:11:06.000 --> 01:11:08.000]  The building itself is not a private building.
[01:11:08.000 --> 01:11:10.000]  It's a public building.
[01:11:10.000 --> 01:11:15.000]  And their policy may not infringe upon my rights.
[01:11:15.000 --> 01:11:19.000]  Okay, but it does if you agree to it.
[01:11:19.000 --> 01:11:25.000]  If you agree to it by applying for a permit.
[01:11:25.000 --> 01:11:27.000]  You're missing the point.
[01:11:27.000 --> 01:11:28.000]  No, no, I'm not.
[01:11:28.000 --> 01:11:31.000]  If you agree to it by applying for a permit,
[01:11:31.000 --> 01:11:33.000]  you've just waived those rights.
[01:11:33.000 --> 01:11:35.000]  We got that part already.
[01:11:35.000 --> 01:11:36.000]  Okay, so I'm just saying.
[01:11:36.000 --> 01:11:40.000]  If I go down there and I didn't go down and apply for a permit
[01:11:40.000 --> 01:11:46.000]  and I'm carrying a pistol,
[01:11:46.000 --> 01:11:53.000]  they don't have the authority to deny me the right to carry the pistol.
[01:11:53.000 --> 01:11:54.000]  That's right.
[01:11:54.000 --> 01:11:56.000]  That is correct.
[01:11:56.000 --> 01:11:57.000]  That goes to the Constitution.
[01:11:57.000 --> 01:12:06.000]  Their administrative rules, if their administrative rules breach
[01:12:06.000 --> 01:12:12.000]  statutory or constitutional rights,
[01:12:12.000 --> 01:12:15.000]  they can wipe them behind with their administrative rules.
[01:12:15.000 --> 01:12:18.000]  That is absolutely correct as long as you didn't agree to it.
[01:12:18.000 --> 01:12:20.000]  And so the answer here really,
[01:12:20.000 --> 01:12:24.000]  and this is what Harmon calls the court press,
[01:12:24.000 --> 01:12:27.000]  where you have to press it all the way.
[01:12:27.000 --> 01:12:30.000]  You have to just go and do it.
[01:12:30.000 --> 01:12:32.000]  Do not ask for a permit.
[01:12:32.000 --> 01:12:33.000]  Do not apply for a permit.
[01:12:33.000 --> 01:12:36.000]  Don't have anything to do with their permitting process.
[01:12:36.000 --> 01:12:38.000]  Just go do it.
[01:12:38.000 --> 01:12:43.000]  And if they come over and tell you, you can't do this, you have to leave,
[01:12:43.000 --> 01:12:46.000]  you have to stand your ground and say, no, I'm not leaving.
[01:12:46.000 --> 01:12:49.000]  I did not agree to be regulated by your administrative policy.
[01:12:49.000 --> 01:12:52.000]  And then you have to go ahead and go through the meat grinder
[01:12:52.000 --> 01:12:54.000]  and get arrested and then challenge it,
[01:12:54.000 --> 01:12:58.000]  go through the defense and go through the lawsuit after the fact.
[01:12:58.000 --> 01:13:04.000]  But if you leave when they tell you to, well, then you just agree to be regulated by them.
[01:13:04.000 --> 01:13:05.000]  And so then you don't have a lawsuit.
[01:13:05.000 --> 01:13:11.000]  You can't go back after the fact and say, they infringed on my rights by telling me to leave
[01:13:11.000 --> 01:13:12.000]  and I have to leave.
[01:13:12.000 --> 01:13:15.000]  So I'm just saying this is the process.
[01:13:15.000 --> 01:13:17.000]  This is the process I have to go through.
[01:13:17.000 --> 01:13:19.000]  So if you're really going to stand up for your rights,
[01:13:19.000 --> 01:13:23.000]  you have to be willing to go through this meat grinder process first.
[01:13:23.000 --> 01:13:25.000]  Well, you don't have to be arrested.
[01:13:25.000 --> 01:13:26.000]  Well, okay.
[01:13:26.000 --> 01:13:30.000]  This is what I do on a regular basis when they tell me to leave.
[01:13:30.000 --> 01:13:36.000]  First thing I do is ask them, tell them that I see you're wearing a pistol there.
[01:13:36.000 --> 01:13:38.000]  Is that pistol loaded?
[01:13:38.000 --> 01:13:42.000]  And they'll always tell me, yes, it is.
[01:13:42.000 --> 01:13:47.000]  If I don't do what you want me to, are you fixing to pull that pistol on me?
[01:13:47.000 --> 01:13:51.000]  And they'll always say, not unless I have to.
[01:13:51.000 --> 01:13:53.000]  That's enough.
[01:13:53.000 --> 01:13:56.000]  I'm not agreeing to any contract.
[01:13:56.000 --> 01:13:59.000]  I've just had my life threatened.
[01:13:59.000 --> 01:14:11.000]  And the way I read 2202B2A, Texas Penal Code, that's a first degree felony.
[01:14:11.000 --> 01:14:14.000]  And that's all it takes to not be a peace officer anymore.
[01:14:14.000 --> 01:14:15.000]  No?
[01:14:15.000 --> 01:14:16.000]  Well, yes.
[01:14:16.000 --> 01:14:17.000]  It's not even that.
[01:14:17.000 --> 01:14:19.000]  So then you could call 911 on them.
[01:14:19.000 --> 01:14:23.000]  But I'm just saying that may or may not avoid an arrest.
[01:14:23.000 --> 01:14:26.000]  Well, now you have your claim.
[01:14:26.000 --> 01:14:28.000]  You don't have to be arrested.
[01:14:28.000 --> 01:14:32.000]  If they threaten, if you ask them, they'll use that pistol on you.
[01:14:32.000 --> 01:14:37.000]  If you don't do what they say and they say they're prepared to, that's enough.
[01:14:37.000 --> 01:14:40.000]  You don't have to risk your life to have a claim.
[01:14:40.000 --> 01:14:43.000]  The terroristic threat is sufficient.
[01:14:43.000 --> 01:14:46.000]  22.06 Texas Penal Code.
[01:14:46.000 --> 01:14:51.000]  If someone threatens you for the purpose of denying you access to a public building
[01:14:51.000 --> 01:14:57.000]  or interrupting your access to a public building while prominently displaying a deadly weapon,
[01:14:57.000 --> 01:15:01.000]  that's felony in the state of Texas.
[01:15:01.000 --> 01:15:02.000]  Awesome.
[01:15:02.000 --> 01:15:05.000]  And a public building includes the public grounds.
[01:15:05.000 --> 01:15:06.000]  All right.
[01:15:06.000 --> 01:15:08.000]  Well, I will definitely run that one past Harmon.
[01:15:08.000 --> 01:15:11.000]  And we'll see if he thinks that would work.
[01:15:11.000 --> 01:15:14.000]  It sounds feasible.
[01:15:14.000 --> 01:15:18.000]  So you're not agreeing to a contract.
[01:15:18.000 --> 01:15:21.000]  You're acting under duress.
[01:15:21.000 --> 01:15:27.000]  Texas has been arresting the gentleman from OTC for was criminal trespassing.
[01:15:27.000 --> 01:15:32.000]  And you can't criminally trespass on a public property.
[01:15:32.000 --> 01:15:40.000]  You can't criminal trespass at all unless you enter a property without permission and do damage.
[01:15:40.000 --> 01:15:43.000]  You can enter a property without permission.
[01:15:43.000 --> 01:15:47.000]  Then you can be given a trespass warning.
[01:15:47.000 --> 01:15:52.000]  Once you've been given a trespass warning, then if you reenter the property,
[01:15:52.000 --> 01:15:56.000]  then you can be charged with criminal trespass.
[01:15:56.000 --> 01:15:59.000]  The first time you can't be.
[01:15:59.000 --> 01:16:07.000]  And if you haven't done any damage, you can't be charged with it on the first entrance.
[01:16:07.000 --> 01:16:08.000]  All right.
[01:16:08.000 --> 01:16:12.000]  Well, we had Alex on the line, but then he ended up dropping off the line again.
[01:16:12.000 --> 01:16:14.000]  Unfortunately, I was just about to go to his call.
[01:16:14.000 --> 01:16:16.000]  Alex, if you're out there listening, please call back.
[01:16:16.000 --> 01:16:18.000]  We've been trying to get to you.
[01:16:18.000 --> 01:16:23.000]  But at any rate, I would hope that that would work.
[01:16:23.000 --> 01:16:28.000]  I'm definitely going to run this one by Harmon.
[01:16:28.000 --> 01:16:30.000]  You don't have to go.
[01:16:30.000 --> 01:16:36.000]  To ask somebody to get criminal charges against them and go through all that in a row,
[01:16:36.000 --> 01:16:39.000]  all you need to do is get a civil claim against them.
[01:16:39.000 --> 01:16:44.000]  Typically, he's always said that's the only way to really have a successful claim.
[01:16:44.000 --> 01:16:47.000]  He's been doing this for decades, but we'll see.
[01:16:47.000 --> 01:16:49.000]  I hope you're right.
[01:16:49.000 --> 01:16:50.000]  We'll find out more.
[01:16:50.000 --> 01:16:51.000]  All right.
[01:16:51.000 --> 01:16:55.000]  At any rate, we'll be back on the other side and we will discuss the LAX shooting.
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[01:19:29.000 --> 01:19:58.000]  Okay, we are back.
[01:19:58.000 --> 01:20:00.000]  This is a rule of law.
[01:20:00.000 --> 01:20:03.000]  We are going now to Chris Hall again.
[01:20:03.000 --> 01:20:10.000]  We want to discuss, one of the things I wanted to have him on tonight for was to discuss this LAX shooting.
[01:20:10.000 --> 01:20:17.000]  And there are so many things involved with what happened there that are just so wrong.
[01:20:17.000 --> 01:20:19.000]  I mean, just so wrong.
[01:20:19.000 --> 01:20:21.000]  Randy's got some comments on it too that we discussed.
[01:20:21.000 --> 01:20:24.000]  We're going to get into Randy's comments in a little while.
[01:20:24.000 --> 01:20:29.000]  I mean, look, folks, there were comments all over on some of these pictures.
[01:20:29.000 --> 01:20:32.000]  I just want to go to the medical issues first.
[01:20:32.000 --> 01:20:41.000]  All right, I saw multiple pictures of, I would just say, let's just say, alleged victims, all right,
[01:20:41.000 --> 01:20:47.000]  that looked like, you know, fake blood on their shirts in a wheelchair.
[01:20:47.000 --> 01:20:54.000]  This one particular one, a guy in a wheelchair looked like fake blood being pushed down the street
[01:20:54.000 --> 01:20:59.000]  by a police officer with another few cops around.
[01:20:59.000 --> 01:21:04.000]  Now, listen, folks, all right, my sister is an MD, all right.
[01:21:04.000 --> 01:21:08.000]  She's in the allopathic medical community.
[01:21:08.000 --> 01:21:11.000]  All right, I watched her go through medical school.
[01:21:11.000 --> 01:21:13.000]  She's had training, paramedic training.
[01:21:13.000 --> 01:21:16.000]  She's not a paramedic, but she's had that type of training.
[01:21:16.000 --> 01:21:23.000]  You don't take somebody who's been shot, especially somewhere in their torso,
[01:21:23.000 --> 01:21:26.000]  which is where the blood stain, the fake blood stain was on the shirt,
[01:21:26.000 --> 01:21:31.000]  you don't take somebody who's been shot in the torso, put them in a wheelchair,
[01:21:31.000 --> 01:21:36.000]  and push them down the street by an untrained medical professional.
[01:21:36.000 --> 01:21:42.000]  You don't move that person at all because the bullet could be lodged right next to their heart.
[01:21:42.000 --> 01:21:46.000]  If you move them, it could pierce their heart and kill them.
[01:21:46.000 --> 01:21:48.000]  It could be lodged next to the spine.
[01:21:48.000 --> 01:21:50.000]  It could paralyze them.
[01:21:50.000 --> 01:21:55.000]  If it moves anything, you could kill that person or paralyze them permanently.
[01:21:55.000 --> 01:21:58.000]  If you move them at all, you got to get, you don't do anything to them.
[01:21:58.000 --> 01:22:04.000]  You get medical trained personnel out there immediately to examine the situation
[01:22:04.000 --> 01:22:10.000]  and then determine what needs to be done in order to get that person moved.
[01:22:10.000 --> 01:22:17.000]  They have to be properly placed on a stretcher and either loaded into life flight or an ambulance.
[01:22:17.000 --> 01:22:22.000]  You don't put them in a wheelchair and roll them off down the street.
[01:22:22.000 --> 01:22:28.000]  Just that alone tells me there's some hanky-panky here.
[01:22:28.000 --> 01:22:34.000]  This is totally ridiculous, especially the angle of the photograph was from above
[01:22:34.000 --> 01:22:37.000]  to make it real dramatic and everything.
[01:22:37.000 --> 01:22:42.000]  This reminds me, this is reminiscent of what happened at the Boston bombing
[01:22:42.000 --> 01:22:50.000]  where they had video of somebody, an amputee that had their leg wrapped up
[01:22:50.000 --> 01:22:55.000]  with a fake prosthetic or something and all this was going on.
[01:22:55.000 --> 01:23:00.000]  There's video of it falling off and they were having to go back.
[01:23:00.000 --> 01:23:04.000]  They were having to wheel the guy back and pick it up and put it back on and act all.
[01:23:04.000 --> 01:23:07.000]  Come on, folks, come on.
[01:23:07.000 --> 01:23:09.000]  Where do they get these people?
[01:23:09.000 --> 01:23:11.000]  These are lousy actors.
[01:23:11.000 --> 01:23:17.000]  They would never make it in a cheesy B-roll Hollywood flick.
[01:23:17.000 --> 01:23:19.000]  This is just absolutely ridiculous.
[01:23:19.000 --> 01:23:26.000]  That's my take on that whole thing regarding just from the show, the fake medical issue.
[01:23:26.000 --> 01:23:32.000]  I'm sorry, I'm just speechless from seeing the picture and from what happened with the Boston bombing
[01:23:32.000 --> 01:23:35.000]  and the guy in the wheelchair and that whole trip too.
[01:23:35.000 --> 01:23:36.000]  Same kind of thing.
[01:23:36.000 --> 01:23:38.000]  How stupid do they think people are?
[01:23:38.000 --> 01:23:44.000]  Anyway, Chris, you wanted to break down an analysis here regarding some photographs you've seen
[01:23:44.000 --> 01:23:48.000]  and just from a forensic perspective about the guns.
[01:23:48.000 --> 01:23:50.000]  Please go ahead.
[01:23:50.000 --> 01:23:51.000]  That's the thing.
[01:23:51.000 --> 01:23:52.000]  I'm a gun guy.
[01:23:52.000 --> 01:23:53.000]  I'm a gun expert.
[01:23:53.000 --> 01:23:56.000]  That's what I do.
[01:23:56.000 --> 01:24:03.000]  I saw one picture when it first all started and the weapon looked like a.30 Carvey, an M1,
[01:24:03.000 --> 01:24:07.000]  old, old World War II weapon.
[01:24:07.000 --> 01:24:17.000]  Then I saw another picture that was showing a Stag Arms AR-15 with an EOTech sight and a forward grip,
[01:24:17.000 --> 01:24:22.000]  top of the line, M4, the type of stuff the SWAT team uses.
[01:24:22.000 --> 01:24:31.000]  Then I saw another picture and it showed an AR-15, didn't have the EOTech, and it had a rear flip-up sight.
[01:24:31.000 --> 01:24:34.000]  The sight was down.
[01:24:34.000 --> 01:24:40.000]  I just kept going, is there a picture of the real gun that this guy used?
[01:24:40.000 --> 01:24:50.000]  If there was a real picture of the gun that this guy used, did he know how to deploy the weapon correctly?
[01:24:50.000 --> 01:24:52.000]  I'm sorry.
[01:24:52.000 --> 01:25:00.000]  I don't see somebody who's been planning this kind of stunt for that long making those kinds of mistakes.
[01:25:00.000 --> 01:25:06.000]  Obviously, you're not going to be using close quarters combat and shooting your weapon from your hip,
[01:25:06.000 --> 01:25:09.000]  but you'd at least have your sights up.
[01:25:09.000 --> 01:25:14.000]  He's going from person to person asking, are you ATF?
[01:25:14.000 --> 01:25:15.000]  TSA.
[01:25:15.000 --> 01:25:16.000]  Are you TSA?
[01:25:16.000 --> 01:25:18.000]  Yeah, TSA.
[01:25:18.000 --> 01:25:20.000]  I mean, come on.
[01:25:20.000 --> 01:25:26.000]  There is too many problems with this particular story.
[01:25:26.000 --> 01:25:29.000]  I don't understand how...
[01:25:29.000 --> 01:25:31.000]  You notice it's gone.
[01:25:31.000 --> 01:25:33.000]  This whole thing just went, and it's gone.
[01:25:33.000 --> 01:25:36.000]  You don't hear a whole lot of commentary on it.
[01:25:36.000 --> 01:25:38.000]  You don't see a whole lot about it.
[01:25:38.000 --> 01:25:40.000]  It's just done and over with.
[01:25:40.000 --> 01:25:46.000]  I honestly don't think that the American people are looking at this going, well, it's just another shooting.
[01:25:46.000 --> 01:25:50.000]  It happens in a gun-free zone all the time.
[01:25:50.000 --> 01:25:52.000]  There is too many problems with this.
[01:25:52.000 --> 01:26:05.000]  Like you're saying with the medics, I have never seen a medic that would let the police department overrule their decision on how to care for that patient ever.
[01:26:05.000 --> 01:26:13.000]  That was always my take on it was that there was an awful lot of problems with what kind of weapon was used and how it was deployed.
[01:26:13.000 --> 01:26:20.000]  There's just too many conflicting stories on purpose.
[01:26:20.000 --> 01:26:22.000]  Yeah, it's absolutely ridiculous.
[01:26:22.000 --> 01:26:26.000]  I mean, the photographs and everything.
[01:26:26.000 --> 01:26:28.000]  I mean, Randy, you had some comments.
[01:26:28.000 --> 01:26:37.000]  You were discussing with me the other day about you were saying if this is a false flag, it sure was a pretty lousy one.
[01:26:37.000 --> 01:26:53.000]  It's coming from a psychological perspective because obviously the whole point of this was to get the American public to feel sorry for the TSA so that the public would support the TSA being armed.
[01:26:53.000 --> 01:26:57.000]  You had some comments about this.
[01:26:57.000 --> 01:27:01.000]  Can you please tell the listeners what you told me about that?
[01:27:01.000 --> 01:27:17.000]  Yeah, I flew to Phoenix right after this and what I went through TSA, these people had the appearance of really having been shaken.
[01:27:17.000 --> 01:27:19.000]  The TSA people.
[01:27:19.000 --> 01:27:32.000]  Yeah, and I've never been through TSA to where they were as nice and accommodating. These guys were all over themselves to be nice to everybody.
[01:27:32.000 --> 01:27:41.000]  And when I come out the backside, this one guy said, oh, yeah, we just had a talk by the director.
[01:27:41.000 --> 01:27:55.000]  He said, lots of big changes are coming. And there was something in his in the way he said that that it wasn't the kind of thing like, oh, yeah, we're going to take care of this.
[01:27:55.000 --> 01:27:57.000]  It wasn't that kind of talk at all.
[01:27:57.000 --> 01:28:01.000]  He was talking like they had really been chewed out.
[01:28:01.000 --> 01:28:11.000]  That's the feeling I got from talking at him that that the director had been all over these guys because these guys were there was no bravado here at all.
[01:28:11.000 --> 01:28:15.000]  These guys look like they were whip pups.
[01:28:15.000 --> 01:28:19.000]  So I was really surprised by that.
[01:28:19.000 --> 01:28:26.000]  You know, after the attack on them, I would have expected them to be more tense and more defensive.
[01:28:26.000 --> 01:28:37.000]  Well, I think that I think that this whip pup thing is probably just a temporary thing, because obviously the whole point of the false flag was to amp up the tyranny level.
[01:28:37.000 --> 01:28:40.000]  I'm not sure what that's what it was.
[01:28:40.000 --> 01:28:45.000]  This was about the stupidest false flag I've ever heard of.
[01:28:45.000 --> 01:28:49.000]  Yes. And remember what you told me about that?
[01:28:49.000 --> 01:28:59.000]  You were saying that if the point of the false flag is to get the American public to support the TSA being armed,
[01:28:59.000 --> 01:29:16.000]  then what they should have done is had a false flag shooter go in there and just start randomly shooting the passengers and then have some TSA guy go over and heroically wrestle the gun away from the shooter and say,
[01:29:16.000 --> 01:29:19.000]  see how what a dangerous job this is. We've got to arm them.
[01:29:19.000 --> 01:29:24.000]  But instead they make the TSA the targets of the shooting.
[01:29:24.000 --> 01:29:28.000]  And you were saying that's what that's just going to make a lot of people think, well, they got what they deserve.
[01:29:28.000 --> 01:29:32.000]  They finally they finally got what they deserve.
[01:29:32.000 --> 01:29:40.000]  So if it was a, you know, this false flag, you know, from a psychological perspective is a pretty stupid one, really.
[01:29:40.000 --> 01:29:43.000]  And that's probably why they dropped it so quickly.
[01:29:43.000 --> 01:29:51.000]  Because they don't want us here about hearing about somebody going in and specifically targeting them for being jerks.
[01:29:51.000 --> 01:29:54.000]  Right, right.
[01:29:54.000 --> 01:29:55.000]  Hang on. We'll be right back.
[01:29:55.000 --> 01:30:03.000]  Randy Kelton, Debra Stevens, Ruva Radio, we'll be right back.
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[01:33:02.000 --> 01:33:12.000]  You are listening to the Logos Radio Network, LogosRadioNetwork.com.
[01:33:12.000 --> 01:33:19.000]  Yeah, who you want to chip? Who you take me for? Freetole? Who you want to chip? Me no Freetole. You can't chip me.
[01:33:19.000 --> 01:33:26.000]  All of them chip me when the morning, chip me when the evening, put a chip in your body.
[01:33:26.000 --> 01:33:30.000]  And then when you go computer reading, you can't hide me from nobody.
[01:33:30.000 --> 01:33:36.000]  When you say, chip in your mom, chip in your daddy, chip in your grandpa and the granny.
[01:33:36.000 --> 01:33:41.000]  Chip in me, chip in your baby, chip in your family, whole family.
[01:33:41.000 --> 01:33:45.000]  Chip in your dog and the cat around me. Chip in the beef and you still go eaty.
[01:33:45.000 --> 01:33:50.000]  Chip in the fish, them all in the sea. Chip in the shark and the whale around me.
[01:33:50.000 --> 01:33:53.000]  You know, still mankind, you ain't chip crazy.
[01:33:53.000 --> 01:33:58.000]  Okay, folks, we are back. This is the rule of law, Randy Kelton and Deborah Stevens.
[01:33:58.000 --> 01:34:05.000]  We're here with our guest, Chris Hall. And, folks, please visit his Facebook page and give him some likes on Facebook.
[01:34:05.000 --> 01:34:09.000]  Why don't you give out your Facebook page for us again, Chris?
[01:34:09.000 --> 01:34:13.000]  I'm sorry, I don't know it off the top of my head.
[01:34:13.000 --> 01:34:17.000]  I think it's Zombie Killers LLC, I think is what it is.
[01:34:17.000 --> 01:34:18.000]  Yeah.
[01:34:18.000 --> 01:34:19.000]  Yeah, that's right.
[01:34:19.000 --> 01:34:24.000]  And it's funny, when I was at the Alamo in San Antonio, I had several people come up to me and say,
[01:34:24.000 --> 01:34:29.000]  man, I've heard you on the show, I've heard you on Logos Radio Network.
[01:34:29.000 --> 01:34:32.000]  Wow, it's really y'all. Yeah, pleasure to meet you.
[01:34:32.000 --> 01:34:34.000]  We gave them business cards and handed them out.
[01:34:34.000 --> 01:34:35.000]  We had a great time.
[01:34:35.000 --> 01:34:37.000]  That's great. That's great.
[01:34:37.000 --> 01:34:43.000]  Now, you know, just to finish up on this whole LA thing, what you were telling me on the break is that,
[01:34:43.000 --> 01:34:48.000]  well, tell me what you were telling me on the break about the stories, getting your story straight.
[01:34:48.000 --> 01:34:55.000]  Well, and that was the thing that really got to me the most was if you're going to be publishing a story,
[01:34:55.000 --> 01:34:58.000]  I mean, guys like me really want to know what was going on.
[01:34:58.000 --> 01:35:01.000]  Like Virginia Tech, it was mostly with handguns.
[01:35:01.000 --> 01:35:06.000]  The Sandy Hook shooter, I'm pretty sure it was mostly with handguns.
[01:35:06.000 --> 01:35:11.000]  I haven't got to see the actual report because they won't hand it out.
[01:35:11.000 --> 01:35:15.000]  And the thing was is they never got the gun straight.
[01:35:15.000 --> 01:35:18.000]  They never really show what the weapon was.
[01:35:18.000 --> 01:35:20.000]  They don't publish the serial number.
[01:35:20.000 --> 01:35:25.000]  They don't say nothing about who it was, who it was sold to, none of that kind of information.
[01:35:25.000 --> 01:35:31.000]  Those are the kind of things that if I'm trying to teach somebody how to avoid this kind of a situation,
[01:35:31.000 --> 01:35:34.000]  I need to see the footage. I need to know how it happened.
[01:35:34.000 --> 01:35:38.000]  I need to know who was involved. I need to know if they were capable of doing it.
[01:35:38.000 --> 01:35:40.000]  It's like the Sandy Hook thing.
[01:35:40.000 --> 01:35:42.000]  The guy weighs 120 pounds.
[01:35:42.000 --> 01:35:51.000]  And from the report, he ran in there carrying 230 pounds worth of ammo and guns and not kicking in the door.
[01:35:51.000 --> 01:35:54.000]  It's not going to happen. You can't do that.
[01:35:54.000 --> 01:35:58.000]  Yeah, and they won't release the video either.
[01:35:58.000 --> 01:36:04.000]  Right. And if they had the modern practices that the schools are supposed to have,
[01:36:04.000 --> 01:36:08.000]  there should have been a video of him hitting the buzzer trying to get in that door.
[01:36:08.000 --> 01:36:13.000]  And we should have at least, if they wanted to really ban AR-15s,
[01:36:13.000 --> 01:36:20.000]  all they had to do was show that kid coming in that door with an AR-15 and everybody who,
[01:36:20.000 --> 01:36:23.000]  even the firearms guys, would be like, well, okay,
[01:36:23.000 --> 01:36:29.000]  obviously we just made a killer out of somebody who couldn't possibly be a killer.
[01:36:29.000 --> 01:36:31.000]  We ought to get behind this.
[01:36:31.000 --> 01:36:33.000]  They're not showing that kind of information.
[01:36:33.000 --> 01:36:37.000]  And that is why I honestly don't think that he was able to do it.
[01:36:37.000 --> 01:36:40.000]  Of course not. Absolutely not.
[01:36:40.000 --> 01:36:44.000]  I mean, there's a reason they're not showing the video is because the video would not match up with the story.
[01:36:44.000 --> 01:36:47.000]  It's the same kind of thing about the video from the Pentagon.
[01:36:47.000 --> 01:36:50.000]  Why are they not showing the video from the Pentagon?
[01:36:50.000 --> 01:36:53.000]  It would put all the so-called conspiracy theories to rest.
[01:36:53.000 --> 01:36:59.000]  Well, there's a good reason why they're not showing the video from the Pentagon is because it ain't going to match up.
[01:36:59.000 --> 01:37:02.000]  It's because it was a bunker bustler. That's why.
[01:37:02.000 --> 01:37:06.000]  All right. So, I mean, that's just the basic fact of the matter.
[01:37:06.000 --> 01:37:15.000]  I mean, there is no way that a 20-something young man who, like Chris is saying,
[01:37:15.000 --> 01:37:24.000]  probably weighed about 120 pounds, could carry 230 pounds of ammo and guns and kick in the door.
[01:37:24.000 --> 01:37:27.000]  It's just not possible. I mean, you look at the...
[01:37:27.000 --> 01:37:33.000]  Look, he wouldn't have to kick in the door. He'd just lean on it.
[01:37:33.000 --> 01:37:38.000]  Yes, absolutely. And now listen, callers John and Mark, I'm sorry to keep putting you all off,
[01:37:38.000 --> 01:37:41.000]  but we do have a special guest calling in.
[01:37:41.000 --> 01:37:48.000]  We've got C.J. Grisham calling in, the gentleman we were discussing earlier with the open carry issue.
[01:37:48.000 --> 01:37:52.000]  C.J., thank you for calling in tonight, sir.
[01:37:52.000 --> 01:37:54.000]  Oh, thank you. Thanks for having me.
[01:37:54.000 --> 01:37:56.000]  Yes, we really appreciate it.
[01:37:56.000 --> 01:38:04.000]  So, we were discussing what happened with you and, you know, this possible upcoming event at the Capitol.
[01:38:04.000 --> 01:38:13.000]  And before we get into that, would you like to give us, if you can, if it's possible for you,
[01:38:13.000 --> 01:38:18.000]  could you give us an update on your case, on what's going on right now?
[01:38:18.000 --> 01:38:22.000]  Well, which case? I just got arrested again on Monday, so...
[01:38:22.000 --> 01:38:27.000]  Oh, no. Well, for the same thing, for open carry?
[01:38:27.000 --> 01:38:30.000]  No, no, this time I was openly carrying a toy gun.
[01:38:30.000 --> 01:38:34.000]  You got arrested for openly carrying a toy gun.
[01:38:34.000 --> 01:38:37.000]  Yes, at the Capitol.
[01:38:37.000 --> 01:38:39.000]  At the State Capitol here in Austin.
[01:38:39.000 --> 01:38:42.000]  Yeah, so I guess you want to hear about the first one.
[01:38:42.000 --> 01:38:47.000]  I was going to... Yeah, yeah, let's hear about the first one, but then I want to hear about this one, too.
[01:38:47.000 --> 01:38:54.000]  Okay, yeah, we just actually had a hearing today, and the hearing was to have the judge in my case recused.
[01:38:54.000 --> 01:39:01.000]  But typical in our nepotistic, or I guess incestuous, criminal justice system,
[01:39:01.000 --> 01:39:10.000]  the judge that was presiding denied our request in spite of the fact that the judge in my case called my wife and I Yockels,
[01:39:10.000 --> 01:39:15.000]  said if he had his way, he'd put us in jail to teach us how to be good parents.
[01:39:15.000 --> 01:39:17.000]  He also said he'd put my son in there with us.
[01:39:17.000 --> 01:39:26.000]  Just very biased in this entire event, but of course, even though the prosecutors had to admit that those things were said,
[01:39:26.000 --> 01:39:29.000]  the judge was not recused.
[01:39:29.000 --> 01:39:33.000]  So my trial, the second trial, begins on Monday.
[01:39:33.000 --> 01:39:40.000]  The first one ended in a hung jury, and that wasn't good enough for the prosecutors, so they're going to retry it again on Monday.
[01:39:40.000 --> 01:39:48.000]  And tomorrow we are asking for a change of venue as well as a continuance, because we still don't have the court records from the first trial,
[01:39:48.000 --> 01:39:51.000]  and they want to go and try it again already.
[01:39:51.000 --> 01:39:59.000]  So we'll find out tomorrow whether or not it's going to happen on Monday, but until we do right now, the retrial is on Monday.
[01:39:59.000 --> 01:40:00.000]  Oh, my goodness.
[01:40:00.000 --> 01:40:04.000]  He needs to hear about the definition of a firearm, because that could save his butt on this one.
[01:40:04.000 --> 01:40:07.000]  Yeah, why don't you tell them about that, Chris?
[01:40:07.000 --> 01:40:19.000]  The definition of a firearm, because it doesn't go with the 1934 Act and the—I'm sorry.
[01:40:19.000 --> 01:40:24.000]  26 U.S.C. 5845.
[01:40:24.000 --> 01:40:26.000]  Awesome, Randy. Thank you.
[01:40:26.000 --> 01:40:33.000]  Basically, it says that your pistol and your rifle weren't actually a firearm, because they're only calling a firearm the Class III weapon.
[01:40:33.000 --> 01:40:39.000]  So since you weren't carrying a fully automatic or select fire M4, it's not a firearm.
[01:40:39.000 --> 01:40:45.000]  And get your guide on that, and I guarantee you this will be thrown out in a heartbeat,
[01:40:45.000 --> 01:40:50.000]  and you'll establish a whole precedent in Texas on what open carry is.
[01:40:50.000 --> 01:40:51.000]  Yeah.
[01:40:51.000 --> 01:41:00.000]  In fact, there was a caller that called in earlier tonight about this, discussing another gentleman's case that is fighting this exact issue,
[01:41:00.000 --> 01:41:06.000]  saying that, well, basically what he had is not a firearm under the definition of firearm.
[01:41:06.000 --> 01:41:12.000]  And what I can do for you, CJ, is I can—when I do the archive, I can go back and take a clip.
[01:41:12.000 --> 01:41:15.000]  I'll just—you can listen to the whole show if you like, but if you like,
[01:41:15.000 --> 01:41:21.000]  you can take a clip of just that part of the show where that caller called in discussing that so that your attorney can read it.
[01:41:21.000 --> 01:41:23.000]  He was talking about Rod Glass.
[01:41:23.000 --> 01:41:24.000]  Okay.
[01:41:24.000 --> 01:41:31.000]  Rod Glass is really well known as a legal researcher, and he's fighting this in D.C.,
[01:41:31.000 --> 01:41:34.000]  and he's taking him on on exactly those issues.
[01:41:34.000 --> 01:41:37.000]  So you might want to look at what he's doing.
[01:41:37.000 --> 01:41:41.000]  What was that again, 26 USC?
[01:41:41.000 --> 01:41:45.000]  26 USC 5845.
[01:41:45.000 --> 01:41:46.000]  Right, and what—
[01:41:46.000 --> 01:41:51.000]  The 1934 Firearms Act.
[01:41:51.000 --> 01:41:52.000]  Got it.
[01:41:52.000 --> 01:41:59.000]  Right, and the current—the Title 18 under the definition in that section,
[01:41:59.000 --> 01:42:10.000]  it says that notwithstanding, nothing in this section is allowed to conflict with the definitions in the 1934 Firearms Act.
[01:42:10.000 --> 01:42:17.000]  And so you look at the definitions in the 1934 Firearms Act, and there you have it.
[01:42:17.000 --> 01:42:19.000]  Yeah, he said look in the footnotes.
[01:42:19.000 --> 01:42:23.000]  He said look in the footnotes, that's right, that's right.
[01:42:23.000 --> 01:42:24.000]  Yeah, well, that's interesting.
[01:42:24.000 --> 01:42:29.000]  I mean, the weird thing about my case, though, is I'm not actually charged with a firearms-related case,
[01:42:29.000 --> 01:42:38.000]  at least not in the first arrest, because what I'm charged with is interfering with a public official's duties.
[01:42:38.000 --> 01:42:39.000]  Oh, boy.
[01:42:39.000 --> 01:42:43.000]  Okay, here's—I was charged with that.
[01:42:43.000 --> 01:42:45.000]  You need to look that up.
[01:42:45.000 --> 01:42:51.000]  Did you physically block a police officer?
[01:42:51.000 --> 01:42:53.000]  Did you touch him?
[01:42:53.000 --> 01:42:54.000]  No, he—
[01:42:54.000 --> 01:43:00.000]  How did they—okay, you cannot interfere with a public official verbally.
[01:43:00.000 --> 01:43:03.000]  You have to interfere physically.
[01:43:03.000 --> 01:43:12.000]  Well, he tried to take my rifle from me without announcing it, and my immediate reaction was to grab it and keep him from taking it.
[01:43:12.000 --> 01:43:16.000]  Now, I'm a combat veteran. I'd just gotten back a few months prior to this incident happening,
[01:43:16.000 --> 01:43:19.000]  and you don't just grab a guy's weapon, whether he's a combat veteran or not.
[01:43:19.000 --> 01:43:23.000]  You don't just go up and take someone's gun without saying I'm here investigating something,
[01:43:23.000 --> 01:43:28.000]  or I'm going to disarm you, or can you put it down for my safety, your safety, whatever.
[01:43:28.000 --> 01:43:31.000]  You don't just grab someone's gun without announcing it.
[01:43:31.000 --> 01:43:38.000]  Okay, so that's the point of contention, the fact that he tried to grab your gun, and you wouldn't let him, you grabbed it back.
[01:43:38.000 --> 01:43:43.000]  That's what they're saying is the interfering with the public servant's duties.
[01:43:43.000 --> 01:43:44.000]  Correct.
[01:43:44.000 --> 01:43:50.000]  Okay, okay, listen, can you hold on please to the other side of the break? We're about to go to break here, CJ.
[01:43:50.000 --> 01:43:51.000]  Yes, I can.
[01:43:51.000 --> 01:43:54.000]  Okay, great. All right, folks, we'll be right back. We've got CJ Grisham with us.
[01:43:54.000 --> 01:44:00.000]  This is the rule of law, Randy Kelton and Deborah Stevens.
[01:44:00.000 --> 01:44:04.000]  Do you feel tired when talking about important topics like money and politics?
[01:44:04.000 --> 01:44:05.000]  Boring!
[01:44:05.000 --> 01:44:08.000]  I'm used by words like the Constitution or the Federal Reserve.
[01:44:08.000 --> 01:44:09.000]  What?
[01:44:09.000 --> 01:44:13.000]  If so, you may be diagnosed with the deadliest disease known today, stupidity.
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[01:46:23.000 --> 01:46:27.000]  Some things in this world I will never understand.
[01:46:27.000 --> 01:46:31.000]  Some things I realize fully.
[01:46:31.000 --> 01:46:36.000]  Somebody's on a police, a policeman.
[01:46:36.000 --> 01:46:40.000]  Somebody's on a police, a police.
[01:46:40.000 --> 01:46:45.000]  There's always a room at the top of the hill.
[01:46:45.000 --> 01:46:49.000]  I hear through the grapevine and it's lonely left too.
[01:46:49.000 --> 01:46:52.000]  They're wishing it was more than opposition.
[01:47:20.000 --> 01:47:23.000]  Because you wouldn't let them grab the gun.
[01:47:23.000 --> 01:47:25.000]  And so Randy wants to address this.
[01:47:25.000 --> 01:47:39.000]  And my question here is, is there a duty or requirement for the public servant to say anything to somebody or to warn them or to ask them to hand over the firearm,
[01:47:39.000 --> 01:47:48.000]  or if you want to call it a firearm, because it technically, as it turns out, it's not a firearm, but to hand over the weapon before just reaching out and grabbing it.
[01:47:48.000 --> 01:47:49.000]  That's the real question.
[01:47:49.000 --> 01:47:52.000]  Does he have a duty to inform you first?
[01:47:52.000 --> 01:47:55.000]  So, Randy, do you want to address these issues, please?
[01:47:55.000 --> 01:47:57.000]  Yes.
[01:47:57.000 --> 01:48:08.000]  What I don't understand is where the officer had authority to interfere with your right to open carry.
[01:48:08.000 --> 01:48:10.000]  Apparently, this was a long gun.
[01:48:10.000 --> 01:48:11.000]  Yes, sir.
[01:48:11.000 --> 01:48:14.000]  It was an AR-15 and we were out in the middle of the country.
[01:48:14.000 --> 01:48:22.000]  So what were you charged with that gave the officer reason to even talk to you?
[01:48:22.000 --> 01:48:24.000]  What was his probable cause?
[01:48:24.000 --> 01:48:30.000]  His only probable cause was a phone call of somebody walking down the road with a firearm.
[01:48:30.000 --> 01:48:33.000]  And he saw you walking down the road with a firearm.
[01:48:33.000 --> 01:48:34.000]  Correct.
[01:48:34.000 --> 01:48:41.000]  Has he ever responded to a phone call of someone drinking a Dr. Pepper?
[01:48:41.000 --> 01:48:45.000]  Has he ever pulled anybody over for doing the speed limit?
[01:48:45.000 --> 01:48:47.000]  Yes.
[01:48:47.000 --> 01:48:49.000]  This is the question.
[01:48:49.000 --> 01:48:56.000]  You cannot interfere with a public servant who is acting in excess of his authority.
[01:48:56.000 --> 01:49:02.000]  If a public servant acting under the color, meaning pretense of his authority,
[01:49:02.000 --> 01:49:08.000]  exerts or purports to exert an authority he does not expressly have
[01:49:08.000 --> 01:49:12.000]  and in the process now sits in full free access to enjoyment right.
[01:49:12.000 --> 01:49:15.000]  That's a class A misdemeanor in Texas.
[01:49:15.000 --> 01:49:18.000]  Why was he trying to take the gun from you?
[01:49:18.000 --> 01:49:20.000]  Well, here's how the conversation went.
[01:49:20.000 --> 01:49:22.000]  He walked right up to me.
[01:49:22.000 --> 01:49:26.000]  He initially just picked up my gun to look at it, didn't just say a word.
[01:49:26.000 --> 01:49:27.000]  He says, what are you guys doing?
[01:49:27.000 --> 01:49:28.000]  I said, we're hiking.
[01:49:28.000 --> 01:49:32.000]  And then he looks at my gun and he says, any reason why you've got this?
[01:49:32.000 --> 01:49:37.000]  And I looked at him kind of confusingly and I said, just like this, because I can?
[01:49:37.000 --> 01:49:42.000]  And when I said that, when I said, because I can, he's like, oh, okay.
[01:49:42.000 --> 01:49:43.000]  And then he starts to take it off of me.
[01:49:43.000 --> 01:49:47.000]  At that point, I put my arm around the barrel in the bus dock and I said, hey, man, very calmly.
[01:49:47.000 --> 01:49:49.000]  Hey, man, don't try and disarm me.
[01:49:49.000 --> 01:49:54.000]  At that point, he slams his boot down on my foot, pulls his pistol,
[01:49:54.000 --> 01:49:58.000]  sticks it to the back of my head and throws me into the car, into the hood of the car.
[01:49:58.000 --> 01:49:59.000]  Okay.
[01:49:59.000 --> 01:50:01.000]  Have you charged him with aggravated assault?
[01:50:01.000 --> 01:50:03.000]  We are going to sue.
[01:50:03.000 --> 01:50:05.000]  I'm waiting for this criminal case to be...
[01:50:05.000 --> 01:50:09.000]  No, no, no, no, this is criminal, aggravated assault.
[01:50:09.000 --> 01:50:12.000]  He's wearing, he's prominently displaying a deadly weapon.
[01:50:12.000 --> 01:50:16.000]  Well, here's, let me throw this twist at you.
[01:50:16.000 --> 01:50:23.000]  When we went, before our first trial, we filed a motion to suppress the arrest because it was an illegal arrest.
[01:50:23.000 --> 01:50:26.000]  What they came back with, and you're going to laugh at this,
[01:50:26.000 --> 01:50:30.000]  but I swear this is exactly what the prosecutor said,
[01:50:30.000 --> 01:50:36.000]  that because I was walking down the wrong side of the road, they had probable cause to disarm and arrest me.
[01:50:36.000 --> 01:50:42.000]  Apparently in Texas, there is a statute in the transportation code that if there's not a sidewalk,
[01:50:42.000 --> 01:50:46.000]  you are to walk down the left side of a road, not the right side.
[01:50:46.000 --> 01:50:49.000]  Okay, but you weren't in transportation though.
[01:50:49.000 --> 01:50:57.000]  Transportation means that you are literally transporting goods or passengers from point A to point B for hire,
[01:50:57.000 --> 01:51:02.000]  and so you weren't in transportation at all, so that doesn't apply to you.
[01:51:02.000 --> 01:51:07.000]  Wait a minute. Where is this law? I have never seen such a thing.
[01:51:07.000 --> 01:51:11.000]  It is in Texas transportation code section.
[01:51:11.000 --> 01:51:13.000]  Okay, okay, it is in transportation.
[01:51:13.000 --> 01:51:15.000]  That's what I'm saying. You weren't in transportation,
[01:51:15.000 --> 01:51:21.000]  so the defense for that is that there was no probable cause because you weren't in transportation.
[01:51:21.000 --> 01:51:26.000]  You were not a pedestrian. Don't let them call you a pedestrian.
[01:51:26.000 --> 01:51:30.000]  You were not in transportation, period. You were traveling. That's it.
[01:51:30.000 --> 01:51:35.000]  Transportation code only applies to people who are in transportation.
[01:51:35.000 --> 01:51:43.000]  That means you're getting paid to transport something or someone from point A to point B, so they didn't have any probable cause.
[01:51:43.000 --> 01:51:46.000]  Yeah, absolutely, and that's what I use to fight my traffic tickets as well.
[01:51:46.000 --> 01:51:48.000]  Right, right.
[01:51:48.000 --> 01:51:55.000]  You need to file aggravated assault, first degree felony aggravated assault against the officer.
[01:51:55.000 --> 01:51:57.000]  Okay.
[01:51:57.000 --> 01:52:01.000]  Here's how it goes. Write this down.
[01:52:01.000 --> 01:52:02.000]  Pardon me?
[01:52:02.000 --> 01:52:04.000]  Go ahead.
[01:52:04.000 --> 01:52:10.000]  2202 B2A.
[01:52:10.000 --> 01:52:22.000]  Under 2202, if a public official acting under color of his authority commits simple assault as defined in 2201,
[01:52:22.000 --> 01:52:32.000]  simple assault is offensive touching, and does so while acting under the color or pretense of an official capacity.
[01:52:32.000 --> 01:52:35.000]  He commits a second degree felony.
[01:52:35.000 --> 01:52:47.000]  However, if he commits that act while prominently displaying a deadly weapon, that's a first degree felony, 20 to life.
[01:52:47.000 --> 01:52:53.000]  When that police officer straps on that pistol, that is a big deal.
[01:52:53.000 --> 01:52:57.000]  You're a combat veteran. You know that. I'm a combat veteran.
[01:52:57.000 --> 01:53:03.000]  When I see somebody with a loaded pistol, man, I've been on the sharp end of those things.
[01:53:03.000 --> 01:53:07.000]  That is really, really a big deal.
[01:53:07.000 --> 01:53:12.000]  Now, they carry that thing all the time, and they forget what a big deal it is.
[01:53:12.000 --> 01:53:17.000]  Until the guy's been in a gunfight or two, and that changes his whole perspective.
[01:53:17.000 --> 01:53:22.000]  But I take that real serious, and the legislature took that real serious.
[01:53:22.000 --> 01:53:28.000]  Well, see, and I don't understand why it's probable cause to disarm somebody anyway.
[01:53:28.000 --> 01:53:34.000]  Even let's just assuming you were in transportation, I don't see how that's probable cause to disarm you,
[01:53:34.000 --> 01:53:36.000]  just because you're walking down the wrong side of the street.
[01:53:36.000 --> 01:53:43.000]  The whole system here in this county has been very corrupt.
[01:53:43.000 --> 01:53:53.000]  When you pull over somebody for speeding or for whatever, you don't go and take all their guns out of their car.
[01:53:53.000 --> 01:53:54.000]  No.
[01:53:54.000 --> 01:53:56.000]  That has nothing to do with the crime.
[01:53:56.000 --> 01:54:01.000]  All right, and the other issue is, and I don't know if Randy can answer this,
[01:54:01.000 --> 01:54:08.000]  does a public servant have the duty to tell you, I'm going to take your weapon now,
[01:54:08.000 --> 01:54:12.000]  or ask you before just reaching out and grabbing it?
[01:54:12.000 --> 01:54:14.000]  I don't know the answer to that question yet.
[01:54:14.000 --> 01:54:18.000]  That is a good question.
[01:54:18.000 --> 01:54:20.000]  Okay, so we don't know the answer to that question yet.
[01:54:20.000 --> 01:54:22.000]  All right, but we've only got a few minutes left.
[01:54:22.000 --> 01:54:26.000]  CJ, we're going to have to get you on another show to discuss this further.
[01:54:26.000 --> 01:54:30.000]  But before the show ends, because we've got about three and a half minutes left,
[01:54:30.000 --> 01:54:32.000]  give us a rundown about the toy gun.
[01:54:32.000 --> 01:54:33.000]  Are they saying it's a firearm?
[01:54:33.000 --> 01:54:34.000]  What is going on?
[01:54:34.000 --> 01:54:35.000]  This is ridiculous.
[01:54:35.000 --> 01:54:36.000]  A toy gun.
[01:54:36.000 --> 01:54:42.000]  Well, yeah, what Capitol DPS are doing is they've been trying to order us under the administrative code
[01:54:42.000 --> 01:54:47.000]  to leave the Capitol grounds because we have black powder pistols, which are not considered firearms.
[01:54:47.000 --> 01:54:51.000]  That day I took a replica toy, a non-firing version.
[01:54:51.000 --> 01:54:55.000]  It's a one-piece, and I had it in a drop leg holster.
[01:54:55.000 --> 01:54:56.000]  They asked me to leave.
[01:54:56.000 --> 01:54:57.000]  I said, under what authority?
[01:54:57.000 --> 01:55:00.000]  And they said, sir, you need to leave and take your weapons with you.
[01:55:00.000 --> 01:55:03.000]  I said, I don't have any weapons under what authority you're ordering me to leave.
[01:55:03.000 --> 01:55:05.000]  At that point, he says you're under arrest.
[01:55:05.000 --> 01:55:07.000]  And at that point, I said, for what?
[01:55:07.000 --> 01:55:10.000]  And he tried to put my hands behind my back, and I wouldn't let him.
[01:55:10.000 --> 01:55:12.000]  And then they got me for resisting.
[01:55:12.000 --> 01:55:14.000]  Okay, hold on.
[01:55:14.000 --> 01:55:16.000]  This is Capitol Police.
[01:55:16.000 --> 01:55:17.000]  Yes.
[01:55:17.000 --> 01:55:19.000]  They're not police.
[01:55:19.000 --> 01:55:22.000]  Well, Texas Capitol, they're DPS troopers.
[01:55:22.000 --> 01:55:24.000]  No, no, DPS are traffic cops.
[01:55:24.000 --> 01:55:26.000]  Yeah, we talked about this earlier.
[01:55:26.000 --> 01:55:33.000]  I addressed this with them there when I was trying to get them to arrest the head of a subcommittee.
[01:55:33.000 --> 01:55:43.000]  I asked them, are you employed in this capacity as a peace officer?
[01:55:43.000 --> 01:55:48.000]  The captain couldn't tell me, the lieutenant couldn't tell me, and the sergeant couldn't tell me,
[01:55:48.000 --> 01:55:52.000]  and the sergeant at arms for the Capitol building couldn't tell me.
[01:55:52.000 --> 01:56:00.000]  They are security guards, Department of Public Safety personnel are forbidden to enforce the criminal laws
[01:56:00.000 --> 01:56:07.000]  except at the direction, at the request of and under direction of local law enforcement.
[01:56:07.000 --> 01:56:10.000]  You might take that one too.
[01:56:10.000 --> 01:56:11.000]  That's an administrative code.
[01:56:11.000 --> 01:56:12.000]  Talk to Eddie Craig.
[01:56:12.000 --> 01:56:14.000]  He'll show you exactly where that's at.
[01:56:14.000 --> 01:56:15.000]  All right.
[01:56:15.000 --> 01:56:18.000]  You just got arrested by a mall cop.
[01:56:18.000 --> 01:56:20.000]  Did they take you to jail?
[01:56:20.000 --> 01:56:21.000]  They did.
[01:56:21.000 --> 01:56:23.000]  It's been a beautiful eight hours there.
[01:56:23.000 --> 01:56:24.000]  Okay.
[01:56:24.000 --> 01:56:26.000]  They can't transport.
[01:56:26.000 --> 01:56:28.000]  They're security guards.
[01:56:28.000 --> 01:56:32.000]  They have to call local law enforcement.
[01:56:32.000 --> 01:56:36.000]  Now you have a good shot at them.
[01:56:36.000 --> 01:56:42.000]  You take an issue to them that they're not going to want to get adjudicated against them.
[01:56:42.000 --> 01:56:45.000]  You go in there saying, these guys are traffic cops.
[01:56:45.000 --> 01:56:51.000]  They are police officers, not peace officers.
[01:56:51.000 --> 01:56:57.000]  In Texas, a peace officer is an officer authorized to enforce the criminal laws.
[01:56:57.000 --> 01:57:02.000]  A police officer is a traffic cop.
[01:57:02.000 --> 01:57:06.000]  That's all he can do is a police officer.
[01:57:06.000 --> 01:57:10.000]  Here, the Capitol has hired them as security guards,
[01:57:10.000 --> 01:57:14.000]  but they're still not hired in the capacity of peace officers.
[01:57:14.000 --> 01:57:17.000]  Yeah, because they work under the state preservation board.
[01:57:17.000 --> 01:57:22.000]  You challenge that, then you tie their hands.
[01:57:22.000 --> 01:57:25.000]  They are not going to want that to happen.
[01:57:25.000 --> 01:57:26.000]  Yeah.
[01:57:26.000 --> 01:57:33.000]  By the way, a caller just called in wanting to pass along a case that may help you with your other case.
[01:57:33.000 --> 01:57:36.000]  It's Barry V. U.S.
[01:57:36.000 --> 01:57:37.000]  Oh, yes.
[01:57:37.000 --> 01:57:38.000]  Yeah, we're tracking that one.
[01:57:38.000 --> 01:57:39.000]  Okay.
[01:57:39.000 --> 01:57:40.000]  Okay.
[01:57:40.000 --> 01:57:41.000]  That's what I thought.
[01:57:41.000 --> 01:57:42.000]  I figured you were.
[01:57:42.000 --> 01:57:47.000]  Again, this judge is completely against this.
[01:57:47.000 --> 01:57:51.000]  Well, remember, you're not going to win at the trial level.
[01:57:51.000 --> 01:57:52.000]  You never will.
[01:57:52.000 --> 01:57:53.000]  Right.
[01:57:53.000 --> 01:57:58.000]  You can only use the trial level to lay down the record, get in all your objections,
[01:57:58.000 --> 01:58:01.000]  try to prevent evidence from being entered against you,
[01:58:01.000 --> 01:58:03.000]  get in all the evidence you want to get entered.
[01:58:03.000 --> 01:58:05.000]  You're going to win on appeal.
[01:58:05.000 --> 01:58:07.000]  Listen, we are at the end of the show.
[01:58:07.000 --> 01:58:11.000]  I wish we could have you on longer, but we definitely want to have you on again
[01:58:11.000 --> 01:58:12.000]  and discuss the issues some more.
[01:58:12.000 --> 01:58:13.000]  Yeah, absolutely.
[01:58:13.000 --> 01:58:14.000]  All right, excellent.
[01:58:14.000 --> 01:58:19.000]  All right, folks, this has been the rule of law, Randy Kelton and Deborah Stevens.
[01:58:19.000 --> 01:58:22.000]  Randy will be back tomorrow night with Steve Skidmore and Joe Escobel
[01:58:22.000 --> 01:58:26.000]  for the show on mortgages, and we will talk to y'all.
[01:58:26.000 --> 01:58:28.000]  I will talk to y'all next week.
[01:58:28.000 --> 01:58:30.000]  Have a very blessed evening.
[01:58:30.000 --> 01:58:50.000]  Music.
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